400cc bikes. Pros and Cons?

[sAsLEX]

Sorry, apart from looking good (RVF400 etc), I reckon these things are waaaay overrated.

A VFR400 weighs 170kg's going by stats off the 'net and it's not the heaviest of the bunch either. Tie that to the puny 26ftlb's of torque at 10000rpm and you are going to be working hard (comparatively speaking) ALL the time.

No you aint. You ridden one?

[slowpoke]

No you aint. You ridden one?

Yup, and I've ridden an RGV250 which I would also prefer over a 400...similar power, less weight, more fun. I've owned an old RZ350 too, which I'd take in a heartbeat over much more modern 400's. Yes it's a 2 stroke but it's giving away a lot of years to some of the 400's and wouldn't cost half as much to maintain.

I said "comparatively. Take a steady ride over the 'taka's or somewhere similar and count your gear changes, then take a 600 over at the same speed and count the gear changes, now take a 'thou over and count the gear changes. Ride with your mates anywhere and get balked by a car or something and watch your mate on his 600 just roll it on to pass or get back up to speed as you are doing the flamenco on the gear lever. Now add a pillion on to both bikes. Comparatively it is much harder work on the 400.

[ZeroIndex]

Yup, and I've ridden an RGV250 which I would also prefer over a 400...similar power, less weight, more fun. I've owned an old RZ350 too, which I'd take in a heartbeat over much more modern 400's. Yes it's a 2 stroke but it's giving away a lot of years to some of the 400's and wouldn't cost half as much to maintain.

I said "comparatively. Take a steady ride over the 'taka's or somewhere similar and count your gear changes, then take a 600 over at the same speed and count the gear changes, now take a 'thou over and count the gear changes. Ride with your mates anywhere and get balked by a car or something and watch your mate on his 600 just roll it on to pass or get back up to speed as you are doing the flamenco on the gear lever. Now add a pillion on to both bikes. Comparatively it is much harder work on the 400.

Wasn't this thread about comparing a Suzuki GN250 to a 400cc? Since when did 2t 250's, inline4 600 and litre bikes come into play?

[James Deuce]

I find a 400 four lots more fun than a 600, 750, or 1000 over the Takas. It takes skill to ride one well. I've ridden LOTS of bikes over the last 12 months and owned more than one over the last 20 years, and I STILL consider going to a 400 from a 250 to be the sanest choice you can make.

[slowpoke]

Wasn't this thread about comparing a Suzuki GN250 to a 400cc? Since when did 2t 250's, inline4 600 and litre bikes come into play?

I gave the view that 400's were overrated (high maintenence for not particularly inspiring performance), agreed with Frosty's alternatives, and some people chose to disagree. The mushroom cloud is still growing.......

[slowpoke]

I find a 400 four lots more fun than a 600, 750, or 1000 over the Takas. It takes skill to ride one well. I've ridden LOTS of bikes over the last 12 months and owned more than one over the last 20 years, and I STILL consider going to a 400 from a 250 to be the sanest choice you can make.

So when you are selling the 750 Jim?

I can think of a few more practical, easy to ride, confidence inspiring bikes to jump to from a GN than a race rep 400 too. Lets see a noobie fresh off a GN do a figure 8 in the width of a 2 lane road on an RVF400 as they'd have to for a license in OZ.

[James Deuce]

Who said anything about a Race Rep? Have you checked out the Katana 400 I'm fixing up? There's heaps of 400s out there from Chook Chasers, to retro thumpers, to standard naked bikes, to retro naked bikes, to race reps, do anything "standard" bikes and cruisers. There's a whole pile of engine configs too. Inline V-Twins, transverse V-twins, single cylinder, parallel twin, and transverse 4s.

[sAsLEX]

Yup, and I've ridden an RGV250 which I would also prefer over a 400...similar power, less weight, more fun. I've owned an old RZ350 too, which I'd take in a heartbeat over much more modern 400's. Yes it's a 2 stroke but it's giving away a lot of years to some of the 400's and wouldn't cost half as much to maintain.

I said "comparatively. Take a steady ride over the 'taka's or somewhere similar and count your gear changes, then take a 600 over at the same speed and count the gear changes, now take a 'thou over and count the gear changes. Ride with your mates anywhere and get balked by a car or something and watch your mate on his 600 just roll it on to pass or get back up to speed as you are doing the flamenco on the gear lever. Now add a pillion on to both bikes. Comparatively it is much harder work on the 400.

