Older vehicles = increased ACC levy?

[Renegade]

Simple. The petrol one pays an extra $80 per year in taxes on petrol . Have you not noticed that diesel is cheaper than petrol? Ever wondered why?

Always amazes me the number of diesel owners who bitch about this. Loud as when it comes to rego time, but they shut up when they're filling up. Can't have your cake and eat it too. Y' either pay your way at the punmp, or at the Post office counter

(The reason that they don't put the tax on the diesel fuel instead of on the rego is that so much diesel is used in non raod , and non-vehicle uses)

No, thats what road users is for, you pay for your kms you drive, petrol users pay for thier road user kms at the pump and diesel drivers pay for it at the post shop, the reason for this is so vehicles such as farm tractors and diesel generators which dont use the road dont get stung for something they dont use.

so back to my original question.... explain this to me, two identical mitsi pajero's, same year, same shape, one has a 2.8 diesel and the other 3.0 petrol, to look at the vehicle side by side they are the same.

Now why does the diesel have to pay more $80 a year more rego than the petrol??

[Renegade]

The fact that some people out there don't understand that is kind of odd... It is also an interesting one because it takes the vehicle type out of the equation. I prefer the idea of taxing by fuel use because it more closely resembles the usage characteristics of vehicles, but as you said, it is a proposition that is unreasonably hard to enforce.

see above post, the diesel system actually woks really well.

[jono035]

see above post, the diesel system actually woks really well.

Yeah, except that in the case of road vehicles, it taxes a light-weight fuel-efficient car the same as it does a fuel-hungry heavy-weight SUV because it does so by kms travelled.

As stated before I think taxing by fuel consumed adds a certain amount more incentive towards lighter, more fuel efficient cars and taxes the heavier, less fuel-efficient cars on the road more.

I also mentioned that I recognise why this is done (growing up in rural NZ and all) and that there is no better way of doing it really.

Basically I've just completely repeated myself using more words... Perhaps this way my view will be clearer.

And how exactly does a diesel system 'wok'?

[jono035]

why does the diesel have to pay more $80 a year more rego than the petrol??

No idea, and until about 30 seconds ago, I was unaware that they had to.

[Ixion]

No, thats what road users is for, you pay for your kms you drive, petrol users pay for thier road user kms at the pump and diesel drivers pay for it at the post shop, the reason for this is so vehicles such as farm tractors and diesel generators which dont use the road dont get stung for something they dont use.

so back to my original question.... explain this to me, two identical mitsi pajero's, same year, same shape, one has a 2.8 diesel and the other 3.0 petrol, to look at the vehicle side by side they are the same.

Now why does the diesel have to pay more $80 a year more rego than the petrol??

Nope. Two different things.

Diesel is MUCH cheaper than petrol. Cos it doesn't pay the same tax.

The extra tax on petrol pays TWO things. One is a levy to ACC. And one is tax to the giubbermint.

Diesel pays neither.

So both ACC and the gubbermint make it up other wyas. The gubbermint do it by RUC. ACC do it by an extra levy on y' rego.

Go look at the licence demands for the two vehicles. You'll see it there plain and simple.

The $80 extra rego makes up for PART of the tax you avoid on diesel. The RUC makes up for the rest.

I'll turn your question the other way up. Diesel and petrol come from the same crude petroleum feedstock. The difference in cost between the two is bugger all . So they should both cost about the same per litre, within a few cents. So, why should petrol buyers have to pay more than diesel buyers ? Hm ?

I

[Ixion]

Chapter and verse

Why do diesel* vehicles pay more than petrol?
* includes other non-petrol powered vehicles


Motor vehicle account levies are collected via an annual licence fee for vehicles and a tax on petrol sales.
For petrol powered vehicles this works out as:

• Annual license fee of $111.11

• Petrol tax of 5.78 cents per litre (for the average vehicle this works out as $78.89 per year)

$111.11 + $78.89 = $190.00

Diesel vehicles don’t pay the petrol tax, so the whole of their levy is collected from the annual license fee (i.e. $190.00).

