MotoGP 2016

[carbonhed]

Wel Khairul Idham Pawi looks spookily good in the wet. Unlike Rins who looked like he could've crashed half a dozen times before finally tossing it away. Perhaps when we get back to warm dry conditions he'll regroup. Hopefully Lorenzo too because it's painful watching him tottering around.


The thought has grown for me over the last few races that MM is truly racing with his heart and his head this season. Less red mist but more points.

No doubt the debacle of last season occupied many hours of discussion over the winter.

If Honda come to the party MM could start a dynasty.

Think you're absolutely right. A more strategic approach that accumulates points when he doesn't have the bike to win... and it's paid off in spades right away. He's hardly likely to unlearn something that's proved so successful on a less than stellar bike. Which just piles the pressure on his competitors to match him... there's nobody on the grid capable of doing it at the moment. Barring injury he's looking Godlike.

[actungbaby]

Looked to me that Crutchlow did the same when he passed one of the satellite dukes ...

No he said he almost thought he whould crash i think he put his leg out he mentioned that might look like he was kicking

I guess he was being humious on that one after what happened last year. great spoting i didnt see that.

Retired double champion Stoner was testing alongside the MotoGP regulars for the first time since Sepang in February. The Australian ace was fourth quickest, 0.041s from Pramac's Scott Redding and 0.738s from Dovizioso's best lap

Amazing i guess when you got natural talent still all years away still mazing esp when not race fit.

[Asher]

Yeah I have driven it on a racing sim, not much of a track to be honest so was surprised to hear they would be going there. Very old track too so i'm guessing not very safe.


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I have the new Valentino Rossi game which includes the redbull ring.
The biggest thing I noticed was there is almost no flat corners, most corners are either up hill or down hill and the riders will spend a lot of time braking on the edge of the tyre.
If MM93 had taken part in the test I would have put money down that he would blitzed everyone.

Why did they include the redbull ring? Are KTM intitled to a home race?

[James Deuce]

I have the new Valentino Rossi game which includes the redbull ring.
The biggest thing I noticed was there is almost no flat corners, most corners are either up hill or down hill and the riders will spend a lot of time braking on the edge of the tyre.
If MM93 had taken part in the test I would have put money down that he would blitzed everyone.

Why did they include the redbull ring? Are KTM intitled to a home race?
Red bull bankroll the development series for MotoGP and sponsor a tremendous number of riders and teams and with KTM coming in next year, there has to be a kickback of some sort.

[Dadpole]

A nice little article on Moto2 engines... http://www.mcnews.com.au/moto2-engine-preparation-behind-scenes/

[Reckless]

The thought has grown for me over the last few races that MM is truly racing with his heart and his head this season. Less red mist but more points.

No doubt the debacle of last season occupied many hours of discussion over the winter.

If Honda come to the party MM could start a dynasty.

Been thinking the same. Like the way he handled himself through the Rossi Debacle and the way he has grown up and carrying himself atm.
Big change for me I didnt like his tactics in MOTO2 abd doubted if he really was messing with Rossi but the kid will race hammer and tongs with which ever bike is close to him.
He is the best rider out there at present you gotta give credit where its due.
Rossi has been making some errors that his experience should have taught him better and the kids is racing and thinking like a champion.
He going to nail this years championship I reckon.

[Drew]

A nice little article on Moto2 engines... http://www.mcnews.com.au/moto2-engine-preparation-behind-scenes/
Where are they getting the new ones?

[Dadpole]

Where are they getting the new ones?

Good point. Perhaps they will go with a 500. I hear Enfield are interested.

[Moise]

From Motomatters
"There is persistent paddock gossip that Stoner is using this test to gauge his competitiveness, with a view to racing as a wildcard at the Austrian Grand Prix. Given Stoner's long association with Red Bull, and the fact that nobody has raced at the Red Bull Ring (except for Valentino Rossi, who raced a 125 there in 1996 and 1997, and Jack Miller, who raced a 125 there in 2011 in the German IDM championship), it gives him the best chance of being competitive."
Please let it be true.
Stoner has basically said the track isn't safe so he won't ride there. But I'm looking for cheap flights to Melbourne in October. If he races anywhere this year, that would be my pick.

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[Autech]

http://youtu.be/4oVjn6L-GKY

Onboard of eeeaaahhhnonnneee. Gawd those barriers are close!



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[merv]

Stoner has basically said the track isn't safe so he won't ride there.

Smart man.

[roogazza]

http://youtu.be/4oVjn6L-GKY
Onboard of eeeaaahhhnonnneee. Gawd those barriers are close!

Loved the sound of the doocati,wonderful.

Barriers don't seem bad to me ? But then I'm a dinosaur from 70's street circuits and not doing 200 everywhere. :rolleyes:

[pritch]

Smart man.

Yeah. Julian Ryder had been pushing the story that, for several reasons, Stoner would wildcard the Austrian GP instead of the Australian GP. One reason is thought to be that Stoner might embarrass the factory riders at Phillip Island. I don't know why Ducati were worried about that. Hector Barbera, on a lower tier Ducati, has more points in the championship than either of the factory riders. Or any other Ducati rider for that matter. Whoda thunk it?

All of the facilities at the Austrian track have been renewed, pits etc are all brand new according to Alex Briggs, but the actual track has not changed much at all.


The guys on the MotoPod podcast were discussing Lorenzo's move to Ducati. They feel JL may be more at home at Ducati than people think. He has worked with Gigi DalI'gna (sp?) previously, when JL was riding for Aprilia.

[actungbaby]

Smart man.

yeah i say those painted run areas look very short indeed. all that armco reminds me spa in belgium only from old videos

never left nz .

[speights_bud]

(Nevermind, I rewatched the video)

[actungbaby]

Where are they getting the new ones?
I just dont get it Honda said there goal with moto 3 was getting close to 125 gp 2 smokes . and engines are racing design

then in moto 2 they have them based on cbr 600 rr production engines . i prefer was open to other makes .

but that was voted down last year again . on cost . be far more intresting they did even a class where chould have 2 3 4 cylinder

bikes with diffrent engine sizes.

[eldog]

Loved the sound of the doocati,wonderful.:rolleyes:

They sound even better in the shop.

I had to drag myself out of the shop before I brought one just because of the sound:love:

[pritch]

then in moto 2 they have them based on cbr 600 rr production engines . i prefer was open to other makes .


The idea of Moto2 was to have a standardised engine with frames and suspension open. The hope was that there would be all sorts of weird and wonderful systems introduced. Shame about that, the teams are very conservative and they all want what last year's champion used.

Dorna wanted more power from the engines but Honda didn't want the engines blowing up, so they ignored the request and kept power down to a reliable level.

All of which creates problems because of the lack of chassis development that the class was supposed to foster, and the way the modest power level creates a very big step up to MotoGP.

Still, we get some good racing. People who bemoan the loss of the 250s tend to forget that in the end there was only one factory and they were pretty much picking the champion before the season started by giving their chosen rider special bikes.

So it may not be what we want, but it could be worse.

[actungbaby]

I have the new Valentino Rossi game which includes the redbull ring.
The biggest thing I noticed was there is almost no flat corners, most corners are either up hill or down hill and the riders will spend a lot of time braking on the edge of the tyre.
If MM93 had taken part in the test I would have put money down that he would blitzed everyone.

Why did they include the redbull ring? Are KTM intitled to a home race?

Whats the game like feel of the bikes i havent tryed any in many many years but found the tourist thropy game on ps2 which

I still have is good game made by grand tursmo guy

[BMWST?]

The idea of Moto2 was to have a standardised engine with frames and suspension open. The hope was that there would be all sorts of weird and wonderful systems introduced. Shame about that, the teams are very conservative and they all want what last year's champion used.

Dorna wanted more power from the engines but Honda didn't want the engines blowing up, so they ignored the request and kept power down to a reliable level.

All of which creates problems because of the lack of chassis development that the class was supposed to foster, and the way the modest power level creates a very big step up to MotoGP.

Still, we get some good racing. People who bemoan the loss of the 250s tend to forget that in the end there was only one factory and they were pretty much picking the champion before the season started by giving their chosen rider special bikes.

So it may not be what we want, but it could be worse.
Cant remember where i saw it,but there is also talk the moto 3 gives the riders and engineers more valid experience in the adjustability of a proper gp bikes incl gearing etc.Moto 2 things are less fluid,so is not a step up on the way to motogp

[Autech]

Cant remember where i saw it,but there is also talk the moto 3 gives the riders and engineers more valid experience in the adjustability of a proper gp bikes incl gearing etc.Moto 2 things are less fluid,so is not a step up on the way to motogp

And the only rider to make the direct step just broke a few records. Snot bad eh?

To be brutally honest I have stopped watching moto2. It was awesome in the early days but has lost its Zing for me, hopefully a new engine package might spark things up again.


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[Mental Trousers]

The idea of Moto2 was to have a standardised engine with frames and suspension open. The hope was that there would be all sorts of weird and wonderful systems introduced. Shame about that, the teams are very conservative and they all want what last year's champion used.

Dorna wanted more power from the engines but Honda didn't want the engines blowing up, so they ignored the request and kept power down to a reliable level.

All of which creates problems because of the lack of chassis development that the class was supposed to foster, and the way the modest power level creates a very big step up to MotoGP.

Still, we get some good racing. People who bemoan the loss of the 250s tend to forget that in the end there was only one factory and they were pretty much picking the champion before the season started by giving their chosen rider special bikes.

So it may not be what we want, but it could be worse.


Cant remember where i saw it,but there is also talk the moto 3 gives the riders and engineers more valid experience in the adjustability of a proper gp bikes incl gearing etc.Moto 2 things are less fluid,so is not a step up on the way to motogp

Moto2 is becoming quite a problem. The teams love it because they can plan their engine budget (one of the biggest costs) down to the dollar. They know exactly what they're paying before the season starts. Riders are always reluctant to develop something new and will always want the same machinery that's winning. There's zero development going on because everyone is busy tweaking the current stuff to the n'th degree because it's cheaper and they're competitive. The engine is a standard CBR600RR unit with a couple of HRC bits in it and then tuned to be reliable.

If you look at a Moto2 bike they pretty much look like a stripped down, souped up road bike with an extra beefy chassis. Compare them with Moto3 or MotoGP bikes and they look wrong.

The most glaring problem is the 2014 Moto2 champion has stepped up to MotoGP and struggles to finish higher than 21st and he's a lot more representative of Moto2 racers than Marquez was (he's just a freak).

[eelracing]

People who bemoan the loss of the 250s tend to forget that in the end there was only one factory and they were pretty much picking the champion before the season started by giving their chosen rider special bikes.

Which champ was that? Simoncelli on the Gilera? Or Barbera and Bautista on the Aprilia's?
Funny then that the last champion was Aoyama an a non full factory supported Honda.

The real crime apart from killing off pure racebikes is the fact its taken the so-called experts 6 fucking years to realise that theyd end up with an even worse off Kalex cup.

[BMWST?]

Moto2 is becoming quite a problem. The teams love it because they can plan their engine budget (one of the biggest costs) down to the dollar. They know exactly what they're paying before the season starts. Riders are always reluctant to develop something new and will always want the same machinery that's winning. There's zero development going on because everyone is busy tweaking the current stuff to the n'th degree because it's cheaper and they're competitive. The engine is a standard CBR600RR unit with a couple of HRC bits in it and then tuned to be reliable.

If you look at a Moto2 bike they pretty much look like a stripped down, souped up road bike with an extra beefy chassis. Compare them with Moto3 or MotoGP bikes and they look wrong.

The most glaring problem is the 2014 Moto2 champion has stepped up to MotoGP and struggles to finish higher than 21st and he's a lot more representative of Moto2 racers than Marquez was (he's just a freak).
moto2 is littered with ex 125 and 250 champs.Terol springs to mind.He is no where.

[merv]

The problem with Moto 2 is it doesn't have any connection to the idea of brand loyalty by the fans so what interest is it to us?

[Mental Trousers]

moto2 is littered with ex 125 and 250 champs.Terol springs to mind.He is no where.

Yes. If you watch a Moto2 race they're riding them like Super Sport 600's rather than GP bikes. They have to be muscled around a lot more than you would a bike that's designed from the ground up to race. So those who learnt to race on 125's just don't have the experience to extract the last 1% from a Moto2 bike and end up nowhere.

However, I suspect Zarco will do rather well on the Tech 3 MotoGP bike next year.

[Oscar]

Which champ was that? Simoncelli on the Gilera? Or Barbera and Bautista on the Aprilia's?
Funny then that the last champion was Aoyama an a non full factory supported Honda.

