US bikes for sale

[cheese]

Some people have warped view on what RRP and trade should be etc.

Internet direct sellers like trade me whores rape the shit out of the industry. Have you noticed that alot of smaller shops and stuff these days have closed their doors? Toy shops are a real prime example of this.

US gear is cheaper mainly due to volume. You get a country that big buying that much gear gets cheaper. The volumes they buy in are huge. we buy in 10 - 100. They buy in 1000 - 100,000

Next time you moan about how much retailers charge take this into consideration.

Rent, power, insurance etc for your shop. Not cheap bills.
The initial outlay costs for stock. You walk into most shops and I bet you look around and most shops think about how much outlay they have forked out.
Staff to run the shops - that gets more expensive every year.

I try to supports shops where I can.

[MB1]

Just to throw my 2c worth in as well.

I'm not wanting to get drawn into the differing views of RT and Assasin just want to put my opinion and first hand experience across.

I worked for a motorcycle parts and accessories importer while in the UK and I can tell you first hand that the brands you are representing make it clear that you must carry all of their lines each and every season and with in reason all these items must be in stock at all times. They also would not offer credit so the importer would have to pay for all of the stock up front.

To give you an idea of the outlay involved, one of the brands was Fly, and they came out with 208, 805 and 303 race gear in the same season. Each of these lines came in kids (5 sizes) and adults (5 sizes) and each line had 6 colur options (black, blue, red etc etc). Thats a hell of a lot of stock to carry to service a dealer network. On top of that you of corse had helmets, boots, gloves etc etc not to mention the w/house, staff, advertising etc etc. It was a hell of a lot of money to be paying out each and every season.

Only the importers here would know their terms with each supplier but I wouldn't imagine it would be much different. You also have to remember that we are a small country with only 4 million people so as a nation we just don't get the buying power of other larger countries. All of this has an effect on what things cost down here.

SoCal has the largest population of off road riders in the world so of corse gear, parts and accessories are going to be so much cheaper, its simply supply and demand.

Due to my line of work I have the ability to import at very competive pricing from all over the world but for me personally I like to support local dealers. I work hard and am careful where I spend my money, I don't care what car I drive or the brand of jeans I wear, but if I want a particular set of riding gear or part for my bike and I've saved the money then I will go and support my local dealer. If the dealer and the importer have a bit of money to keep going then I've done my bit to keep the sport going here in NZ.

As for sweeping statements that all factory riders in NZ are pricks (or words to that effect), I couldn't comment as I have been away for some time but certainly going to the GP's in Europe, BT and JC were 2 of the most likable and respected riders on the circuit.

This is only my opinion and my experience and for that matter situation at the moment. I can certainly understand the financial strain having a couple of kids would bring and the need to cut costs where ever possible and hopefully I will find out in a few years!!!!

[Reckless]

At $300 they ARE only making a LITTLE bit on those boots we talked about. At that sort of money there was nothing in it thats why i was supprised they were so cheap.

To be honest chop I don't really know the real figures, I can only go by what he said on the phone, they are on the way here as we speak! I just got a bit annoyed with the "we should be paying more to support the infrastructure scenario" I don't see why! I'm certainly not going to walk into a shop with my $285-00 savings cheque and say here, have this for free, my kids can stay home for the next two or three ride days.
I get excellent service from Steve @ Triple X for my Ktm's and I just bought some Thor force Knee guards from Scott for my sons birthday. But some items are so much more expensive than overseas I just can't justify it, so I take the risk on the overseas purchase. Its only $20-30 bucks to send it back and they will freight the replacement item back again for free, so I still save heaps. And no, I don't go in and waste the shops time trying things on and then ordering overseas, I take that risk as well! We'll have 6 bikes in the family at home here if the wife will let me buy another road bike so we are buying a fair bit of shit every year!

I can only say as the market buys more overseas, we get more confident at it, we set up relashionships with those companies, we start to trust them, have their staffs email addresses on file, it becomes very easy for us and that doesn't look good for our guys. In my humble opinion they should be putting a lot more pressure on the importers margin as he doesn't have retail shop rents, staff, time waisting customers etc to screw up his profit margin. Maybe its the double take in the items that is the problem! There's been a lot more talk about importing bikes lately and the dollar is only .67c if to gets back up to .80c. Well i suppose the market will decide with its feet.
I dunno its not my industry, its up to them to meet the market but the car industry hasn't gone bust over the last few years with Jap imports here have they?
Which brings us right back around on topic to Krashers invite for others to join him and import bikes, The force is to strong Obi Wan, the market is deciding!

[Reckless]

.

Rent, power, insurance etc for your shop. Not cheap bills.
The initial outlay costs for stock. You walk into most shops and I bet you look around and most shops think about how much outlay they have forked out.
Staff to run the shops - that gets more expensive every year.

I try to supports shops where I can.

