UK lobbying groups speak out against "External Throttle Control"

[Bob]

Both the BMF and MAG have spoken out against the possible implementation of outside forces being able to control motorcyclist’s speeds. However, the two bodies disagree on the subject of the possible benefits of a speed warning system.

Intelligent Speed Adaptation(ISA) has come to the fore because the Motor Industries Research Association (MIRA), in conjunction with Leeds University, has completed a 5-year trial of ISA and will shortly be reporting to the Government on its findings.

MAG has made its’ position clear. MAG President Ian Mutch was emphatic about the issue. "Let's keep this one simple - we don't want it, not today, not tomorrow, not ever." MAG also stated that withdrawing control from the rider is fundamentally what MAG was set up to oppose.

The BMF also felt the need to clarify their position in light of recent comments in the press. The BMF’s position is “that while a voluntary speed advisory system might well have its advantages from a rider perspective in helping to avoid inadvertent speeding, actual intervention, by whatever means, is unacceptable”.

Both MAG and the BMF have ridden a prototype motorcycle fitted with ISA technology which was developed by the University of Leeds, the Department for Transport and MIRA (Motor Industry Research Association). The system fitted to the bike slows the bike down through speed limits by acting on the throttle from information supplied by digitally mapped GPS signals. The system also warns the rider of the speed limit through audible alarms, flashing lights and vibrating apparatus in the seat.

The test took place in a closed environment on a special circuit with no other traffic present and therefore bore no relation to real world traffic conditions.

MAG’s Director of Public Affairs Trevor Baird condemned the prototype technology as, "dangerous as it overloads the rider with information thus distracting concentration. Furthermore the apparatus as it is at present will close the throttle mid corner where consistency of power is critical to stability. However we must be aware of future developments that may overcome these shortcomings as the technology evolves."

The BMF have taken a different stance, saying that “Calling for bans on a technology that is only in the trial stage and therefore not proven, is short-sighted and likely to stifle the development of technologies that motorcyclists might well find of eventual benefit.”

The Queen’s Speech at the opening of Parliament is expected to contain statements on road pricing and congestion charging that will use similar technology.

[Fat Tony]

And the Association of British Drivers aren't that up for it either, and I think that they may have taken a sarcy pill or two

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ISA (Intelligent Speed Adaptation) should be re-named as USELESS (Unintelligent Speed Engineering Lowering Existing Safety Standards) says the Association of British Drivers.

The ISA system being planned by the government to control the speed of vehicles, has just two inputs, the speed of the vehicle and the posted speed limit, which it looks up from the location given by a satellite navigation system, and it matches one to the other. That is not intelligence --- in no way can ISA be described as 'intelligent'.

Vehicles, however, really do need intelligent speed adaptation. We need an ISA system which as well as having an input of the vehicle's speed, has visual inputs so it can determine whether that speed is appropriate given the traffic pattern and likely actions of other road users.

The visual input would also enable the ISA system to determine the weather and state of the road surface and to tell in advance how gradients and bends in the road will affect the safe speed of the vehicle. Ideally the system would also have an audio input. The system should also have motion sensors built in to it, so it can tell how the vehicle is handling. It should have sufficient pre-learned data to be able to predict how different vehicles handle so as to be able to adjust the safe speed to that particular vehicle, and it should be continually adding to its store of learned data. And, of course, it should have a very powerful computer which can process all the inputs in real time and output the safe speed for that moment.

In addition to having control of the throttle and brakes, the ISA system should have control of the steering and ancillary controls as well. It should be programmed with an instinct for its own survival and self-preservation, as well as a strong desire not to cause damage to other such systems or to vehicles fitted with them.

When we can come up with a system which can do all that then they should be made compulsory on all vehicles.

But wait! We already have such a system. It's called a human being. All human beings which are allowed control of vehicles have visual inputs, most of them have audio inputs, they have motion sensors, huge stores of learned and pre-programmed data, and computer systems so powerful that they've taken millions of years to design. They also have an overwhelming survival instinct and a strong desire not to injure other humans or cause damage to property, which cause them to keep to a speed where risk of damage is minimised.

Why don't we just leave control of vehicles to the TRUE ISA systems --- drivers?