The real crime apart from killing off pure racebikes is the fact its taken the so-called experts 6 fucking years to realise that theyd end up with an even worse off Kalex cup.

Psst - Derbi + Aprillia + Gilera = pretty much the same bike.

[pritch]

Which champ was that? Simoncelli on the Gilera? Or Barbera and Bautista on the Aprilia's?


Or Jorge on his Aprilia?

Ummm what difference would it make whether it was a Gilera or an Aprilia?

The Honda was obvously an exception and the Italian factory certainly didn't intend them to win. Neither did Honda apparently.

Twice in the last few days I've come across an article describing the preparation of Moto2 engines and the efforts made to see they are as near as possible the same bhp.
I didn't pay a lot of attention but IIRC they said that the work is contracted to a European company that prepares engines similar to WSS standard. Now I want the article I can't find it.

[onearmedbandit]

A nice little article on Moto2 engines... http://www.mcnews.com.au/moto2-engine-preparation-behind-scenes/




Twice in the last few days I've come across an article describing the preparation of Moto2 engines and the efforts made to see they are as near as possible the same bhp.
I didn't pay a lot of attention but IIRC they said that the work is contracted to a European company that prepares engines similar to WSS standard. Now I want the article I can't find it.

Maybe this one..?

[roogazza]

Which champ was that? Simoncelli on the Gilera? Or Barbera and Bautista on the Aprilia's?
Funny then that the last champion was Aoyama an a non full factory supported Honda.

Aoyama rode like a champ that year,I was rooting for him.
Nothing since tho,maybe it was his 15 minutes of fame ? :shifty:

[Grumph]

Aoyama rode like a champ that year,I was rooting for him.
Nothing since tho,maybe it was his 15 minutes of fame ? :shifty:

It's the age old problem of the kamikaze...what do you do next if you survive your moment of glory ?

[eelracing]

Psst - Derbi + Aprillia + Gilera = pretty much the same bike.

Pssst- moto2 = is the same bike...but ssshhhh don't tell anyone they might go back to their pokemons and ricebubbles.



Ummm what difference would it make whether it was a Gilera or an Aprilia?

The Honda was obvously an exception and the Italian factory certainly didn't intend them to win.

Hey your the one parrotting the 'only one factory involved',conveniently forgetting the class was going to be canned after 2009.
Im just simply reminding the blind that another factory won the fucken thing...quite easily in fact.



moto2urd should be put out of it's misery...but lets tender another engine manufacturer for 6 more bloody years.

[Oscar]

Pssst- moto2 = is the same bike...but ssshhhh don't tell anyone they might go back to their pokemons and ricebubbles.



I never said it wasn't.
It was you trying to prove the marvelous diversity of the 250 class (at least that's what I think you were grumpy about).
Which at the end was basically 24 Piaggio clones and one Honda.

You can wail all you like about the loss of 250's, but the fact is that no factories were going to go on developing a redundant technology.

Also - if you don't like Moto2, don't fucking watch it.
Or, you could whinge about it.

Whatever.

[James Deuce]

Also - if you don't like Moto2, don't fucking watch it.


I do this. It's great.

[pritch]

Hey your the one parrotting the 'only one factory involved',conveniently forgetting the class was going to be canned after 2009.
Im just simply reminding the blind that another factory won the fucken thing...quite easily in fact.



Not at all. The point I was trying to make is that the Italian factory had reputedly for some years been picking winners by giving their annointed ones better machinery. I suspect that it didn't always work out quite how they planned with their own bikes, let alone Honda.

Anyhoo, it's all history now.

[jasonu]

You can wail all you like about the loss of 250's, but the fact is that no factories were going to go on developing a redundant technology.


Whatever.

It was only made redundant technology because they (Honda) changed the class to a modified street bike formula.

[Erelyes]

I quite like Moto2, they back the fuckers into the corners like they've been watching Drift Bible.

[actungbaby]

http://www.crash.net/motogp/feature/232438/1/riders-who-changed-the-face-of-gp-racing.html

[actungbaby]

The problem with Moto 2 is it doesn't have any connection to the idea of brand loyalty by the fans so what interest is it to us?

you got it in one merv thats why that car foumula with countrys inteed of teams was so boring

[pritch]

you got it in one merv thats why that car foumula with countrys inteed of teams was so boring

Conventional wisdom holds that in Superbikes the fans follow a manufacturer. In GPs the fans tend to follow the riders. Most of the comments posted in this thread would seem to support that theory.

For those of us suffering withdrawal from the lack of racing there may be a fix. http://www.ustream.tv/channel/suzuka-event

As of 9.15PM it was showing a view of the four hour race. Since I started this post though that has stopped. All the info on screen is Japanese. During the 8 Hour they may just show a lap timing screen, last year there was a camera but it was really long distance. The view they were showing just now was good.

[pritch]

http://www.crash.net/motogp/news/232476/1/suzuka-espargaro-takes-pole-for-yamaha.html

[Dadpole]

http://cricfree.tv/watch/live/motorcycling-world-endurance-2016-live-streaming

Quality could be better but at least it is in english

[pritch]

So Yamaha won two in a row as guests of Honda. Espagero won't be available next year, but maybe they can talk Vinales into riding the eight hour.

Honda will be pissed off. Perhaps they will finally realise that they need to do more than just another different paint job.

[Dadpole]

I had the feed on for most of the race. The commentary team seemed to be all at sea at times. Mistaking the highlights bit for the live feed. Giving positions from 10 laps ago.

Hard racing for all and Haslam was most impressive. Of interest was the number of competitive riders who were old enough to make Rossi look like a mere youth.

Only two more weeks to go...

[puddytat]

.

Only two more weeks to go...

Im going to have a snooze......someone wake me up just before FP1 please.
:sleep:

[Mental Trousers]

As Pritch pointed out earlier (http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/showthread.php/176760-MotoGP-2016?p=1130987089&highlight=radio#post1130987089) Rossi wants radio comms to the riders. As things are a bit quiet right now here's a couple of articles about it all. Personally, I don't want to see them used. The lack of teams ordering riders to do things is one of the things that makes MotoGP and bike racing much more interesting.

http://www.crash.net/motogp/feature/232230/1/should-riders-have-radios-in-motogp.html

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/125363

[bogan]

As Pritch pointed out earlier (http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/showthread.php/176760-MotoGP-2016?p=1130987089&highlight=radio#post1130987089) Rossi wants radio comms to the riders. As things are a bit quiet right now here's a couple of articles about it all. Personally, I don't want to see them used. The lack of teams ordering riders to do things is one of the things that makes MotoGP and bike racing much more interesting.

http://www.crash.net/motogp/feature/232230/1/should-riders-have-radios-in-motogp.html

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/125363

Make it one way, rider to pits only, keep the decision making to the rider based on the conditions they are experiencing.

[pritch]

Make it one way, rider to pits only, keep the decision making to the rider based on the conditions they are experiencing.

That wouldn't do anything to help the situation that arose on this occasion, in fact that's exactly what the problem was.

The riders in the lead group were receiving instructions on their pit boards to come in but were ignoring them because they were totally absorbed in the action around them as they could see it. There was no way that the pits could communicate with the riders to tell them that Marquez, who had been down the field, had changed to slicks and as a result was 6 seconds a lap faster.

Afterthought: Was thinking about the communication problem and possible solutions. Those riders aren't stupid, and while the circumstances were unusual, it may be assumed that if a pitboard suddenly says "BOX" at some time in the future they will at least give it serious consideration. Sad experience having taught them that the crew may well know something they don't. No changes are needed, the lesson should have been learned.


I think it was Oxley mentioned this morning that F1 had got to the stage where the settings on the car could be altered from the factory, perhaps thousands of kilometres away. That's pretty trick but it was a step too far even for F1 apparently.

[EJK]

OK I'm ready for some action. Red Bull Ring, first time track? Any anticipations? :sunny:

[pritch]

It's supposed to favour Ducati so a win to one of their riders is a possibility. Marquez will be there or there about 'cause he's Marquez, but the Yamahas are predicted to struggle. Which Yamaha does better depends on whether Jorge could find his lost mojo during the break. He's done it before.

If the track favours the Ducati that much one of their satellite bikes could even get in the mix.

I'll have a think before making any predictions - not that it'll make any difference.

The GP world is getting ready to move, Alex Briggs was saying he heads off tomorrow IIRC.

[Dadpole]

Honda or Duclattery according to the pundits. I will leave my (optomistic) pick until after FP2.

[Autech]

My virtual money is on Dovi for the win. It's been a long time coming. Eaahhhnoni will biff it, hope Suzuki have made lots of fairings for next year...

After that you'll have the Honda boys IF they can get the bike picked up and out of the corners, but only if.

[James Deuce]

It will rain and Jack Miller will win, solely to piss me off.

[Mental Trousers]

Hasn't been much noise about this, haven't seen anything on motogp.com. It is for 2017 though.

http://www.asphaltandrubber.com/motogp/ktm-moto2-2017-binder-luthi-ajo/

[pritch]

Hasn't been much noise about this, haven't seen anything on motogp.com. It is for 2017 though.

http://www.asphaltandrubber.com/motogp/ktm-moto2-2017-binder-luthi-ajo/

I can read the Asphalt and Rubber site but I can't read that link. It just shows as a page of gibberish.

KTM are getting involved in a big way. Rossi's SKY 46 team will be running KTMs in Moto3 too apparently. The more the merrier.

[EJK]

Forecast says rain.

Awwwww poor Lorenzo.

[Autech]

Forecast says rain.

Awwwww poor Lorenzo.

And Maverick. They melt in the rain!

[Mental Trousers]

I can read the Asphalt and Rubber site but I can't read that link. It just shows as a page of gibberish.

KTM are getting involved in a big way. Rossi's SKY 46 team will be running KTMs in Moto3 too apparently. The more the merrier.


Did you hear? KTM is working on Moto2 race bike, to compliment the Austrian brand’s move into the MotoGP Championship next year? We only learned about the project earlier this year in February, but KTM and WP suspension are supposedly quite far with their progress on the bike, and are now “ready to race” in earnest.

It might seem a little strange to see a KTM building a race bike chassis around a rival manufacturer’s engine (the Moto2 class is powered by slightly massaged Honda CBR600RR engines), but zie Austrian’s are serious about their Grand Prix racing presence, and feel that they need to be involved in all three of the championship’s classes.

KTM CEO Stefan Pierer recently talked to Germany’s Speedweek publication about the Moto2 project recently, where Pierer revealed that the Austrian brand will race in the Moto2 Championship starting in 2017, with a team lead by Aki Ajo.

Brad Binder and Tom Lüthi will be KTM’s Moto2 riders for the inaugural season.

Lüthi is currently 4th in the Moto2 Championship, and has six Moto2 race victories to his name. Meanwhile, Brad Binder has been impressing in the Moto3 Championship, which he currently leads with an impressive 47-point margin.

Assuming that WP has put together a solid race bike platform, and there’s no reason to believe they haven’t, KTM’s Moto2 racing team should be a strong contender out of the box.

The Moto2 Championship will only be Honda-powered through the 2018 season, a point that has been driven home by Honda’s recent abandonment of the 600cc supersport segment.

This means that from 2019 and onward, Moto2 will need a new engine supplier. Could today’s news signal what’s ahead for KTM? So far Pierer says there are no plans for a full KTM Moto2 bike, but never say never.

There's a mention of it buried in this one https://motomatters.com/analysis/2016/07/05/moto2_silly_season_who_replaces_rins.html

Found the article on MotoGP.com http://www.motogp.com/en/news/2016/01/31/wp-performance-systems-and-ktm-reveal-moto2-project/192165

[Crasherfromwayback]

Crazy Joe all the way.

[markbdaniels]

Hasn't been much noise about this, haven't seen anything on motogp.com. It is for 2017 though.

http://www.asphaltandrubber.com/motogp/ktm-moto2-2017-binder-luthi-ajo/
I'm going to have to start watching moto2 ;) up till now it's been moto3 - break - motogp for me...

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[James Deuce]

I'm going to have to start watching moto2 ;) up till now it's been moto3 - break - motogp for me...

Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk
Why? It's just another Honda among many, with no power, that will get backed into corners like a 450cc Motard by either a has been or a no-hoper.

I stick with the break. An extended toilet stop is more exciting and fulfilling than watching Moto2. Plus you have time to refill the fridge.

[markbdaniels]

Why? It's just another Honda among many, with no power, that will get backed into corners like a 450cc Motard by either a has been or a no-hoper.