I try to buy local as well cheese but just a point here, we are not buying at wholesale overseas we are buying at retail! So their Rent, power, insurance etc is already in the price so I don't agree with this argument! We are buying USA as well, not third world or China, so I would imagine their wages etc would be similar, they have a similar standard of living don't they. Sorry mate mute point in my opinion. The volume thing has credibility but the rest I'm not so sure.

Gotta get back to work now as I wasted to much on my $285 on this thread!! LOL!! bloody Kiwibiker!! LOL!!

[green machine]

i should know better and stay out of this, but here is my 2 cents,

everything is cheaper in the USA, houses, food, , petrol, electronics and motor vehicles, there is going to be some bargins coming out of there because the recesson alot worse than us here, so a lot of shops are overstocked and in the shit,

as for bringing them in, i personally believe you should have to back up anything you bring in and sell, incl parts supply, but that time has gone and you can dump anything you want in this country, (chinese bikes are a prime example),

the motorcycle industry is made up of a whole lot of people that mostly still enjoy riding and promote and sponsor most events in nz, have a look at any trail ride or race poster at the sponsors and it is mostly made up of shops and accessory wholesalers, (have yet to see an overseas based company sponsor any local events here)

Barty, i don't see what the issue is with sponsoring race teams, if it was not for these company's guys like BT, Whibley and Birch would have had a shit load harder time taking the next step in racing overseas. Racing and promoting motorcycles have always gone hand in hand.

if you want year old gear there is a heap of specials to be had, esp at this time of year when the new gear is just about here, alot of guys on here deal with me and i normally have something to go,

Assassin, you seem like you have a couple of issues with a few people, can i ask what you do for a job?, do you think there is a problem with people making a profit in your industry as well?

I always get top deals from Scott......that's why they are the only shop i buy from,they often have lots on sale,have awesome customer service and back up ....and always take time to listen to me talk crap....i've thought about getting stuff from USA but i think if it's not right i'm stuffed,where as Mr Motorcycles exchange or refund with no dramas....i dread to think how much of my hard earned dollars ivé put over that counter but hey....when your out ripping it up you soon forget about it.
Disclaimer......................Scott did not pay me to say this,hahaha

[Robert Taylor]

I try to buy local as well cheese but just a point here, we are not buying at wholesale overseas we are buying at retail! So their Rent, power, insurance etc is already in the price so I don't agree with this argument! We are buying USA as well, not third world or China, so I would imagine their wages etc would be similar, they have a similar standard of living don't they. Sorry mate mute point in my opinion. The volume thing has credibility but the rest I'm not so sure.

Gotta get back to work now as I wasted to much on my $285 on this thread!! LOL!! bloody Kiwibiker!! LOL!!

Heres just one example, Scotts in the USA used to order 10,000 steering dampers a year from Ohlins ( before the contract expired a couple of years back ) We did not of course order anything like that amount as we lack people to remotely even dream of such volume.

Who got the way way better buy price?

[tommorth]

I buy stuff localy if possible and its not stupidly over priced but also buy stuff on closeouts from the states because its so much cheaper

massive mark ups arn't unique to bike parts we recently found that we were getting a minimal discount on gib screws from placemakers for work after a phone call to the rep to see if they could do a better price we are now getting them for around a quarter of the retail price and the are still makeing money on it.

[clmintie]

I buy stuff localy if possible and its not stupidly over priced but also buy stuff on closeouts from the states because its so much cheaper

massive mark ups arn't unique to bike parts we recently found that we were getting a minimal discount on gib screws from placemakers for work after a phone call to the rep to see if they could do a better price we are now getting them for around a quarter of the retail price and the are still makeing money on it.

Same with Bunnings, we usually buy at less than half the retail price, interestingly though, it's usually the locally made stuff that has the big discounts...

[B0000M]

so if its so tough for nz dealers and the stuff is costing them so much, why dont the nz shops just buy retail from the USA then sell it for a bit more here. no stock levels needed, no minimum purchase


also if they are buying a fair bit of it - eg a buying group, they could probably get some pretty sharp deals from the place in the usa they are getting it from.

[takitimu]

Just to throw my 2c worth in as well.
I worked for a motorcycle parts and accessories importer while in the UK and I can tell you first hand that the brands you are representing make it clear that you must carry all of their lines each and every season and with in reason all these items must be in stock at all times. They also would not offer credit so the importer would have to pay for all of the stock up front.

To give you an idea of the outlay involved, one of the brands was Fly, and they came out with 208, 805 and 303 race gear in the same season. Each of these lines came in kids (5 sizes) and adults (5 sizes) and each line had 6 colur options (black, blue, red etc etc). Thats a hell of a lot of stock to carry to service a dealer network. On top of that you of corse had helmets, boots, gloves etc etc not to mention the w/house, staff, advertising etc etc. It was a hell of a lot of money to be paying out each and every season.

