Gunshop employee charged

[pritch]

But it's still illegal,

No it's not.

Even in this paradise for the Politically Correct you still have the right to defend your life, or the life of a family member. It's about what constitutes reasonable force. In this case the guy was armed with a machete and apparently ignored repeated warnings to stop. A non-fatal bullet wound is an admirably restrained response in the circumstances and a clear case of self defense.

Unless somebody has said something they shouldn't have, there is basically no chance of a conviction.

[one-speed]

yer whats up with the nz law totally SUCKS

[scumdog]

a photographic monopod which I clobbered one of them with. Cops were very good - the toerags were known to them, but I remain nervous of blades.

I certainly agree with you that we don't want to see any carrying of firearms - too much like the US.


BTW Fish: Chinook = biiiig chopper, am I right?

No, a northbound warm wind from the USA is what a Chinook is. And a type of salmon.

Knives are too rampant in NZ now, years ago the penalty for carrying one was increased in NZ ( 202b of the C.A. for you pedants) but now the problem rears up again.
Watcha goin' to do???

[SlashWylde]

A friend of mine who's known the Carvells for a while as a regular customer commented on the day this happened that it had always been 'well known' that any criminal attempting to hold up SAI would be quickly dealt with in such a manner.

So there you go. My heart goes out to them, and I would probably have done the same thing.

But it's still illegal, and I would have stashed that mag in the sure knowledge of what I'd have to put up with if I ever used it.

I view the daily carry of my Chinook in the same light. If I ever need to use it, I'm fully aware that the next time I see it, it'll be inside an evidence bag.

And that's the way I like it.

You make good arguments Mr Fish. Thanks for injecting some knowledge and rationality in to the discussion. I think I now agree with the actions of the Police in charging Mr Carvel, if indeed they are charging him as they would any other member of the public for illegal possession of a weapon, and not as a last resort to lay a charge against a man to fulfill some larger political agenda.

Having said that, I will still be donating what I can to help Mr Carvel defend his case. This is going to cost him a lot of money and will be a huge strain on his family. I applaud him for making an obviously difficult and unenviable decision in the knowledge that there would be severe repercussions, and successfully not killing the man who threatened him.

[SlashWylde]

This might very well be enough to get his D cat revoked, thereby forcing him out of work, and I think you have to agree that's wrong. Greg was not the instigator, but he will end up paying more than the perp.

That is the core of the matter. The perp will have legal aid but will hopefully go to prison, whereas the cost to the Carvels will be high and have long lasting effects.

[davereid]

Like the sign on the wall of my shop says... SHOPLIFTERS... Dont worry, we won't call the police.. it will be delt with right here...

Mr Carvell, I hope I am on your jury, everyone has the right to self defence, and no government can take it from a free man.

Arguements about using a firearm for self defence are rubbish. As the dutch tourists have learned arms controls only control the good, not the criminal.

The police will continue to trumpet the cause thats guns are only for criminal (oops and police use).. yet every year armed americans experience a reduction in violent crime, while the disarmed british, aussies and kiwis manage growth.

Good luck Mr. Carvell and all those who will defend their family, peace and prosperity.

[Lou Girardin]

If the Police can decide to not charge Heather Simpson for electoral offences because it's "in the public interest to NOT do so", then it's in the public interest to not charge Carvell and send a message to thieving scumbags that burglary is a high-risk occupation.
Typical gutless arse-covering behaviour.

[jrandom]

No it's not... right to defend your life... reasonable force.

Read the fucking thread, bozo.

[steams gently out ears]

Jesus H. Christ. I suspect I'd make a bad schoolteacher. The bottom quarter of the bell curve in my class would end up covered in bruises.

[jrandom]

I remain nervous of blades... Chinook = biiiig chopper, am I right?

Like Scumdog said, it's a type of salmon.

It's spent so long in my pocket that the smell alone floors potential muggers at a hundred paces.

[jrandom]

Watcha goin' to do???

"That's not a knife..."

"This is a knife."

[scumdog]

If the Police can decide to not charge Heather Simpson for electoral offences because it's "in the public interest to NOT do so", then it's in the public interest to not charge Carvell and send a message to thieving scumbags that burglary is a high-risk occupation.
Typical gutless arse-covering behaviour.

I'm with Lou, 9 shots in a 1911 Colt mag? - so he only used ONE?? Then he has more self resptraint than I. The mag would have been down to 3 shots before I decided I had used enough bullets for the job

[Big Dog]

Consider it like this:
the guy with the machete will be found guity of assault (Or attempted assault HA HA) and that will probably help the 'self defence' defence.

Imagine the case of bullying this stupid F&*k is going to get in the donut resizing factory and maybe there is some justice.

[Swoop]

I'm with Lou, 9 shots in a 1911 Colt mag? - so he only used ONE?? Then he has more self resptraint than I. The mag would have been down to 3 shots before I decided I had used enough bullets for the job

Can someone please post a link to where there is some evidence of what the circumstances in the shop were?
So far the "stuff" article just states it was a .45cal. True, or a media misprint?
Was the gun in a loaded state, or was it unloaded and there was a loaded magazine in the vicinity somwhere?

[diggydog]

whats the matter with nz were is our minds, the guy brings a fucking weapon and the owner can't protect himself, so he got shot, maybe he should of died,

[Dai]

Whats the bet its a setup

I was talking to another gundealer the other day and he was telling me that a number of years ago the Auckland Police took the father, Ray, to court over some rifles he imported. He fought them and won the case.

We all know that the police have long memories and what is the bet that someone higher up is trying to make a name for themselves by getting back at the father through the son.

From what I heard the Police took this current case to Wellington and it was dropped.

I bet it is the Auckland Police's own prosecution department that is trying this case not the jJustice Dept in Wellington.

Another case of dictatorial rule by those who are supposed to serve the public.