I stick with the break. An extended toilet stop is more exciting and fulfilling than watching Moto2. Plus you have time to refill the fridge.
Yeah I agree, but I am a Binder fan... Apparently Honda is only making moto2 engines till 2018 - maybe KTM will step in?

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[Grumph]

There are plenty of names you'd only associate with F1 who have excess capacity at present for engine manufacture.
Due to the emphasis on hybrid technology which is at present only working in the hands of a very few engine manufacturers the ones who know quite a bit about conventional N/A engines are doing a bit of a starve...
If the FIM put engine supply for Moto 2 out to tender, don't be surprised to see some familiar names put in tenders...Business is business and engines are engines.

[Mental Trousers]

There are plenty of names you'd only associate with F1 who have excess capacity at present for engine manufacture.
Due to the emphasis on hybrid technology which is at present only working in the hands of a very few engine manufacturers the ones who know quite a bit about conventional N/A engines are doing a bit of a starve...
If the FIM put engine supply for Moto 2 out to tender, don't be surprised to see some familiar names put in tenders...Business is business and engines are engines.

That is the opportunity to get something much more inline with GP engines instead of a tweaked road engine. While they're at it they should penalise anyone that uses beam frames + telescopic forks. Try and get some innovation going in the class as that's one of the original goals of the class.

[Autech]

That is the opportunity to get something much more inline with GP engines instead of a tweaked road engine. While they're at it they should penalise anyone that uses beam frames + telescopic forks. Try and get some innovation going in the class as that's one of the original goals of the class.

Smartest thing this man has ever said. Give him a hat!

[pritch]

I don't understand the sour attitude to the Moto2 racing. Sure, Dorna wanted more power, but Honda didn't want the engines blowing up. Sadly the much hoped for innovation never eventuated. The main problem now is that Moto2 isn't a natural stepping stone between Moto3 and MotoGP. It's a blind alley, but it's what we have, so until it changes it'll have to do. Gives me something to do between Moto3 and the main event.

[Mental Trousers]

I get annoyed with people who trash Moto2 or WSBK or whatever cos it's not what they want. It's still bike racing and I love bike racing.

I watch all of the Moto2 races as well as MotoGP and Moto3. Some races are dull but others are awesome, same as the other classes.

However, with Moto2 I've been very disappointed that we haven't seen alsorts of different chassis, particularly front ends. Telescopic forks give me the shits. But anyone putting in the time, effort and money to develop something else to the point it can take on the established beam frame + telescopic forks is going to be losing for a long time. Not just that but there's lots of dead ends and pit falls to developing new stuff. The Elf bikes never lived up to the promise and, unfortunately, that soured things for a lot of others thinking of trying something different.

[Drew]

I get annoyed with people who trash Moto2 or WSBK or whatever cos it's not what they want. It's still bike racing and I love bike racing.

I watch all of the Moto2 races as well as MotoGP and Moto3. Some races are dull but others are awesome, same as the other classes.

However, with Moto2 I've been very disappointed that we haven't seen alsorts of different chassis, particularly front ends. Telescopic forks give me the shits. But anyone putting in the time, effort and money to develop something else to the point it can take on the established beam frame + telescopic forks is going to be losing for a long time. Not just that but there's lots of dead ends and pit falls to developing new stuff. The Elf bikes never lived up to the promise and, unfortunately, that soured things for a lot of others thinking of trying something different.
Why should any manufacturer try to develop something that hasn't ever been made to work though?

[Crasherfromwayback]

I get annoyed with people who trash Moto2 or WSBK or whatever cos it's not what they want. It's still bike racing and I love bike racing.

I watch all of the Moto2 races as well as MotoGP and Moto3. Some races are dull but others are awesome, same as the other classes.

.

So just because you like it, we all have to? I like most forms of motorcycle racing, but find Moto 2 shit. I also don't really care for drag racing. Superbikes I used to follow when Slighty and Crafar were involved, doesn't really interest me know. What's wrong with that? When the 250's were in action, they were one of my favs. So what. We all like or dislike what we do. Why get annoyed by others choices?

[Oscar]

So just because you like it, we all have to? I like most forms of motorcycle racing, but find Moto 2 shit. I also don't really care for drag racing. Superbikes I used to follow when Slighty and Crafar were involved, doesn't really interest me know. What's wrong with that? When the 250's were in action, they were one of my favs. So what. We all like or dislike what we do. Why get annoyed by others choices?

I think you're both singing the same song.
I also don't like SBK, and I don't always watch Moto2 (and I fucking HATE what F1 has become), but I don't go out of my way to bag either formula.

Moto2 is a flawed concept, a contrived middle child which needed to run to a price.
The paddock couldn't afford another prototype class.

The options discussed (amongst others) were injected two strokes and a class based on the Aprilia 550 V-Twin motor, but without factory support these wouldn't fly.

[James Deuce]

Run the Red Bull Cup as Moto3, run prototype 500cc twins as Moto2 (will still be faster than the 600s), and leave the current MotoGP class as the premier.

Would better match the market and allow manufacturer participation where it matters, with a cheaper entry level class.

I'm sour about Moto2 because it's boring and I have no idea what I'm looking at. You also see guys who went pretty OK in MotoGP floundering around at the back of the field if they pick a team who doesn't run the only chassis that works.

[Crasherfromwayback]

a class based on the Aprilia 550 V-Twin motor, but without factory support these wouldn't fly.

That thing is a fucking hand grenade.

[Oscar]

Run the Red Bull Cup as Moto3, run prototype 500cc twins as Moto2 (will still be faster than the 600s), and leave the current MotoGP class as the premier.

Would better match the market and allow manufacturer participation where it matters, with a cheaper entry level class.

I'm sour about Moto2 because it's boring and I have no idea what I'm looking at. You also see guys who went pretty OK in MotoGP floundering around at the back of the field if they pick a team who doesn't run the only chassis that works.

Who pays for the prototypes?
The factories have no interest in funding a smaller prototype class.

It is interesting in forums like this that two strong topics are "Moto2 is shit" and "how do I get MotoGP coverage for little or nothing".

[James Deuce]

Who pays for the prototypes?
The factories have no interest in funding a smaller prototype class.

It is interesting in forums like this that two strong topics are "Moto2 is shit" and "how do I get MotoGP coverage for little or nothing".

Fine. Don't run them. Something isn't better than nothing when a vocal portion of the target market is going "Moto2 is shit". I used to watch the 250s in preference to the 500s. I wasn't alone. The racing was better and they were a poofteenth behind the 500s on actual lap times whihc made them a useful stepping stone to the top level.

[Drew]

That thing is a fucking hand grenade.That's my understanding too.

Plus, twins are fucken poo. 848 Ducati lump is prolly even par with the current Moto2 bikes, but I doubt they could get the same reliability.


Who pays for the prototypes?
The factories have no interest in funding a smaller prototype class.

It is interesting in forums like this that two strong topics are "Moto2 is shit" and "how do I get MotoGP coverage for little or nothing".

Interesting how? When the racing is happening, it's more talked about than anything else on here.

[Oscar]

Interesting how? When the racing is happening, it's more talked about than anything else on here.

It was my clumsy way of saying that some of the people who complain about Moto2 are the same ones who complain about paying for coverage.

[Oscar]

Fine. Don't run them. Something isn't better than nothing when a vocal portion of the target market is going "Moto2 is shit". I used to watch the 250s in preference to the 500s. I wasn't alone. The racing was better and they were a poofteenth behind the 500s on actual lap times whihc made them a useful stepping stone to the top level.

I don't like Moto2.
You don't like Moto2.
That makes two us (maybe three with Crasher).

I don't think we're in the majority.

[Drew]

It was my clumsy way of saying that some of the people who complain about Moto2 are the same ones who complain about paying for coverage.

Moto2 is crap. I have sky sport for no other reason than MotoGP.

[ellipsis]

...I can see the point of Moto2, but I can't feel the 'thing' that makes me want to watch it for more than three to five laps...I have tried...

[Drew]

...I can see the point of Moto2, but I can't feel the 'thing' that makes me want to watch it for more than three to five laps...I have tried...

It's not a grand prix class, but the over regulation of the other two classes is making them less so as well.

[mr bucketracer]

Moto2 has the best riding and racing ..but don't know why i don't like it :doh:

[James Deuce]

I don't like Moto2.
You don't like Moto2.
That makes two us (maybe three with Crasher).

I don't think we're in the majority.

I didn't say majority, however, motorsport fans with a casual interest in motorcycle racing that I work with all say the same thing: They don't understand Moto2 and consequently don't watch because the teams don't resonate and riders never seem to progress to MotoGP and do anything remarkable, with a singular exception of course. Most of those casual fans have no idea Marquez the Elder raced Moto2.

[speights_bud]

Going in blind...

CJ
MM
VR
AD
DP

CJ is in there on the basis of new track win or bin...

[Mental Trousers]

Why should any manufacturer try to develop something that hasn't ever been made to work though?

There are better solutions but nobodies been willing to spend the money or time. The riders aren't interested in developing something either as they want to win now, not in a couple of years or so after the bugs have been worked out.

One of the reasons things like Moto2 and Moto3 are seen as inferior these days is the total lack of innovation going on. They're all cookie cutter bikes. Many of the iconic bikes of the past broke from the mold and did things a bit differently. The GSXR750, the original R1, the featherbed Nortons, the Ducati Monster etc. All did things differently and they set the standard for following bikes.


So just because you like it, we all have to? I like most forms of motorcycle racing, but find Moto 2 shit. I also don't really care for drag racing. Superbikes I used to follow when Slighty and Crafar were involved, doesn't really interest me know. What's wrong with that? When the 250's were in action, they were one of my favs. So what. We all like or dislike what we do. Why get annoyed by others choices?

Not saying everyone has to like them. What pisses me off about it all is the people with the rose tinted glasses saying things are shit compared to how they used to be, eg Moto2 is shit compared to 250GPs. The machinery in Moto2 is functional compared to the artwork that was some of the 250GPs but as for the racing itself the entire field is closer together now than they ever have been in the past.

[Drew]

There are better solutions but nobodies been willing to spend the money or time. The riders aren't interested in developing something either as they want to win now, not in a couple of years or so after the bugs have been worked out.

One of the reasons things like Moto2 and Moto3 are seen as inferior these days is the total lack of innovation going on. They're all cookie cutter bikes. Many of the iconic bikes of the past broke from the mold and did things a bit differently. The GSXR750, the original R1, the featherbed Nortons, the Ducati Monster etc. All did things differently and they set the standard for following bikes.



Not saying everyone has to like them. What pisses me off about it all is the people with the rose tinted glasses saying things are shit compared to how they used to be, eg Moto2 is shit compared to 250GPs. The machinery in Moto2 is functional compared to the artwork that was some of the 250GPs but as for the racing itself the entire field is closer together now than they ever have been in the past.
The 750R and R1 were pretty natural progressions I think.

The beam frame was out of the box thinking I suppose, given that early examples were pretty porky it's done well to become the norm.

But manufacturers have spent money on different front ends...they were all shit from a lap time perspective. The Britten was a pig according to everyone but Guy Martin, and his pedegree hardly rates him as an authority. The BMW thing just doesn't give confidence. The only way to know where the limit on that is when you fall on your face. The Honda thing was so fucken technical no one could understand it. I've never read what it rode like that I can remember.

Forks are fairly light, with GPS damper mapping can be made to do whatever they have to 99% of the time, and they're available the world over.

There's nowt need to go another way up front for the moment.

Exoskeleton monocoque incorporating the fairing would be where I saw it going next. Weight figures could be reduces to the point that it'd nearly need heated rims to get the tyres hot.

[Crasherfromwayback]

What pisses me off about it all is the people with the rose tinted glasses saying things are shit compared to how they used to be, eg Moto2 is shit compared to 250GPs.

but as for the racing itself the entire field is closer together now than they ever have been in the past.

It is.

And being closer together does not automatically make it better. 250 GP racing has been, and often was over the years, some of THE best racing I've ever seen.

[Mental Trousers]

The 750R and R1 were pretty natural progressions I think.

The beam frame was out of the box thinking I suppose, given that early examples were pretty porky it's done well to become the norm.

But manufacturers have spent money on different front ends...they were all shit from a lap time perspective. The Britten was a pig according to everyone but Guy Martin, and his pedegree hardly rates him as an authority. The BMW thing just doesn't give confidence. The only way to know where the limit on that is when you fall on your face. The Honda thing was so fucken technical no one could understand it. I've never read what it rode like that I can remember.

Forks are fairly light, with GPS damper mapping can be made to do whatever they have to 99% of the time, and they're available the world over.

There's nowt need to go another way up front for the moment.

