VTR1000 FireStorm

[scroter]

if i woke up with an inny instead of an outty then i might be able to enjoy the VTR but alas my balls are just to big and i need a bike to match and sorry guys the VTR is just too boring for me. Now th TL thats a different story. It has attitude you know the one that says dont phuck with me.

Admittedly the VTR is a good easy bike to ride and would suit a lot of people. a real do anything go anywhere kind of ride. and the TL well the motor makes up for its absolutley shite suspenders. these are two very differnt bikes but have been compared so many times. ones a sports tourer the others a sports bike. They also atrract different riders. both good bikes sales prove it.

Most sales 1997 - TL1000S
Most sales 1998 - VTR1000

[vifferman]

if i woke up with an inny instead of an outty then i might be able to enjoy the VTR but alas my balls are just to big and i need a bike to match

So, Mr Scroter - do you have a specially modified seat to accommodate your danglers, or do you just sit side-saddle?

[simo]

I tested a new VTR 1000 in April this year, and it just didn't have the getup and go that the TL1000 (1999) had, the TL sounded awesome, handles OK, needs the Ohlins conversion though, some braided stoppy tubes and some decent pads would compliment the setup.

[vifferman]

I tested a new VTR 1000 in April this year, and it just didn't have the getup and go that the TL1000 (1999) had, the TL sounded awesome, handles OK, needs the Ohlins conversion though, some braided stoppy tubes and some decent pads would compliment the setup.

You'll have to give me a ride sometime, Simo.
Or perhaps not... maybe that would make me sad.. or envious... or just disgruntled....

[simo]

I dyno'ed the TL and it turned up 107BHP at the back wheel, but the VTR is claimed at 102, it seemed more like 90-95, it was that different in useable power 3000-8000rpm, the TL just jumps out of the blocks in this rev range the VTR just cruised. The TL is a handful at low speed etc, but can live with that.

[vifferman]

I dyno'ed the TL and it turned up 107BHP at the back wheel, but the VTR is claimed at 102, it seemed more like 90-95, it was that different in useable power 3000-8000rpm, the TL just jumps out of the blocks in this rev range the VTR just cruised. The TL is a handful at low speed etc, but can live with that.

Yeah, stock VTRs are under 100 RWHP, and even a well-sorted one is less than 110. Like I said, to get really serious power, you're up for pistons, rods, cams, serious rejetting, full race zorst, and then a serious limitation is the cases, which apparently can't handle more than about 120hp. Like I said, less trouble to buy summat else if you want the power.
But the VTR is easy to ride, and you can get some serious fun out of it with a bit of tinkering (like spending the difference in purchase price between the VTR and TL on regearing, a jet kit, and suspension mods.) Even spending $40 on a 15-tooth sprocket makes a huge difference!

[wkid_one]

Only thing I don't like about the TL-S is its tendancy to not like any throttle imput mid corner shown by its desire to want to stand up - it seems to me, whilst it came out with a 190 rear tyre - it doesn't in fact ride like it should have one!

It also rides like it carries, like its big brother the TLR, a lot of weight HIGH UP, and I found it was more brutal in the set up to corners. The TLR is an absolute bitch to set up properly for suspension - but once done it is a dream other than the feeling the high CoG gives you.

Whilst the TL's need Ohlins suspension - the VTR is in DIRE need of new front springs and it is shockingly (yes, gr8 pun I know) undersprung in the front - and this is accentuated by being over sprung in the rear for any but the heavier riders (ie Bung Bung and me) - which pushes even more weight on the already over worked front springs.

On a personal level - I prefer the sound of the VTR to the TL. The TL's sound too cammy - where the VTR seems to have captured more of the Ducati sound.

Would love to ride a TL (with Ohlins rear) and VTR (with at least 0.87kg/cm2 front end) side by side - which would be difficult to do really - I guess I would need to ride them one after the other I suppose.

What you need to remember is that the TL is better compared with the SP as the VTR is classed a sports tourer in real world riding terms. However - the SP is GROSSLY overpriced new, meaning the TL always got better sales figures.

Out of all of them - I would buy the SP (preferably the 2) as it has the Honda quality and renouned ease of ride, with a bit more horsepower.



However - if I had the money (and desire) I would buy the Ducati 916 Senna in Gun Metal Gray

[Eddieb]

Yup, and mine would be Matt Black with...