ABD Chairman, Brian Gregory, said:
"The only real intelligence in a vehicle's control system is found between the ears of the driver. We blunt that intelligence at our peril."
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Of course, nobody will listen to any of them as usual. The only people they seem to listen to these days are the likes of BRAKE and other reduce speed bodies.

I don't doubt that a system like ISA will be the norm - I just hope it's not in my lifetime - and if it is, the spanners and wire snips will be coming out

[Deano]

Isn't it funny how art imitates life (or is that vice versa?)

What I mean is that many aspects of the sci fi movies of the past are actually becoming a reality.....ok, we haven't got teleportation yet....

But take Demolition Man. The future was so regulated you couldn't take a dump without big brother watching your every move.

It's only a matter of time before there are GPS and cameras fitted standard to every vehicle or place to monitor every driving/riding move you make. Although it will be so un-PC to speed, vehicles will probably be restricted from the factory so that you can't anyway.

[Waylander]

The system also warns the rider of the speed limit... ...and vibrating apparatus in the seat.

Chicks will love it.

[HenryDorsetCase]

But take Demolition Man. The future was so regulated you couldn't take a dump without big brother watching your every move.

.

you mention that movie, and all I see is Sandy Bullock in those tight black pants....

what were we talking about again?

[Black Bandit]

Gah! Pesky no good meddling lefty hoity toity brown trousered proactive knee-jerking committees.

http://uk.reuters.com/article/motori...9?pageNumber=1

The committee suggest that motorcycles be restricted to 125cc!!!!

[lb99]

A total of 569 motorcyclists were killed and nearly 6,000 seriously injured in accidents on Britain's roads in 2005, according to Department for Transport figures

how many of those were creamed by other veihicles failing to give way?

[pete376403]

Would they also agree to capping the speeds of just about any medium sized car, let alone the Ferraris/Porches/Lambo's etc supercars? Didn't think so.

[Disco Dan]

Wankers.

"tell em their dreamin"

[Jantar]

come on, lets be realistic here. No-one really needs a bike bigger than 125 cc for commuting on. And at the same time 4 wheeled vehicles, having double the number of wheels to propel, will bw limited to 250 cc.

[Pumba]

come on, lets be realistic here. No-one really needs a bike bigger than 125 cc for commuting on. And at the same time 4 wheeled vehicles, having double the number of wheels to propel, will bw limited to 250 cc.

Hey I can see the logic involved in that statement, who wants to bet it has never been raised in a serious conversation

[Gremlin]

No-one really needs a bike bigger than 125 cc for commuting on.

I dunno, I find the cb900 very handy around town, oodles of torque, makes it really easy. For me tho, its not just a commute, I have to hop from place to place, so can spend a lot of time on the bike...

Its the torque, not downright engine size... but sure, limit the cages to 250cc

[mstriumph]

I.................... but sure, limit the cages to 250cc

all cages should be horse-drawn .........

[Bob]

It wasn't 125cc, but rather they were looking at a top speed limitation. 65mph (or 5mph slower than the national speed limit on motorways!) was the suggestion by that clown of a "transport editor" they found from somewhere.

This isn't the first time power contstraints have been proposed. It isn't all that long ago that some Euro Politician (Martin Bangemann I think he was called) was lobbying very hard for a 100bhp limit. Thankfully he was defeated as no-one could prove a direct link between speed and accident rates.

If I recall correctly, trials have been going on with cars, where they are fitted with a 'black-box' which can control their speed. Not sure if any bikes have been included in the trial.

Talk about scary. Imagine going to overtake in a 50mph zone, then hitting a 40mph zone when you are still half-way through the manouvre... so the black-box gets the command to cut your speed... just as Mr Truck is getting too close for comfort and you go to open up to get through and into the space...

Or - and this is the really scary bit for anyone riding a bike - you are leaning over in a corner and the black-box kicks in and cuts your revs. Loss of revs, bike runs wide... into a hedge one way, or into the other lane depending on which way you are heading.

I'd say that'll increase the accident rates, not cut them.

[SPman]

come on, lets be realistic here. No-one really needs a bike bigger than 125 cc for commuting on.

Fuck off - had a GP125 some years ago, and got passed by my sons schoolbus, going up a, not very steep hill on the way home......very embarrassing! 1300cc is the minimum size for a commuter, I reckon.....

oh the shame...............never again......