Exoskeleton monocoque incorporating the fairing would be where I saw it going next. Weight figures could be reduces to the point that it'd nearly need heated rims to get the tyres hot.

Manufacturers have barely had a go and trying anything different. For racing only Elf paired with Honda have had a serious go at doing something different. Unfortunately, the designers were trying to use the same ideas for making cars handle properly, mostly eliminate the weight transference that comes with front end dive. These days there's really only Vyrus, but they're less interested in racing than they are on being in a high end niche market.

The main reason BMW ended up dropping the Duolever was cost. They couldn't make as much profit out of it as they could from forks and that's been the single biggest advantage forks have had over almost everything else. That and conservatism - it's really difficult to get people to change to something even if it's better.

I've ridden a Duolever bike and had a great time on it. Admittedly I wasn't exactly pushing the thing to the limits though so I don't know what they're like on the limits but it handled an emergency braking (heading down an on-ramp, looked right for a gap to merge, looked forward again and the bastard in front of me had hit the brakes) way better than anything else I'd ridden.


It is.

And being closer together does not automatically make it better. 250 GP racing has been, and often was over the years, some of THE best racing I've ever seen.

No doubt some of the best racing ever has been in the 250GPs. One thing I do regret is not having raced right through that era because everyone I see that got onto 125GP and 250GP bikes early have beautiful riding styles. That's something that made riding the GP bikes different to production bikes. These days it's easy to mistake Moto2 riders for WSS riders. There's little to differentiate them now.

Doesn't stop me getting annoyed at people wahhing on about it all though. What we've got is Moto2 and GP bikes will never go back to being 250GP bikes. I want to see change and not just in the front forks but the engines as well. I'd love to see 4 strokes, 2 strokes, rotaries and whatever else people come up with racing each other.

[pritch]

I'd love to see 4 strokes, 2 strokes, rotaries and whatever else people come up with racing each other.

That would be expensive, they will settle for cheap, or as cheap as possible.

Many, but not all, of the recent decisions about rules have been to lower the cost of racing. At least one was to appear politically correct: the lowering of the fuel limits which cost shit loads because every team had banks of refrigerators to store fuel at low temperatures. Id rather watch a race than an economy run. Thank God they upped the limit.

To stop excessive expenditure on dual clutch technology, which as far as I know Honda alone had, DCT was banned. So Honda developed a seamless gearbox which probably cost them, and everybody else who has one now, millions to develop.

The most recent example was the banning of wings. In addition to safety concerns people were concerned about development costs. Unlike a wing on a car the bike wings are constantly changng their angle and wind tunnel time to explore all that in depth would have run to more millions.

So I guess we might as well enjoy what we have. Or not, if that's what turns your crank.

And the weather in Austria is cold and wet, but it's still Thursday, if only just.

[Mental Trousers]

That would be expensive, they will settle for cheap, or as cheap as possible.

Many, but not all, of the recent decisions about rules have been to lower the cost of racing. At least one was to appear politically correct: the lowering of the fuel limits which cost shit loads because every team had banks of refrigerators to store fuel at low temperatures. Id rather watch a race than an economy run. Thank God they upped the limit.

To stop excessive expenditure on dual clutch technology, which as far as I know Honda alone had, DCT was banned. So Honda developed a seamless gearbox which probably cost them, and everybody else who has one now, millions to develop.

The most recent example was the banning of wings. In addition to safety concerns people were concerned about development costs. Unlike a wing on a car the bike wings are constantly changng their angle and wind tunnel time to explore all that in depth would have run to more millions.

So I guess we might as well enjoy what we have. Or not, if that's what turns your crank.

And the weather in Austria is cold and wet, but it's still Thursday, if only just.

Yep, any change is expensive. Often rules aimed at making things cheaper backfire and teams spend way more on the loopholes/circumventing/alternatives.

I'm looking forward to the weekends racing. Watching the first round at a new/different track is always interesting.

[pritch]

Ahhh stuff it, here goes now't.

Iannone
Marquez
Dovi
Rossi
Pirro

Or something...

[roogazza]

Michelin bringing a couple of new rears,I'm hopeful ??? :sweatdrop:shifty:

[Grumph]

Exoskeleton monocoque incorporating the fairing would be where I saw it going next. Weight figures could be reduces to the point that it'd nearly need heated rims to get the tyres hot.

Given the ever greater pressure to make engines last longer, this does actually become possible - the exoskeleton bit anyway...
One major problem when Honda did it with the NR500 was the time it took to get to any engine problems - and it had plenty.
If your engine MUST do X number of meetings before replacement, access is less of a problem.

Still doubt it'll happen as "what wins this year is last year's bike plus 5%" Mike Sinclair I think...

[Dadpole]

One major problem when Honda did it with the NR500 was the time it took to get to any engine problems

An additional problem was a relatively small bin could write off the frame

[Drew]

Given the ever greater pressure to make engines last longer, this does actually become possible - the exoskeleton bit anyway...
One major problem when Honda did it with the NR500 was the time it took to get to any engine problems - and it had plenty.
If your engine MUST do X number of meetings before replacement, access is less of a problem.

Still doubt it'll happen as "what wins this year is last year's bike plus 5%" Mike Sinclair I think...Interlocking panels with modern composites could be removable without too much hassle. Carbon Kevlar wasn't what it is today in the NR days.

I wonder if the heated rims I joked about might actually have merit bow. Dani could do with more tyre temp.

[Drew]

An additional problem was a relatively small bin could write off the frame

A small bin fucks a race anyway. It only has to get back to the pits.

[Bass]

I wonder if the heated rims I joked about might actually have merit bow. Dani could do with more tyre temp.


It would be a really interesting technical challenge, persuading the tyres to conduct enough heat from the bead to the working surface. It might even need special heat conducting material to be built into the tyre. Then there's the issue of getting sufficient energy to the rim.

I wouldn't mind spending a few years working on that if someone would pay me.

Don't chuck your electric warmers just yet.

[Drew]

It would be a really interesting technical challenge, persuading the tyres to conduct enough heat from the bead to the working surface. It might even need special heat conducting material to be built into the tyre. Then there's the issue of getting sufficient energy to the rim.

I wouldn't mind spending a few years working on that if someone would pay me.

Don't chuck your electric warmers just yet.
Heating the surface is not the battle. It's the carcass ya want warmed.

[actungbaby]

Yeah I agree, but I am a Binder fan... Apparently Honda is only making moto2 engines till 2018 - maybe KTM will step in?

Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk

Thats till contract ends i should imagine they get another new one this one been extended till 2018 . with so few breakages

and million kms of racing and practice i doubt many other brands match that. but then again the cbr 600 rr getting droped from the range

when 2017 cbr 1000 rr comes out for next year. and teams voted to keep it one engine forumla for cost reasons

From what i was told ktm copyed honda designs for years in the dirtbike class anyways. someone told me gearboxs are virtually the same

[actungbaby]

There are better solutions but nobodies been willing to spend the money or time. The riders aren't interested in developing something either as they want to win now, not in a couple of years or so after the bugs have been worked out.

One of the reasons things like Moto2 and Moto3 are seen as inferior these days is the total lack of innovation going on. They're all cookie cutter bikes. Many of the iconic bikes of the past broke from the mold and did things a bit differently. The GSXR750, the original R1, the featherbed Nortons, the Ducati Monster etc. All did things differently and they set the standard for following bikes.

those are all production bikes apart from the norton not pure designed for racing but agree totally with the sentiment.

till those late 80,s designs superbikes where big eninges with crap roadbike deisgn chassis from previous decade design.

the plus side where got the numbers of riders avaible to compete and learn.


Not saying everyone has to like them. What pisses me off about it all is the people with the rose tinted glasses saying things are shit compared to how they used to be, eg Moto2 is shit compared to 250GPs. The machinery in Moto2 is functional compared to the artwork that was some of the 250GPs but as for the racing itself the entire field is closer together now than they ever have been in the past.

yes in the past even in the 50,s 60,s it was few riders on works bikes of into the distance apart from wet races and some brillence

from a very very talented people. i think was phil read said the ikes of even mike the bike and other of the era where from very privilleded up bringings and familys .

[actungbaby]

Heating the surface is not the battle. It's the carcass ya want warmed.

Thats called sun bathing mate and my carcass bit umm bigger than most lol

Thanks goodness sanity has returned

http://www.crash.net/motogp/news/232715/1/red-bull-ring-changed-due-to-safety-concerns.html

I thought going back to the 70,s when barry sheene once quipped if you crashed in germany they be looking for you for weeks in the trees.

Very amazing loctation and sencery mind you in austria makes change from desert in quatar. ;-)

many many riders lost there lives over the years before some great men fought with terrible FIM that used to control the sport and of course prommotors

did just cared about the money . the attitude if you had any concerns where you where not brave enough and chould choose not to race.

I still remember one dark day in late 80,s when group of top 500cc riders booed the ppor sods that raced at misno after risked themselves.

The rider whent on to outlast them all and win superbike world title . forget his name was itailian.

[actungbaby]

The 750R and R1 were pretty natural progressions I think.

The beam frame was out of the box thinking I suppose, given that early examples were pretty porky it's done well to become the norm.

But manufacturers have spent money on different front ends...they were all shit from a lap time perspective. The Britten was a pig according to everyone but Guy Martin, and his pedegree hardly rates him as an authority. The BMW thing just doesn't give confidence. The only way to know where the limit on that is when you fall on your face. The Honda thing was so fucken technical no one could understand it. I've never read what it rode like that I can remember.
yeah i read that too dont know meant it didnt have the turn in speed or just bad manners who knows.
the elf /honda thing ;-) elf has patent of the single sided swing arm on my vfr bit heavy as a design on the vfr .

"steering steering speed is the answer or lack of according to rocket ron haslem who was reguarded as very good test rider
as well as poduim finisher on the three cylinder 500cc honda gp bike.

just cant get those centre steer bikes to match the telelscopic tubes . there flawed design but still work best for bikes on the lap watch.

he worked his arse of to get the thing competive. " from what arm chair enginner has read ;-)

Forks are fairly light, with GPS damper mapping can be made to do whatever they have to 99% of the time, and they're available the world over.

There's nowt need to go another way up front for the moment.

Exoskeleton monocoque incorporating the fairing would be where I saw it going next. Weight figures could be reduces to the point that it'd nearly need heated rims to get the tyres hot.

what about the suzuki GB design back in the day carbon tub spent fortune of there money suzuki factor took over crushed it ;-)

"Some of it seems to be stick with tradion and what looks good esp on production bikes average punter doesint like so called diffrent.

Must say the bmw front ends look over busy to me and look blah . if i ever won lotto arieal ace bike i think stick with fork tube option.

Girder front end look heavy and apart from great front brake preformance well lack of dive.

It seems to come down to front end feel or lack of but is that just case of getting mind past how things used to be (road use)

they say the latest Bimota tesi is actually great bike all these years later (20 plus )

I should imagine if you read up what kevin cameron has written you get good grasp the issue,s

[pritch]

BT Sport took over British coverage of MotoGP from Eurosport a couple of years back. From time to time I see a link that appears interesting but if I click on it it all that appears is a notice "Not available in your area". Bugger!

Today I discovered the BT Sport Podcast, it's available here: https://itunes.apple.com/gb/podcast/bt-sport-motogp-podcast/id1095253573?mt=2
You can also get it as an app from wherever you get your Android stuff.

The BT commentary team comprises mainly:
Gavin Emmett who used to work for Dorna,
Keith Heuwen who is an ex racer and an experienced commentator,
Julian Ryder who has been commentating forever.

Others such as Suzy Perry, Colin Edwards, James Toseland etc apparently make appearances from time to time.

At about thirty minutes the BT Sport podcast is shorter than some of the others so it's easier to fit into your life. The latest issue looks at the forthcoming Austrian GP.

Photos from Austria show Redbull have been spending up large. There is a tunnel under the track, that is now named "The Walk of Heroes" and the walls feature huge photos of motorcycle and motor racing stars of the past. The facilities are reported to be new and of a high standard, although safety remains a concern. Stoner got the ball rolling but others have snce chimed in. The two main concerns being turns 8 and 10. The latter has been modified, although the modification appears to be painted on. Of turn 8 Rossi said something to the effect that at that point the bikes are going very fast and that wall is very close.

This is the fastest track on the GP calendar and there will likely be a new lap record set this weekend - weather permitting. The existing motorcycle lap record is held by Troy Bayliss.

[Crasherfromwayback]

Qual 1...

323831

Track looks fucking awesome!

[mulletman]

DP had a wtf crash n slide...his bike landed on top of the tyre wall ! Lucky for Dani he just slid and ok.