MRA full tint double bubble screen
Yellow Goodrich Braided lines front and rear
GC Carbon Fibre hugger
Leo Vinci or Micron Carbon Fibre Pipes
Ventura Rack and Bag

The better half has one, Gloss black
Braided lines front (and I think rear)
2 Brothers pipes
Dyno jet kit
K & N
Aftermarket bellypan
Ventura rack & bag
Rear seat cover

It sounds very sweet.

[Morepower]

Only thing I don't like about the TL-S is its tendancy to not like any throttle imput mid corner shown by its desire to want to stand up - it seems to me, whilst it came out with a 190 rear tyre - it doesn't in fact ride like it should have one!

Ihave tried both 180 and 190 and the 190 is my choice much more confidence inspiring at full lean. I have an Ohlins shock and its easier in the corners now. only understeers now when the front wheel is in the air !

Dave

[hondav2]

I have had my VTR for neary 3 years now, agree with all your comments. I was going to get a SP2 until I read a comparison road test with a CBR1000RR and bought the CBR. The VTR is a bike you have to ride, whereas the CBR is so easy to ride . You only have to sit on it and it duz everything for you. I dont know if I will sell the VTR as its a good hack and has character. Cheers Toddy

[That Guy]

Firestormer - great review. You certainly know them well (good at technical help on them too )

Agree with other comments in the thread too. I have a VTR as well.

It's a great road bike.

I would say its worst point is handling. Not just softish forks, but overall it is too big and heavy, and has a long wheelbase (at least it feels like it). The engine makes a nicer torque wave than it does hoarsepower - in fact with a point and squirt kind of riding style you can keep up with some 'proper' sports bikes pretty easily. It just doesn't like high corner speeds - starts to wallow a bit and and doesn't change direction very quickly. Ride a modern 600 then get off and back onto the VTR and it feels like a harley! That's being a bit mean - it's better than that. However given its intended application (ie sports-touring) then I think it hits the mark very well. If you are finding it's limits on the road you are probably going too quickly anyway.

My other criticism is that under hard braking the front will lock relatively easily. It's almost as if it doesn't pitch enough weight onto the front wheel - rather it puts it weight behind the front wheel and pushes it. I must lock the front once or twice every 1000kms. I think part of the problem is I am used to much better braking (and handling too for that matter I guess) from my race bike RGV. You wouldn't want to ride down to Hawkes Bay from Auckland (like I do) in a day on an RGV though - this sort of distance (550 kms or so) is where the VTR shines.

I find I can do 200kms on a tank and by then I'm ready for a break anyway so that suits me. The gearing is too high though so definately agree with putting a tooth or two more on the rear.

I got mine new with Scorpion pipes (almost too loud actually), pack rack, and new boots too for $14600 which I reckon is very good value; in fact one of their best points. Second hand they are good value too.

Great road bike, just don't expect a great track bike.

[vifferman]

Firestormer - great review. You certainly know them well (good at technical help on them too )

Shucks - tweren't nuttin. Too much time on my hands spent interwebbing instead of working. Wish I'd done all the research before I bought my VTR though...

I would say its worst point is handling. Not just softish forks, but overall it is too big and heavy, and has a long wheelbase (at least it feels like it).

It's only about 15mm (IIRC) longer than the TL, with slightly more rake. Or at least mine was; it's now about the same wheelbase, and with the forks dropped through the triples it's now similar.
The handling / weight thing is relative. I came off SluttyFartBlast - a 1990 VFR750, so compared to that, it feels very sporty. In fact, I rode a VFR800 and VTR back-to-back around Puke, and the VTR drops into the corners far more readily than the VFR. Tyres have a lot to do widdit too: the Azaro AV49-SP on the front of mine makes it feel MUCH lighter than the Pirelli Dragon that was on there did. Nearly fell off (well, not really) when the new boots went on - it tipped into corners without even thinking about it.

The engine makes a nicer torque wave than it does hoarsepower - in fact with a point and squirt kind of riding style you can keep up with some 'proper' sports bikes pretty easily.

It feels very lazy, and so it's not tiring to ride.

It just doesn't like high corner speeds - starts to wallow a bit and and doesn't change direction very quickly.

I'll have to take your word for it, as I've never done any high-speed riding on it, although the aforementioned test ride at Puke topped an indicated 230km/h.

Ride a modern 600 then get off and back onto the VTR and it feels like a harley! That's being a bit mean - it's better than that.