And, from the LTSA web site

All users of New Zealand's roads contribute towards their upkeep. Most road users pay levies in the prices of their fuel. Others, such as users of diesel-powered or electric vehicles, pay through road user charges (RUC).
All the revenue collected from road user charges goes into the National Land Transport Fund.
Road user charges are administered by the NZ Transport Agency (NZTA) and enforced by the New Zealand Police.

ie - ACC make up for the tax you aren't paying by an extra rego fee. NZTA make up for the tax you aren't paying via RUC. None of the RUC goes to ACC.

You could have found that out y'self, y'know.

[Ocean1]

Diesel and petrol come from the same crude petroleum feedstock. The difference in cost between the two is bugger all . So they should both cost about the same per litre, within a few cents. So, why should petrol buyers have to pay more than diesel buyers ? Hm ?

I

Dude, it might come from the same raw material source but it is a very different product. Even where a refinery is optimised for petrol the AGO is cheaper to produce.

Marsden Pt was built optimised for AGO (Diesel). Domestic prices up to about a decade ago were a reasonable refelction of the relative local production costs. Progressively that's changed to more closely match international prices.

[Ixion]

Certainly it is a different product. And diesel IS cheaper, considered on a refinery scale. But broken down to a per litre basis the differenc ein material cost is , only a few cents per litre

As at June 2008 when the petrol price stood at $2.01 per litre (latest figures I can find) , the price was made up as follows:

• $1.038 cost of crude oil
• $ 0.11 petrol refining margin (the difference between the ex-refinery petrol price and crude price)
• $ 0.133 importer margin (the difference between the retail price - less taxes and duties - and the landed cost of the refined product)
• $ 0.729 GST and other taxes.

Tax

• 42.524 cents per litre (cpl) excise tax used for the National Land Transport Management Fund (This varies a bit because of regional tax levies - I think this is an avergae)
• 9.34 cpl ACC levy
• 0.025 cpl Petroleum Fuels Monitoring levy
• 0.66 cpl Local Authorities Petroleum tax

Plus GST on all that. Diesel doesn't pay the first two . Not sure about the other two, but it's only a cent per litre.

So the two taxes that diesel doesn't pay amount to roughly 52 cents a litre

A couple of days ago petrol was $1.64 a litre ( it varies depending on where you go). Diesel was $1.08. The difference is 56 cents a litre. 52 cents of the difference is tax . The difference in the material cost (assuming that the oil companies are cross subsidising - I think that a reasonable assumption, and even if they are it wouldn't be more than a cent or so) is about 4 cents a litre. As I said, a few cents per litre. The exact number of cents is somewhat uncertain , but it's trivial in the context of a pump difference of 56 cents a litre.

Of course , when you are talking millions and millions of litres, that 4 cents adds up, so it is also true to say that diesel is cheaper for the refiners to produce.

But, at the pump, almost all of the difference between the $1.64 paid by the petrol engined driver (or rider) , and the $1.08 paid by the diesel owner (or rider ) is the tax that the latter doesn't pay. And which is therefore recouped by an additional license levy (in the case of the ACC component) ; or Road User Charges (in the case of the LTNZ bit)

[Ocean1]

Of course , when you are talking millions and millions of litres, that 4 cents adds up, so it is also true to say that diesel is cheaper for the refiners to produce.

There's a larger difference: you can wring a fair bit more AGO from a ton of crude than you can petrol. And the price of the respective by-products don't affect the retail price.

[Renegade]

Chapter and verse
ie - ACC make up for the tax you aren't paying by an extra rego fee. NZTA make up for the tax you aren't paying via RUC. None of the RUC goes to ACC.

You could have found that out y'self, y'know.

i did find out, i asked those who may know, and you answered, cheers.