[Crasherfromwayback]

DP had a wtf crash n slide...his bike landed on top of the tyre wall ! Lucky for Dani he just slid and ok.

Yeah was a nasty looking crash.

[pritch]

Well there's a surprise, fastest in FP1 Maverick Vinales. Go Suzuki!

[pritch]

Lots on overnight. Eugene Laverty and Iannone had a row. Laverty was offended that Iannone told him to get out of his way. Iannone thinks he may not have expressed himself clearly as his English is not great.

Jack Miller said he had a sore jaw because he had ridden the practice session with his teeth clenched. He rates the track "Fucking scary". And he's one of the two in the field that have been there before, although both he and Rossi were on small bikes on their previous visits.

Dorna are to introduce communications from the pit that will appear on the instrumentation of the bike. There was a chorus of "Ahhh bloody Rossi..." but Mat Oxley says Dorna have been working on this for a year or more. Basically the info that is currently communicated by pitboard will appear to the rider on the bike as well, and the TV producers having the option for it to appear on your screen at home.

The Ducati riders have moved up on the timesheets but Vinales is still quick. Poor Pedro is down in 19th.

Must set the TV to record qualifying...

[BMWST?]

BT Sport took over British coverage of MotoGP from Eurosport a couple of years back. From time to time I see a link that appears interesting but if I click on it it all that appears is a notice "Not available in your area". Bugger!

Today I discovered the BT Sport Podcast, it's available here: https://itunes.apple.com/gb/podcast/bt-sport-motogp-podcast/id1095253573?mt=2
You can also get it as an app from wherever you get your Android stuff.

The BT commentary team comprises mainly:
Gavin Emmett who used to work for Dorna,
Keith Heuwen who is an ex racer and an experienced commentator,
Julian Ryder who has been commentating forever.

Others such as Suzy Perry, Colin Edwards, James Toseland etc apparently make appearances from time to time.

At about thirty minutes the BT Sport podcast is shorter than some of the others so it's easier to fit into your life. The latest issue looks at the forthcoming Austrian GP.

Photos from Austria show Redbull have been spending up large. There is a tunnel under the track, that is now named "The Walk of Heroes" and the walls feature huge photos of motorcycle and motor racing stars of the past. The facilities are reported to be new and of a high standard, although safety remains a concern. Stoner got the ball rolling but others have snce chimed in. The two main concerns being turns 8 and 10. The latter has been modified, although the modification appears to be painted on. Of turn 8 Rossi said something to the effect that at that point the bikes are going very fast and that wall is very close.

This is the fastest track on the GP calendar and there will likely be a new lap record set this weekend - weather permitting. The existing motorcycle lap record is held by Troy Bayliss.

Try the paddock pass pod cast too

[pritch]

Try the paddock pass pod cast too

And also the Motopod one - time permitting. I tend to listen to these while doing chores.

[Dadpole]

Meanwhile: At the pointy end I would not have a clue to pick for top 3.

I would pick a Honda (MM), a Ducati(AD) and a Yamaha (VR).

The order is a bridge too far for me though there will be much cheering at my place if Dovi gets the win.

[Crasherfromwayback]

Meanwhile: At the pointy end I would not have a clue to pick for top 3.

I would pick a Honda (MM), a Ducati(AD) and a Yamaha (VR).

The order is a bridge too far for me though there will be much cheering at my place if Dovi gets the win.

Barring rain or Crazy Joe cleaning both he and Dovi out, I'd say nothing will beat the Ducati's there. MM may be an outside chance, but he's actually racing smart this year and has his eyes on title #3. Good boy.


Dovi and Crazy Joe are both paying $3.25. Bet your house on it.

[EJK]

Lorenzo DNF

[pritch]

Apparently Lorenzo is still wrestling with his demons as is Pedrosa. One of the pundits, can't remember who, said that they both have similar but different problems. Neither can get heat into the tyres; Pedrosa's problems stem from his riding style, Lorenzo's are more set-up related.

At the test the air temperature was in the 30s the track temp mid 40s. The morning temps Friday were half that. The track is among hills, quite scenic but the weather can be fickle.

Ii is noted that Rossi when posting his customary practice photos does not refer to the track by the official title, "Redbull Ring". I guess it'd be surprising if any of the Monster sponsored riders did.

It could be confusing but Crutchlow's helmet is pink this time out, in honour of his new daughter Willow.

[actungbaby]

DP had a wtf crash n slide...his bike landed on top of the tyre wall ! Lucky for Dani he just slid and ok.

Wow that been something esle good he is okay that been itresting talk with the team oh the bikes up there guys

[actungbaby]

Apparently Lorenzo is still wrestling with his demons as is Pedrosa. One of the pundits, can't remember who, said that they both have similar but different problems. Neither can get heat into the tyres; Pedrosa's problems stem from his riding style, Lorenzo's are more set-up related.

At the test the air temperature was in the 30s the track temp mid 40s. The morning temps Friday were half that. The track is among hills, quite scenic but the weather can be fickle.

Ii is noted that Rossi when posting his customary practice photos does not refer to the track by the official title, "Redbull Ring". I guess it'd be surprising if any of the Monster sponsored riders did.

It could be confusing but Crutchlow's helmet is pink this time out, in honour of his new daughter Willow.

Thats cool about his duaghter my heart says dovi just so team red can have a win.

But keep thinking it be

1. rossi

2. mm

3. dovi

[Crasherfromwayback]

Thats cool about his duaghter my heart says dovi just so team red can have a win.

But keep thinking it be

1. rossi

2. mm

3. dovi

No way a Yamaha is gonna win there unless it's wet.

[Drew]

What sky chanel is the GP on? All I can find is the fucking Olympics, and I hate that shit.

[pritch]

What sky chanel is the GP on? All I can find is the fucking Olympics, and I hate that shit.

There seem to be so many things that arouse your ire. :whistle:

Qualifying is on SKY Sport 1, 2400 Hrs tonght. (Both of Mickey's hands pointing at the 12.) :devil2:

Race coverage: SKY Sport 2, 8.45PM Sunday.

[Drew]

There seem to be so many things that arouse your ire. :whistle:

Qualifying is on SKY Sport 1, 2400 Hrs tonght. (Both of Mickey's hands pointing at the 12.) :devil2:

Race coverage: SKY Sport 2, 8.45PM Sunday.

Yip, I'm almost always angry.

Cheers.

[Crasherfromwayback]

Yip, I'm almost always angry.

Cheers.

I would be too if I had a such a small knob. :bleh:

[Drew]

I would be too if I had a such a small knob. :bleh:

I accepted my baby dick years ago.

[mulletman]

[ Crasherfromwayback ...or Crazy Joe cleaning both he and Dovi out, ]

How bout MM almost took DP out ! man that was close... they both lucky to make Q2

[EJK]

Looks like it could be battling of two Ducatis. As long as Iannone don't torpedo down Dovi my money is on them 1st and 2nd finish.

Looks like Lorenzo did pretty good.

[pritch]

How bout MM almost took DP out ! man that was close... they both lucky to make Q2

Apparently MM dislocated his shoulder. he popped it back and had it strapped but it might be bloody sore tomorrow.

Turns out that he also received a blow to the head. He was taken to hospital by ambulance for a check but says he hopes to be ready for qualifying.

[speights_bud]

DP had a wtf crash n slide...his bike landed on top of the tyre wall ! Lucky for Dani he just slid and ok.
Just watched it a couple of times. Wouldn't be surprised if there was some kind of electronic/mechanical/setup whoopsie there. Or is it just that michelins are still shit?

[Dadpole]

Just watched Moto3 qualifying. I think we will have another classic race. Looks like slipstreaming will be the order of the day. :banana:

[mulletman]

Apparently MM dislocated his shoulder. he popped it back and had it strapped but it might be bloody sore tomorrow.

Turns out that he also received a blow to the head. He was taken to hospital by ambulance for a check but says he hopes to be ready for qualifying.

Well it didnt slow him up too much...but yeah race day and 28 hard out laps i think a top 5 - 6 would be an ok result,

Dukes looking waaay good with the Suzukis hanging in there.

[pritch]

Rossi was saying he didn't think he could stay with the Ducati riders on the straights. So naturally he splits the two factory Ducs on the front row. :whistle:

[mulletman]

Shit that was a fairly tense Q2 session with the Yamahas almost snatching pole..

MM had another one of his miracle front end saves , now thats gonna hurt more for tommoro.

[Berries]

What sky chanel is the GP on? All I can find is the fucking Olympics, and I hate that shit.
Try channel 81.

[Drew]

Great qualifying session. I really thought Lorenzo had done enough.

[pritch]

Romano Fenati can be brilliant on his day but it would seem that everything has to be in his favour for it to be his day. A major hiccough now though, he has been suspended from the SKY VR-46 team for disciplinary reasons following 'repeated' behaviour offences involving team members.

That could turn out to be a wake up call - or the end of a promising career.

[malcy25]

Just watched it a couple of times. Wouldn't be surprised if there was some kind of electronic/mechanical/setup whoopsie there. Or is it just that michelins are still shit?

Nah, just DP's inability to get tyres to stay warm. Not specifically anything he does, just he's so light. His tyres were coming back colder than when he went out after the early cold sessions which were 9 degrees ambient temp.

[malcy25]

Someone asked a while back about which way Iannone "swings". This should answer it

http://www.superbikeplanet.com/image/2016/motogp/stria/1/2.htm

[puddytat]

Well Im going to take a punt.....
Rossi
Dovi
Vinales....
Lorenzo
Crutchlow
Joe.....as much as I like the guy, to keep it together for the race ?...yeah nah.

[roogazza]

Rossi was saying he didn't think he could stay with the Ducati riders on the straights. So naturally he splits the two factory Ducs on the front row. :whistle:

Great stuff, lets see what #46 can do with 28 laps. :banana::banana:

[speights_bud]

Someone asked a while back about which way Iannone "swings". This should answer it

http://www.superbikeplanet.com/image/2016/motogp/stria/1/2.htm
I'm not sure if that really helps at all... 'gal pal' is that hot chick mate coz you swing the other way, or is it girlfriend but not official/journo trying to be funny?

Not that I really give a crap either way.

[Crasherfromwayback]

Might have to eat my own words there. The Yamaha boys did great to get up to speed. And that Old Dog will be sniffing round big time. Hats off to them. MM dislocates a shoulder and comes back well. Tough cunt.

[steveyb]

Someone asked a while back about which way Iannone "swings". This should answer it

http://www.superbikeplanet.com/image/2016/motogp/stria/1/2.htm

Remind me again why I live in this godforsaken Klingon outpost????

[steveyb]

Apparently Lorenzo is still wrestling with his demons as is Pedrosa. One of the pundits, can't remember who, said that they both have similar but different problems. Neither can get heat into the tyres; Pedrosa's problems stem from his riding style, Lorenzo's are more set-up related.

At the test the air temperature was in the 30s the track temp mid 40s. The morning temps Friday were half that. The track is among hills, quite scenic but the weather can be fickle.

Ii is noted that Rossi when posting his customary practice photos does not refer to the track by the official title, "Redbull Ring". I guess it'd be surprising if any of the Monster sponsored riders did.

It could be confusing but Crutchlow's helmet is pink this time out, in honour of his new daughter Willow.

The Michelin front does not heat up as fast or as well as the Bridgestone did.
The Yamaha is longer and 'better' balanced than the Honda and Ducati, therefore does not put the same weight onto the front end.
Therefore a balanced rider like George who uses smooth fast lines is struggling to heat the front and therefore has reduced grip and feel and the tyre will be feeling like it is washing out all the time, at least when the track is cool.
Dani is having the same problems he has had his whole MotoGP career, the same as Toni Elias. Their extreme small size causes issues weighting the tyres sufficiently and they have insufficient mass to climb onto the front of the bike to help. Bridgestone (or was it Michelin??) made special tyres for Elias back when he was doing well. When the control tyres came in he simply drifted away. Dani is having the same issues and the bike is not helping.

[Autech]

Romano Fenati can be brilliant on his day but it would seem that everything has to be in his favour for it to be his day. A major hiccough now though, he has been suspended from the SKY VR-46 team for disciplinary reasons following 'repeated' behaviour offences involving team members.

That could turn out to be a wake up call - or the end of a promising career.

Always seemed a bit of a spoilt brat to me who had a lot of pressure to perform but didn't deliver...