Like I said - it's all relative. And the design's old - it's essentially unchanged from it's inception over 7 years ago! Technology's marched on since then, and Honda hasn't done the 4-yearly model update with it, probably because it's essentially a US bike, and it's been successful as it is.

My other criticism is that under hard braking the front will lock relatively easily. It's almost as if it doesn't pitch enough weight onto the front wheel - rather it puts it weight behind the front wheel and pushes it.

That's a fairly astute observation. Wonder if different front suspenders'll fix that?

The gearing is too high though so definately agree with putting a tooth or two more on the rear.

Yeah, that really revolutionises it, and would do the same for most bikes, which are overgeared for economy/emissions testing/noise reasons. I was cheap, and went down a tooth on the front, which makes the drivechain VERY noisy, so it'll probably be ferked relatively quickly.

I got mine new with Scorpion pipes (almost too loud actually), pack rack, and new boots too for $14600 which I reckon is very good value; in fact one of their best points. Second hand they are good value too.
Great road bike, just don't expect a great track bike.

That's a bloody good price! Id've(Id've?!? ) I'd have lurved some aftermarket cans, but the accountant/wife would've been more'n slightly unhappy about that...
I can't honestly say I LOVE my VTR. I'm quite happy with it. It's not the best bike I've ever ridden, and not the favourite of those I've owned, and it's probably not the most sensible or appropriate bike for me. But it has enough character to make it likeable, without being too hard to live with.
After 13? 14? months of ownership, it's grown on me a bit.

[manuboy]

Shucks - tweren't nuttin. Too much time on my hands spent interwebbing instead of working.

Dude - i agree with That Guy, you definitely know your VTR stuff... come ride the SV round for a week and do a write up for it! i wanna read that!

[Cajun]

Shucks - tweren't nuttin. Too much time on my hands spent interwebbing instead of working. Wish I'd done all the research before I bought my VTR though...

It's only about 15mm (IIRC) longer than the TL, with slightly more rake. Or at least mine was; it's now about the same wheelbase, and with the forks dropped through the triples it's now similar.
The handling / weight thing is relative. I came off SluttyFartBlast - a 1990 VFR750, so compared to that, it feels very sporty. In fact, I rode a VFR800 and VTR back-to-back around Puke, and the VTR drops into the corners far more readily than the VFR. Tyres have a lot to do widdit too: the Azaro AV49-SP on the front of mine makes it feel MUCH lighter than the Pirelli Dragon that was on there did. Nearly fell off (well, not really) when the new boots went on - it tipped into corners without even thinking about it.
It feels very lazy, and so it's not tiring to ride.
I'll have to take your word for it, as I've never done any high-speed riding on it, although the aforementioned test ride at Puke topped an indicated 230km/h.
Like I said - it's all relative. And the design's old - it's essentially unchanged from it's inception over 7 years ago! Technology's marched on since then, and Honda hasn't done the 4-yearly model update with it, probably because it's essentially a US bike, and it's been successful as it is.
That's a fairly astute observation. Wonder if different front suspenders'll fix that?
Yeah, that really revolutionises it, and would do the same for most bikes, which are overgeared for economy/emissions testing/noise reasons. I was cheap, and went down a tooth on the front, which makes the drivechain VERY noisy, so it'll probably be ferked relatively quickly.

That's a bloody good price! Id've(Id've?!? ) I'd have lurved some aftermarket cans, but the accountant/wife would've been more'n slightly unhappy about that...
I can't honestly say I LOVE my VTR. I'm quite happy with it. It's not the best bike I've ever ridden, and not the favourite of those I've owned, and it's probably not the most sensible or appropriate bike for me. But it has enough character to make it likeable, without being too hard to live with.
After 13? 14? months of ownership, it's grown on me a bit.

My wife loves her vtr she had it 2 years. once she stops loving it she well sell it

[That Guy]

That Guy, That there Guy There, That Guy Again still etc. That's funny. I laffed and laffed.

Anyway yeah - its a good bike you can't really complain, and you know deep down it does everything you need and you shouldn't complain. But I agree, I'm not in lurve with it. Grow on me it may but it ain't never going to light up my y-fronts so to speak.

I reckon my history will record my bike ownership as:

Owned VTR. Good bike. Nice bike. Good VTR. Nice Practicle bike.Sold VTR.
Owned (TBC). Mad bike. Not neccessary. Turns like a mad thing. Too much power. Y-fronts caught on fire. Goody.