Yeah its harder on a 400 compared to a litre bike.

But I can do all of SH22 in one gear basically. I see what your saying but in the real world a NC30 has plenty of torque/power to bimble along in one gear , or drop three gears and grind the footpegs?! IL4 600s especially are notoriously peaky, take the r6, I don't see them being the best comparison.

[terbang]

They are often cheaper than the overpriced 250's because the noobs can't legally ride them and often people go to something bigger from their 250. So that makes em even better buying value. My old rattler GSX400 has been doing it for just on 1/4 century now and it is still fun to ride on a tight bit of road. The cons I have are like everyone else's, power, or lack of it! Though I managed to squeeze 160 KPh out of it once on gravel..!

[sAsLEX]

They are often cheaper than the overpriced 250's because the noobs can't legally ride them and often people go to something bigger from their 250. So that makes em even better buying value. My old rattler GSX400 has been doing it for just on 1/4 century now and it is still fun to ride on a tight bit of road. The cons I have are like everyone else's, power, or lack of it! Though I managed to squeeze 160 KPh out of it once on gravel..!

NC goes well off the 180 clock. How much do you need as a newely graduated 250 rider?

[Blair-SV]

My girl used to have an SV400 when I met her, beautiful little bike, looked great in red. I found the jump from my GSX250 to the SV400 was greater than from the SV400 to the SV650. Mainly in usibility terms. Meaning that I had to use a lot of throttle on the 250 to handle the motorway etc where the 400 handled it with ease. The 650 was just faster, both seemed to handle the same. Gas wise there wasn't much in it 400 vs 250. Actually it was the lack of difference between 650 and 400 that made me go for the thou.

One other cool thing, when the SV400 falls on its side (well exhaust side at least) you get zero panel damage, just a scratch on the muffler, handlebar and indicator.

[scracha]

you will learn lots rideing a 400 all the power on a 400 is useable so you can gas it with no issues handle great and are good on gas blah blah

Your one isn't, it goes through 2.5 tankfulls to every one of mine. I went from a 225cc to a 400. Personally I think you'd be wasting money. Go to a 500 twin or a 600 four if you've got a full license. For road bikes the 400's are far too much money for what are basically 20 year old Jap bikes that were designed to last 5 years.

[ZeroIndex]

I gave the view that 400's were overrated (high maintenence for not particularly inspiring performance), agreed with Frosty's alternatives, and some people chose to disagree. The mushroom cloud is still growing.......

in hindsite, 400s aren't really that great... mine's not too bad, but would way rather be on a 01/02 cbr600f4i or 03/04 zx636

[moT]

Your one isn't, it goes through 2.5 tankfulls to every one of mine. I went from a 225cc to a 400. Personally I think you'd be wasting money. Go to a 500 twin or a 600 four if you've got a full license. For road bikes the 400's are far too much money for what are basically 20 year old Jap bikes that were designed to last 5 years.

thats because its rejetted and i hold it full tap everywhere get what you want 400s arte cheapto buy and do have good preformance its not the bike but how you ride the bike i wld be happy with anything with an engine and 2 wheels and went fast 400 is what i can afford and its soo much more satisfying passing 600 and 1000 cc bikes on a 400

[Coyote]

while also being heavier. This shouldn't matter when riding, but you'll take a wee while to get used to handling it at slow speeds and when stopped.

VFR400's are good for their low centre of gravity. They're heavy bikes but you the weight is easier to handle

Good comments above about the complexity/maintenance issues though, the exhaust valves burnt out on mine, luckily I scored a 2nd hand motor for $160 & she kept on trucking better than ever. Another thing to watch on the VFR's is the front discs, they are prone to wearing out & are expensive to replace.

That's another problem my VFR currently has, the disks won't pass the next warrant.

Can they be replaced with disks off anything else? TYGA fitted a NC35 with CBR954 disks but I'm not sure what modifications were needed. More options means possibly finding something cheap

I shudder to think what a top-end service (including shims)would cost on a CBR, ZXR, GSXR, RVF 400 in percentage terms compared to the value of the 15year old bike.

My VFR cost $130 for the 2 rear cylinders, but I knew the mechanics. When I have more money on my side I'll get the front 2 done and get the annoying cam gear click on the rear cylinders sorted