Gunna be real tired watchin live tonight but can't miss it!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[actungbaby]

Rossi was saying he didn't think he could stay with the Ducati riders on the straights. So naturally he splits the two factory Ducs on the front row. :whistle:

Was good watch i thought yeah i know i wonder if he says that as smoke and mirrors or just motivation to do better.

never can write off Jl didnt expect that . sure is werid cc can have more speed than factory honda,s .

have there more up to date mods.

to tame power robed them of top end. crikey they used talk Honda lane know the suzuki smoking them ;-) embarrsing to be honda fan boy.

it used to be germany and austria the two smoke nsr 500 ruled.

In the old days they used to have jet the carbs diffrent on the long run throught the trees becuase said more oxygen from the bloody trees.

[actungbaby]

Romano Fenati can be brilliant on his day but it would seem that everything has to be in his favour for it to be his day. A major hiccough now though, he has been suspended from the SKY VR-46 team for disciplinary reasons following 'repeated' behaviour offences involving team members.

That could turn out to be a wake up call - or the end of a promising career.

When you read that you alwys think female team members when its a bloke just poilte way saying bit of a handsy perv.

[speights_bud]

Moto3 delivers again. 👍

Does anyone else's live feed fuck out and go to shit quality in the last few laps of moto3 every week? I'm on fibre and can still stream HD YouTube properly.

Fucking sick of it,almost so bad you can't see who's who

[Warr]

Moto3 delivers again. 👍

Does anyone else's live feed fuck out and go to shit quality in the last few laps of moto3 every week? I'm on fibre and can still stream HD YouTube properly.

Fucking sick of it,almost so bad you can't see who's who
Running fibre here ... Manually switched to up the quality and runs sweet here :)

[EJK]

Wonder how Zarco will do if he moves up to motogp.

[Crasherfromwayback]

Wonder how Zarco will do *when* he moves up to motogp.

Fixed that for you.

[SPman]

Smokin' Joe all the way....stiff shit Dani!

[mulletman]

Ducati gave a great package and the Andreas delivered :niceone:

[Crasherfromwayback]

First race in a while I've taken money off the TAB.

[EJK]

First race in a while I've taken money off the TAB.

Did you bet your house?

[Crasherfromwayback]

Did you bet your house?

Not mine to bet... :innocent:

[pritch]

Petrucci has been "fined" three grid positions at his next start for punting Laverty off the track at the last corner. That was a pity really 'cause Laverty was having a good weekend. He rides a Ducati that belongs in their museum and the team is severely cash strapped to the point that he must be considering any offer of a competitive ride in WSBK where at least he could expect to be paid.

The SKY VR-46 team will release a press statement when they have decided what they are doing about Fenati. Whatever the nature of his sinning he had ignored two warnings. They did point out that his relationship with the other riders was good, the problem is his treatment of other team members.
Who knows? Achtungbaby may heve been right, or it may simply be that deep down Fenati is just an arsehole?

I remember reading a piece of advice from a former rider to the effect that riders should always remember they are just an employee. Some might get led astray by reading their own publicity?

[roogazza]

Petrucci has been "fined" three grid positions at his next start for punting Laverty off the track at the last corner. That was a pity really 'cause Laverty was having a good weekend. He rides a Ducati that belongs in their museum and the team is severely cash strapped to the point that he must be considering any offer of a competitive ride in WSBK where at least he could expect to be paid.

The SKY VR-46 team will release a press statement when they have decided what they are doing about Fenati. Whatever the nature of his sinning he had ignored two warnings. They did point out that his relationship with the other riders was good, the problem is his treatment of other team members.
Who knows? Achtungbaby may heve been right, or it may simply be that deep down Fenati is just an arsehole?

I remember reading a piece of advice from a former rider to the effect that riders should always remember they are just an employee. Some might get led astray by reading their own publicity?
Always funny to me, when I see little fellas stomping around looking angry.
Did ya see the little Moto3 guy, Quatra fonic or some such, stomping into his pit ? :lol:

Nick Harris and mates were their normal selves. :facepalm:

Thought the main event a bit of a procession,good ol Iannone tho.

[sugilite]

Got to hand it to Pete on this one, he called it perfectly with crazy joe.
I thought he would stuff it up in some way or another. Well done to him.
Thought MM comments after were pretty awesome too. Blame the arm? No, Blame the fact Honda did not test? no again.
Was not a MM fan last year, but this years model is very impressive both on and off the track.

[Crasherfromwayback]

Thought MM comments after were pretty awesome too. Blame the arm? No, Blame the fact Honda did not test? no again.
Was not a MM fan last year, but this years model is very impressive both on and off the track.

They boy's grown up a lot hasn't he. Many more titles will come his way. Barring serious injury or burnout, think we'll be seeing Rossi's number of titles eclipsed.

[Badjelly]

Always funny to me, when I see little fellas stomping around looking angry.

I don't think it has much to do with the size of the bloke. Yesterday evening I was watching a replay of the Olympic 85kg men's weightlifting (yeah, I know, but the MotoGP hadn't started yet). One of the contestants failed a couple of lifts and ended up with a lower total than he wanted. On the way back through the tunnel he kicked his belt 5m and generally acted pissed off. It reminded me of my four-year-old grandson the other day when he found his potato chips were broken. And in both cases, I felt like saying, "Look, mate, we see that you're upset about something and it really matters to you, but it doesn't matter to me all that much, so just keep it to yourself, eh." I didn't have an opportunity to say this to the 85kg weightlifter in Rio, and I didn't say it to my grandson...I just let his father fuss over his hurt feelings and groaned inwardly. (Sometimes you just have to keep quiet.)

Tantrums? I'm over them, whoever throws them.

[Autech]

Awesome racing, track was quite good in bringing the riders together for battles, how good is that Binder this year?

Was gutted for Dovi not to get the win, I think his bike may have swapped maps at the end to save fuel as he was massively slower than Joe in the first sectors but made it back up on the bends. Good riding by both of them, shame Rossi couldn't get near enough to have a crack at George, but that's racing.

Dani's team need to do something ASAP to get heat into his tyres, once they are warm he's as quick as anyone, it's just taking too damn long.
How's he supposed to put in a rocket quali lap if his tyres aren't up to temp?

Overall a good GP, lets hope they do some work on the run offs over the year to make it safer.

[Crasherfromwayback]

Dani's team need to do something ASAP to get heat into his tyres, once they are warm he's as quick as anyone, it's just taking too damn long.
How's he supposed to put in a rocket quali lap if his tyres aren't up to temp?

.

Could always add ballast to get him and bike up to the weight of the others...

[Autech]

Could always add ballast to get him and bike up to the weight of the others...

I was thinking that meself lol, slip some heavier body armour in his leathers. Either that or lower the minimum tyre pressure they are allowed to run. Seems the 60-70kg mark is the perfect balance between power/weight n maintaining tyre temp


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Crasherfromwayback]

I was thinking that meself lol, slip some heavier body armour in his leathers. Either that or lower the minimum tyre pressure they are allowed to run.

Nah. Don't want to be spooning a tyre off a rim. Think Spies did a few years back on his R1?

[roogazza]

I don't think it has much to do with the size of the bloke. Yesterday evening I was watching a replay of the Olympic 85kg men's weightlifting (yeah, I know, but the MotoGP hadn't started yet). One of the contestants failed a couple of lifts and ended up with a lower total than he wanted. On the way back through the tunnel he kicked his belt 5m and generally acted pissed off. It reminded me of my four-year-old grandson the other day when he found his potato chips were broken. And in both cases, I felt like saying, "Look, mate, we see that you're upset about something and it really matters to you, but it doesn't matter to me all that much, so just keep it to yourself, eh." I didn't have an opportunity to say this to the 85kg weightlifter in Rio, and I didn't say it to my grandson...I just let his father fuss over his hurt feelings and groaned inwardly. (Sometimes you just have to keep quiet.)

Tantrums? I'm over them, whoever throws them.

The beauty of being a Grandad huh ? I bite my lip a lot,different generation I guess.
But you do get to give them back !!! :laugh:

[puddytat]

Moto3 delivers again. ��

Does anyone else's live feed fuck out and go to shit quality in the last few laps of moto3 every week? I'm on fibre and can still stream HD YouTube properly.

Fucking sick of it,almost so bad you can't see who's who

Yep, mine turned to shit too. But I'm on Vodafone Mobile.....Seems that moto3 is the worst of the 3 races but it slowly improves the latter it gets. I put it down to too many users on line & as parents & brats go nonnighs, it lightens the load on the system.
I know that when they went 3g with the networks that they didn't realise that so many people would be streaming content .Supposedly the usage exceeds the design parameters.

Great racing though....I watched moto2 & 3 last night, both were prone to stalling or jerky coverage. Watched Motogp this arvo & it was crystal clear....

[pritch]

Nah. Don't want to be spooning a tyre off a rim. Think Spies did a few years back on his R1?

There were a couple of exploding tyres last year you'll recall: seem to recall a photo of Haydens bruised back, Scott Redding might have been another? A new minimum tyre pressure rule was introduced IIRC.

[speights_bud]

Yep, mine turned to shit too. But I'm on Vodafone Mobile.....Seems that moto3 is the worst of the 3 races but it slowly improves the latter it gets. I put it down to too many users on line & as parents & brats go nonnighs, it lightens the load on the system.
I know that when they went 3g with the networks that they didn't realise that so many people would be streaming content .Supposedly the usage exceeds the design parameters.

Great racing though....I watched moto2 & 3 last night, both were prone to stalling or jerky coverage. Watched Motogp this arvo & it was crystal clear....

Yea I'm starting to think that it is a problem at their end, a year or two ago it definitely was. Something to do with it bouncing through an Aussie server, lots of people moaning online. (The American rounds have always been a bit shit for me, or its their camera gear over there).

Seeing how I can get my 28-30mb/s down and 9-10mb/s up speeds and still stream youtube in HD I am pretty certain it is not at my end. Can stream all the races no problem at any other time after the fact as well. Made me wonder if theres something about the times in europe etc where people are logging in to the end of Moto3, Aussie it would be around 8 O'clock local time... Anyway Just got to persist with it....

Bring on next round!

Oh and I called Crazy Joe first so :bleh: (even though I fucked the rest up)
Jorge surprised me, actually felt good for him, which is weird coz i'm not exactly a fan.

[Autech]

You guys having streaming issues should try an ethernet cable just to rule out your WIFI.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[pritch]

I'm not sure about the speed being related to how many people are online, although you'd think that was the case.

I did a speed test latish last night, after the little buggers had gone to bed, fastest ever 93mbps. Earlier this evening I did a test and it was only 83. Have just done one at 11.00PM and it was 79. Unless the kids all stayed up late just to piss me off, the little buggers should be fast asleep.

[Bykmad]

I started watching the MotoGP race (feed from MotoGP.com) using Chromecast via wifi. The TV would hang up and pixilate while the Laptop played perfectly. I disconnected Chromecast and used an HDMI cable to connect laptop to TV. Perfect.

[roogazza]

Sky is your friend,you pays your money !

As I said before,biggest negative for me is the commentators.
Coverage is great tho,thanks SKY.
By the way I thought the Moto3 race the best of the lot in Austria.

Roll on Brno !!!!! :laugh:

[EJK]

OK so moving on to Czech... Tonnes of smooth 6/8 left right corners. Oh, it's got Lorenzo's name written all over it!

I'm going blind on this one. If dry...
1. JL
2. VR
3. MM

Hoping to see good battle among the three, unless Lorenzo starts from pole and wins the race by himself (boring!).

[pritch]

Overnight our time there was a Moto2 test in Austria, the weather was not kind with rain and thunderstorms intruding.

A photograph indicated that Tech 3 were testing a Kalex. That's OK if they were testing to anable comparisons with their own frame, but it would be sad if Tech 3 were considering switching to Kalex. That'd make Moto2 very close to a one engine, one frame, class. The only difference would be the paint jobs.

[McWild]

Overnight our time there was a Moto2 test in Austria, the weather was not kind with rain and thunderstorms intruding.

A photograph indicated that Tech 3 were testing a Kalex. That's OK if they were testing to anable comparisons with their own frame, but it would be sad if Tech 3 were considering switching to Kalex. That'd make Moto2 very close to a one engine, one frame, class. The only difference would be the paint jobs.


If it makes you feel better, KTM are now confirmed to be joining Moto2 next year, albeit using Honda engines.

http://www.motorsport.com/moto2/news/binder-poised-for-moto2-graduation-with-ktm-807341/

[pritch]

If it makes you feel better, KTM are now confirmed to be joining Moto2 next year, albeit using Honda engines.

http://www.motorsport.com/moto2/news/binder-poised-for-moto2-graduation-with-ktm-807341/

That's right, I'd forgotten them. The return of the trellis frame?

The KTM MotoGP bike is a purposeful looking beast, trellis frame and all.

[Crasherfromwayback]

That's right, I'd forgotten them. The return of the trellis frame?

The KTM MotoGP bike is a purposeful looking beast, trellis frame and all.

I think it looks dated already. But eye of the beholder an all...

[Dreama]

That's right, I'd forgotten them. The return of the trellis frame?

The KTM MotoGP bike is a purposeful looking beast, trellis frame and all.

A friend of mine is a development engine builder on the MotoGP KTM team in Austria since the end of last season, they head hunted him away from HRC where he'd been for the past 25 odd yrs.
He lives not far from me and he's going to be back soon for a break so I'll get the inside story and pass on the details.
When I saw him about 4 mnths ago he said he thought 2017 was a year too soon, that they had masses of development to do.
The Austrian mentality is very methodical so they wanted a Kiwi ingenuity aspect to the project, apparently.
Will be very interesting to get the lowdown now.

[Crasherfromwayback]

Lorenzo all the way this weekend.

[James Deuce]

Lorenzo all the way this weekend.
Yep, his to lose.

[Crasherfromwayback]

Yep, his to lose.

Long as it doesn't rain...

[Autech]

I'm going to go with Dani Pedrosa for the win this weekend for no other reason than surely he's going to get that pile of poos working for him eventually? :soon:

[Crasherfromwayback]

I'm going to go with Dani Pedrosa for the win this weekend for no other reason than surely he's going to get that pile of poos working for him eventually? :soon:

Lorenzo

Marquez

Pedro

Rossi

[roogazza]

323942 Hope it's not wet? Valentino wet or dry. :rolleyes::lol:

[pritch]

Jl
MM
VR
AI
AD

That's the head speaking. The heart agrees with Gazza.


Something to read while we wait:

http://www.motorsportmagazine.com/opinion/motogp/maniac-name

[Badjelly]

The KTM MotoGP bike is a purposeful looking beast, trellis frame and all.

IIRC, Casey Stoner, among others, said that the trellis-frame Ducati he won the championship on in 2007 was very inconsistent: no two bikes were alike. This was attributed to difficulty in getting consistent welds.

Just saying.

[Autech]

Jl
MM
VR
AI
AD

That's the head speaking. The heart agrees with Gazza.


Something to read while we wait:

http://www.motorsportmagazine.com/opinion/motogp/maniac-name

"Train and fuck" hahahahhaaaaa. Love it!

So Ianonne is the "playboy" GP rider, he's not got the talent of the top guys (can't argue about that with zero championships to his name) but loves racing and living the dream.
I've never been a fan of reckless riders and he's embodies that in a nut shell so you will never get me shouting his name. I also do believe that the Duc has been capable of winning many races this year but the two chaps on board haven't been quite up to it, whether Lorenzo will change that time will tell, he's not showing himself to be that greater adapter to style changes, which the Duc will need.

A rider like Ianonne would win IF he wasn't in a race with 4.5 aliens, which is what it comes down to.

[Crasherfromwayback]

I also do believe that the Duc has been capable of winning many races this year but the two chaps on board haven't been quite up to it,.

Well they would've won one much earlier 'cept for Crazy Joe's torpedo act...or were they going for 2nd and 3rd? Can't remember now...

[onearmedbandit]

Well they would've won one much earlier 'cept for Crazy Joe's torpedo act...or were they going for 2nd and 3rd? Can't remember now...

2nd, still it was a disaster.

[Crasherfromwayback]

2nd, still it was a disaster.

Yep. If not for some incredibly bad luck for Dovi, he'd be doing well in the Championship now.

[pritch]

IIRC, Casey Stoner, among others, said that the trellis-frame Ducati he won the championship on in 2007 was very inconsistent: no two bikes were alike. This was attributed to difficulty in getting consistent welds.

Just saying.

You are right. But they might still have been better off with a trellis frame than that useless carbon fibre air box non-frame abortion that they played with for far too long.

I guess if KTM strike problems with their trellis they can take a leaf out of Ducatis book and contract out a delta box frame design. Kalex might be interested?

[Crasherfromwayback]

I guess if KTM strike problems with their trellis they can take a leaf out of Ducatis book and contract out a delta box frame design. Kalex might be interested?

KTM being KTM by trying to be different. Yamaha have proven since the first TZ's deltabox frames that that's where it's at. Ducati found out the hard (Slow) way...wake up KTM.

[pritch]

KTM being KTM by trying to be different. Yamaha have proven since the first TZ's deltabox frames that that's where it's at. Ducati found out the hard (Slow) way...wake up KTM.

Ducati and more recently KTM were probably motivated by trying to maintain a visible link with their road bikes. Eventually though KTM might have to decide whether or not they want to be competitive. We should know in a couple of years?

[Crasherfromwayback]

Ducati and more recently KTM were probably motivated by trying to maintain a visible link with their road bikes. Eventually though KTM might have to decide whether or not they want to be competitive. We should know in a couple of years?

What is it they say about madness?

[bogan]

KTM being KTM by trying to be different. Yamaha have proven since the first TZ's deltabox frames that that's where it's at. Ducati found out the hard (Slow) way...wake up KTM.

Is it technical superiority though, or just familiarity for the superior riders? Not that it really matters come race day, it might explain reluctance to just follow the delta box design...

[Crasherfromwayback]

Is it technical superiority though, or just familiarity for the superior riders? Not that it really matters come race day, it might explain reluctance to just follow the delta box design...

Oh hey, I dig engineers going in their own direction etc. Keeps things interesting. But if you look at Ducati with their tube frame, then their carbon mono jobbie etc etc...they're certainly going way better with a deltabox alloy jobby. It would seem way easier to dial in the desired amount of flex with alloy beams.

[jasonu]

KTM being KTM by trying to be different. Yamaha have proven since the first TZ's deltabox frames that that's where it's at. Ducati found out the hard (Slow) way...wake up KTM.

If the KTM road race effort is anything like their AMA Supercross effort led by The Man they will listen to what the riders and track personnel tells them and fast react accordingly. It would be wrong to count them out.

[pritch]

If the KTM road race effort is anything like their AMA Supercross effort led by The Man they will listen to what the riders and track personnel tells them and fast react accordingly. It would be wrong to count them out.

I don't think anyone is counting them out. As has been pointed out though there are consistency problems with trellis frames because of the basic design and the number of welds, Ducati found no two frames behaved exactly the same.

There has been speculation on various podcasts that Eugene Laverty would reluctantly quit Moto GP and head back to Superbikes where he may at least get competitive machinery and a reasonably financed team. Sad really because he had been doing probably better than could reasonably expected, he'd collected points at every round until Petrucci T boned him.

Petrucci made a very graceful apology and had impressed wordsmiths with his correct use of the word "mortified", until it was pointed out that Google Translate was probably responsible for that.

Overnight it was announced that Alvaro Bautista has signed for Aspar which has reignited speculation that Laverty will be announcing his departure imminently.

[Dave-]

Anyone heading to PI?

[James Deuce]

What is it they say about madness?

Suzuki Fireblade. Wibble.

[Grumph]

Oh hey, I dig engineers going in their own direction etc. Keeps things interesting. But if you look at Ducati with their tube frame, then their carbon mono jobbie etc etc...they're certainly going way better with a deltabox alloy jobby. It would seem way easier to dial in the desired amount of flex with alloy beams.

If the desired torsional stiffness is known, Finite element analysis can design you a frame to those parameters in any material you want.
I'd take what is being said about trellis frames with a grain of salt. To be specific, garlic salt...
I was interested to see when team Roberts decided to build their own bike they went to a design house with a very firm and specific stiffness figure they wanted. I'm told I may run into Mike Sinclair in December so must remember to ask where the figures came from...

Bear in mind too that tyres are the big unknown as far as carcase stiffness goes, they're a spring of basically unknown rate. It's already obvious that the Michelins don't suit all.

[Crasherfromwayback]

If the desired torsional stiffness is known, .

Guess that's (at least) half the problem eh.

[Grumph]

Guess that's (at least) half the problem eh.

The factories that have been in it for some time have the knowledge bank. Even more recent ones learn quickly.
When Aprilia replaced the alloy arm on their 250 with a composite they had to match the charcteristics of the alloy arm to retain the handling...Which they did.
I note that KTM for instance have a subsidiary building their frames. I'd bet they can give you all the data you'd ever need for trellis frame stiffness.
The story about the welds makes me laugh - how do you think the alloy frames are stuck together ? And the effect of welds on a sheet alloy structure is critical. Air/time hardening alloys help but you have to wonder about lifing those structures as the process doesn't stop....

[Crasherfromwayback]

The story about the welds makes me laugh - how do you think the alloy frames are stuck together ? And the effect of welds on a sheet alloy structure is critical. .

Super glue! Guess we'll see next year how good their chassis is. More the merrier at the pointy end.

[pritch]

SKY VR-46 have announced that the contract with Romano Fenati is officially terminated. Lorenzo della Porta will replace Fenati from Silverstone.

Still be interesting to know what sins bought about this fall from grace.

[Dadpole]

It has been reported that Fenati started a row with his suspension guy after qualifying. It was bad enough that Pablo Nieto and Uccio dragged them apart. Uccio then took Fenati to the hospitality unit for a quiet talk. Another row blew up, during which Fenati held a remote-control device to Uccio's throat and during the rumble knocked over a refrigerator. :spanking:

[pritch]

It has been reported that Fenati started a row with his suspension guy after qualifying. It was bad enough that Pablo Nieto and Uccio dragged them apart. Uccio then took Fenati to the hospitality unit for a quiet talk. Another row blew up, during which Fenati held a remote-control device to Uccio's throat and during the rumble knocked over a refrigerator. :spanking:

You got good detail. I've seen now't but the official statement, and I have been watching.

[Dadpole]

Of course, all that has been reported could be a load of bollocks.

Perhaps it is all a cunning Rossi plan reminiscent of the cold war. An agent (Fenati) defects to the enemy (Ducati) where he waits for his assigned target (Lorenzo) to arrive then quietly undermines him until one cold Bologna morning Lorenzo is taken outside and invited to try out a new blindfold shaped visor. :ar15:

[markbdaniels]

http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160818/2234597c55381fbe038582b412e3146f.jpg

Can't remember where I found this. Hope it was not here in this forum...

Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk

[Autech]

Here's a good example of what a class citizen he is, still made me laugh my arse off at him doing it though.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x7fep8y0X2w

[speights_bud]

Here's a good example of what a class citizen he is, still made me laugh my arse off at him doing it though.



Always thought he was a cunt. Never liked the way he carried himself or represented his sponsors. Jumping around like a 2 year old during flag to flag pit changes etc.

[manxkiwi]

Of course, all that has been reported could be a load of bollocks.

Perhaps it is all a cunning Rossi plan reminiscent of the cold war. An agent (Fenati) defects to the enemy (Ducati) where he waits for his assigned target (Lorenzo) to arrive then quietly undermines him until one cold Bologna morning Lorenzo is taken outside and invited to try out a new blindfold shaped visor. :ar15:

Ha ha, Gold.

[EJK]

Marquez.... WTF that save!!!!!

[Dadpole]

Marquez.... WTF that save!!!!!

Indeed. The wife asked why I shouted "Distant man-made waterway" (Far canal) Even more impressive in the slow-mo replays.

[Crasherfromwayback]

Marquez.... WTF that save!!!!!

Haters always gonna hate. But he's the man!

[pritch]

Haters always gonna hate. But he's the man!

Special for you Kiwi:
http://www.motoamerica.com/ten-minutes-with-motogp-world-champion-marc-marquez

[merv]

What is ridiculous about all the changes this year is they were meant to save money and make the field more competitive. I am sure Honda could have kept going well with less cost if they had been able to continue with their own electronics.

As for the field being more competitive, yeah that really worked. As expected the same good riders are still the same good riders. Others like Bradley Smith are bitching that they are now worse off and not as competitive as they were before the electronics changes. The formula should have been left alone.

If the changes were really meant to only slow the Hondas down then I guess there has been some success especially regards poor Dani Pedrosa.

[Drew]

What is ridiculous about all the changes this year is they were meant to save money and make the field more competitive. I am sure Honda could have kept going well with less cost if they had been able to continue with their own electronics.

As for the field being more competitive, yeah that really worked. As expected the same good riders are still the same good riders. Others like Bradley Smith are bitching that they are now worse off and not as competitive as they were before the electronics changes. The formula should have been left alone.

If the changes were really meant to only slow the Hondas down then I guess there has been some success especially regards poor Dani Pedrosa.

Dude, the Ducatis are frequenting the podium now. They weren't doing that before. Seems more even now to me.

[mulletman]

Marquez.... WTF that save!!!!!

Scroll down to 'click here'

http://www.crash.net/motogp/news/232899/1/67-degrees-and-rising-marquezs-brno-save.html

[Dadpole]

Forecast for Sunday is rain in the morning and cloudy and cool later. A chance for the Suzuki pair to get up at the pointy end?

[merv]

Dude, the Ducatis are frequenting the podium now. They weren't doing that before. Seems more even now to me.

Nah Dude, I'm talking about the whole field. It was spoken of like it would even the playing field between factory and non-factory by only letting the factory boys have the basic electronics and software the same as the others, but of course except for the odd wet ride (Jack Miller - Scott Redding - Cal Crutchlow - and their bikes aren't exactly bottom level) the podium is still full of factory race team bikes at most rounds. Now what a surprise.

In the end the best teams and best riders still win (read factory) and Crasher's mate Bradders is really bitching about it - a massive kick to the goolies he says http://www.crash.net/motogp/news/232815/1/smith-satellite-teams-have-taken-massive-kick-to-the-goolies.html

I would have preferred they left it alone as a proper development class.

[Crasherfromwayback]

Crasher's mate Bradders is really bitching about it -.

Fucking Ginga Homo.

[BMWST?]

Nah Dude, I'm talking about the whole field. It was spoken of like it would even the playing field between factory and non-factory by only letting the factory boys have the basic electronics and software the same as the others, but of course except for the odd wet ride (Jack Miller - Scott Redding - Cal Crutchlow - and their bikes aren't exactly bottom level) the podium is still full of factory race team bikes at most rounds. Now what a surprise.

In the end the best teams and best riders still win (read factory) and Crasher's mate Bradders is really bitching about it - a massive kick to the goolies he says http://www.crash.net/motogp/news/232815/1/smith-satellite-teams-have-taken-massive-kick-to-the-goolies.html

I would have preferred they left it alone as a proper development class.
if everything were the same the same four riders would be at the top....

[Drew]

if everything were the same the same four riders would be at the top....

Yip. Nothing at all would change.

We throw around 'Alien' to describe them, and it's the best description. As far as I can see, no oe else on the grid is as special as them. The reality alas, is that one of them has seemingly less freakish than the rest. Dani hasn't been able to adapt to the changes as well as the other three.

[actungbaby]

Yip. Nothing at all would change.

We throw around 'Alien' to describe them, and it's the best description. As far as I can see, no oe else on the grid is as special as them. The reality alas, is that one of them has seemingly less freakish than the rest. Dani hasn't been able to adapt to the changes as well as the other three.

yes remember when was the three of them dovi dani and forget who the fastest was it must been cassey

When you have fast team mate all seems effect other team riders, not in speed or time but just in that raw over confidence

makes a person not accept not winning or fact that they going be world champion .

God know what that is a step up from there going win this race this weekend.

You can see diffrence in crazy joe . after his win. notiched he was making real effort cummincation post q interview.

Must be anoying if english isint your first language thought was very honest and to the point not the race cliques

[BMWST?]

Dani has been penalised the most by the changes.i think we underestimate the magnitude of these TWO step changes.Perhaps too Dani is the least motivated of those four. I still beleive that MV is equal in talent and ambition to the fab four,but we cant see it because the suzuki is still slightly behind,if nothing else in experience and data

[Dadpole]

Even though I probably have the worst results here, I will chance my arm again...

Rossi
Lorenzo
Vinales

I still think that VR has the measure of Lorenzo. Marquez (I feel) can't keep up the qual pace for long. Too much risk and he is using his head this year.

[BMWST?]

Even though I probably have the worst results here, I will chance my arm again...

Rossi
Lorenzo
Vinales

I still think that VR has the measure of Lorenzo. Marquez (I feel) can't keep up the qual pace for long. Too much risk and he is using his head this year.
i feel the opposite i think JL has the measure of Mr Rossi here,as long as it is warm and dry!

[mulletman]

i feel the opposite i think JL has the measure of Mr Rossi here,as long as it is warm and dry!

Its pissing down atm for Moto3 warm up.

[onearmedbandit]

as long as it is warm and dry!

Which it isn't looking like happening currently.

[Dadpole]

Still looking like coolish and a dry/drying track for the main event. Any bets against Pawi if Moto3 is wet?

[Crasherfromwayback]

Still looking like coolish and a dry/drying track for the main event. Any bets against Pawi if Moto3 is wet?

It's still pissing down...

[EJK]

Lorenz is fucked then.

Also currently the track looks soaking wet. Going to be a very interesting race since all FP1-4 trying out soft tyres is now pointless!

[Crasherfromwayback]

I'm no CC fan...but huge congrats to the man! I hope he gets a million dollar bonus for that.

[ellipsis]

I'm no CC fan...but huge congrats to the man! I hope he gets a million dollar bonus for that.

...I like his style, but I'm with you on the sentiments...I can only imagine the party back in the UK...I like Vales style too...and MMs style, whatever you think of him, is unnervingly cool and consistent now...

[eelracing]

His calling the other riders whimps for their tyre choice was a bit out of order tho its an easy D when youve no championship to race for.

Rossi thought it was the wrong team decision early on and clearly Jorges meltdown concurred to.

Cool race.

[roogazza]

We'll take 'Silver' with both hands Valentino !
Had my doubts at 5 laps in tho !!!!!! :crazy:

Another lottery with tyres and wet.

[Autech]

Really enjoyed that race, there's going to be questions asked about the Mitchie front though as it letting go that early for Dovi should not happen. Poor bastard just wants to win a race!

CC rode like a champ, he's a bit of a knob but props to him for good riding! I hope he doesn't win any more though as I couldn't stand Nick Harris wanking on about how long he's been murdering peoples ear holes with his dribble. A verly verly long long time.

JL lost his marbles a bit I think, he was putting in some excellent lap times and could have managed a 4th or 5th I think, could have, should have, would have, didn't. Can't blame him for giving it a shot though, could have been a "Master stroke".

MM is riding like the best rider in the world this year, can't get over how much he has changed since last year, still did some still stuff like nearly taking out Rossi when he went by (did anyone else see that?). Poor Dani can't seem to catch a break, I'm thinking these tyres just aren't for him. Still 4th in the champ though which shows why he's on that machine.

[Crasherfromwayback]

His calling the other riders whimps for their tyre choice was a bit out of order tho .

Absolutely. Tis that sort of shit that makes me not like the guy.

[EJK]

His calling the other riders whimps for their tyre choice was a bit out of order tho its an easy D when youve no championship to race for.

Rossi thought it was the wrong team decision early on and clearly Jorges meltdown concurred to.

Cool race.

I thought I misheard that. What a dick! But props for climbing up from 15th all the way to 1st.

Huge next level respect to Iannone, pushing very hard on those soft tyres and managed to finish the race! I was so hoping for another win for Iannone!

Lorenzo WTF



Moto3 was enjoyable. What a chaos! All top riders crashing out 5-7 laps before the finish. So much thrill!

[ellipsis]

...I don't think you fellows understand toungue in cheek, rough humour...Vale looked like he understood and appreciated the 'humour'...

[mulletman]

Pretty good reward for Loris Baz :)

[pritch]

I just finished watching the race and it certainly wasn't boring.

It was a bit startling to read the comments about Crutchlow here though. He is a famously funny guy, and is noted for being about the most humorous guy in the paddock. Perhaps some hereabout should check their funny bone? On the other hand if some native English speakers missed the humour, some of the translations into Spanish and Italian could be problematical.

[EJK]

I just finished watching the race and it certainly wasn't boring.

It was a bit startling to read the comments about Crutchlow here though. He is a famously funny guy, and is noted for being about the most humorous guy in the paddock. Perhaps some hereabout should check their funny bone? On the other hand if some native English speakers missed the humour, some of the translations into Spanish and Italian could be problematical.

One thing I do like about him is he's an honorable family guy. Dedicated to his wife and newly born daughter. Calling his wife just after finishing races (on both podium finishes) I think that was pretty sweet thing to do.

[roogazza]

I'm no CC fan...but huge congrats to the man! I hope he gets a million dollar bonus for that.

Cecchinello puts on a great piss up. Been to a couple myself,Bunny girls and all ! :msn-wink::shifty:

Like this quote from Motomatters forum:
I know rain is the great equalizer but for Lorenzo,it would seem to have become the great paralyzer.

[speights_bud]

I just finished watching the race and it certainly wasn't boring.

It was a bit startling to read the comments about Crutchlow here though. He is a famously funny guy, and is noted for being about the most humorous guy in the paddock. Perhaps some hereabout should check their funny bone? On the other hand if some native English speakers missed the humour, some of the translations into Spanish and Italian could be problematical.

We need people like Cal, something about you can usually trust someone who swears all the time because you know they aren't bullshitting you. You don't get fluffy crap from Crutchlow.


I'm no CC fan...but huge congrats to the man! I hope he gets a million dollar bonus for that.

I have to say I've been struggling to back him, I like his rough style when he's not moaning (he's a pom what do you expect?) MotoGP needs variety.


Also be interesting to see what MM team do to permanently remedy the slippery wet tank on his bike for Flag to flag. He nearly fell on his face changing bikes during warm up. I see they added double sided tape to the top of it as a temporary fix.

[Crasherfromwayback]

I know rain is the great equalizer but for Lorenzo,it would seem to have become the great paralyzer.

Funnily enough, he was going ok before he came in to the pits.



Also be interesting to see what MM team do to permanently remedy the slippery wet tank on his bike for Flag to flag. He nearly fell on his face changing bikes during warm up. I see they added double sided tape to the top of it as a temporary fix.

Yeah I saw that.

[roogazza]

Funnily enough, he was going ok before he came in to the pits.

Yeah,with the Doocatis in 1,2,and 3 positions early in the race you'd never guess the finish we had,huh ?

I think we're safe in the knowledge CC won't perform like that again in a hurry? Unless of course it pisses down at Silverstone, next up.:(

[badlieutenant]

My regards for CC went up last season after JM (team mate) took him out going in too hot on a corner. Up till then Jack was riding well. You could see Cc was furious track side and Jack was gutted at what he had done. Post race interview, with a little time to cool down, CC basically said he was gutted but he couldn't really be too pissed at Jack as he was young and had got excited about how well he was doing adding that everyone has taken someone out at some point in their careers.
Watching Jack's post race interview when he won in the wet this year was highly entertaining. "Folks back home are probably partying and 40 beers deep already". Classic. You can see why those two would get on. CC letting him sleep at his place doing chores to help around the place. Willow will have a uncle called Jack :D

[sugilite]

Congratulations to Crashlow, could not help laughing a bit as his team manger standing by his pit board kept telling him to slow down in the dying laps, he knows his rider well!
I felt that CC comments about the other riders being wimps for their dollar each way bets on tyres had a wee bit of merit. No point having awesome drive at the end of the race from a hard rear, but having to baby it into the corners with a soft front. Cal went all in and good on him for reaping the rewards.
MM had another super mature race, fantastic result for him. Rossi too, he knew having chosen the soft front, there was no point chasing CC.

MM's championship to lose.

Still think Lorenzo is going to struggle big time on the Ducati next year.

[actungbaby]

I'm no CC fan...but huge congrats to the man! I hope he gets a million dollar bonus for that.

AM big fan i always thought chould do it i think its because he british i have more in common in attitudes humour etc

Like his down to earth humour .

Lorezo and him used be mates when was at yamaha he said carl myabe if you had factory bike

you still might not be intsant ticket to winning . i think he answered that one .

God i was going shut up about sweden 1981 but so happy all the same , went from barry sheene to americans winning everthing.

apart from christen sharron one win in the wet . dont think was french gp . he apprently in motop working .

Then of course been itay with rossi but its been a spanish walk over anthems ever since ,

I think prefer spanish to the dour americans though apart from Kevin s he was a live wire with expessive personality and fun.

Oh course when gardner and dohan where winning was almost home gp wins

apart from are boys did so well crafer crosby arron slight you got to admire a guy works hard battles might not be natural

talent of a rossi or mm , but as my dear mum used to say ones that battle and are the tryers . win through in the end.

usually stick around longer too.

[Drew]

I was pretty stoked for Cal...Till he spoke. He's just not charismatic in the slightest.

Gutted Bazz didn't make it to the podium. He was pretty fucken rapt with fourth though.

[Crasherfromwayback]

I was pretty stoked for Cal...Till he spoke. He's just not charismatic in the slightest.

.

""Victory has been a long time coming and I was emotional on the cool-down lap. I was playing with them in the end though"

Yeah riiiiiiiiiight.