( I snipped a fair bit )
Bling awarded, to my simple mind you've hit to the core of the issue, it's not the retailers I blame it's the brands themselves & sometimes distributors, often they are stuck in some 1980/90's distribution model, we are in 2009 & just in time delivery should be the answer.
To give a real example, if you order say a monitor from an online computer retailer in NZ, odds are the retailer will never see the monitor, it'll be shipped from the distributor/manufacturer direct & the retailer gets a cut.
Until we get to that model of delivery for dirt bike support & accessories, the retailers will be piggy in the middle, the way things are structured now, we either have real support or sharp prices, it's rare to see both ( Scott might be able to explain why thor stands out as delivering both ).
P.S. I actually think NZ retailers who've survived are impressive, Scott's prices when given a chance are really sharp, for instance he has thor knee pads which excluding sales tax are cheaper here than the US, sure there are things like Renthall bars, Leatts & some others where it's stark, but I don't see any evidence the NZ retailers are at fault.
P.P.S. Found the same thing with OEM YZF250 headers, price in NZ was no cheaper 4 months ago than in the US, an FMF header on the other hand was alot cheaper in the US & I bought one back for that reason.

[boomer]

Its kind of ironic that there is not a level playing field when it comes to dealing with the yanks. Bollocks Obama has recently introduced protectionist measures for his agricultural sector and that is really screwing our primary producers bigtime. But its okay for other sectors in the US to dump product here.
I am guessing that this ''part time'' importer does not have motorcycles as a primary source of income? If so then why is he doing this? Answer, to make a quick buck out of brazen self interest. And not having to provide any credible form of support structure.
The motorcycle industry here ( the legitimate full time one ) provides employment for thousands of people. In these times I would count retention of jobs uppermost, much more so than those picking the eyes out of it to suit their own pockets.
Fulltime legitimate importers do not so much have the luxury of choosing to import when the currency is strong as they are tied to the production schedules of the factories. Part timers will only do so when the currency is strong. Leaches.

Times change unfortunately, and if businesses don't/can't see that change then they will suffer. Business models change; those who invested heavily without foresight will pay...

It's a fact; let the consumer decide.

[Robert Taylor]

so if its so tough for nz dealers and the stuff is costing them so much, why dont the nz shops just buy retail from the USA then sell it for a bit more here. no stock levels needed, no minimum purchase


also if they are buying a fair bit of it - eg a buying group, they could probably get some pretty sharp deals from the place in the usa they are getting it from.

Please define ''a bit more'' ??? If a dealer cant make 30% at minimum then likely they will run at a loss or very very marginal profit when you factor in a whole raft of day to day overheads. Many significant increases in overheads occured over the last 9 years with extra levies ( taxes ) local Government hikes ( taxes on taxes ) and 4 weeks paid holidays etc. And margins on bikes have been continually squeezed downwards.

No direspect but an idea like ''Buying off US retailers'' made me think '' did the guy come down in the last shower''

Not all goods are produced in the USA, and thank god for that.

I have stated this before in other threads and am at pains to point it out again.....commercial operators will pay a whole raft of clearance charges, gst on those charges and gst on the LEGITIMATE value of the FOB ( free on board ) value of the goods.

It is not a level playing field that Mr Consumer can do a one off order from overseas companies and all too often land the goods with no gst, no clearance charges and no gst on those charges etc. And very often will convince the seller to fraudulently undervalue the goods.

Bear in mind that there are many consumers who will absolutely go for the lowest price come hell or high water.

The Government could create many extra jobs in one swoop ( customs officers )plus a whole load more gst derived revenue by firmly closing that loophole. Might have a talk to John Key on that one, would be great for employment.

Also bear in mind that manufacturers dont produce or have on hand stocks of all lines at all times and that they onsell to appointed distributors, that is and continues to be the standard business model.

[Robert Taylor]

( I snipped a fair bit )
Bling awarded, to my simple mind you've hit to the core of the issue, it's not the retailers I blame it's the brands themselves & sometimes distributors, often they are stuck in some 1980/90's distribution model, we are in 2009 & just in time delivery should be the answer.
To give a real example, if you order say a monitor from an online computer retailer in NZ, odds are the retailer will never see the monitor, it'll be shipped from the distributor/manufacturer direct & the retailer gets a cut.
Until we get to that model of delivery for dirt bike support & accessories, the retailers will be piggy in the middle, the way things are structured now, we either have real support or sharp prices, it's rare to see both ( Scott might be able to explain why thor stands out as delivering both ).
P.S. I actually think NZ retailers who've survived are impressive, Scott's prices when given a chance are really sharp, for instance he has thor knee pads which excluding sales tax are cheaper here than the US, sure there are things like Renthall bars, Leatts & some others where it's stark, but I don't see any evidence the NZ retailers are at fault.
P.P.S. Found the same thing with OEM YZF250 headers, price in NZ was no cheaper 4 months ago than in the US, an FMF header on the other hand was alot cheaper in the US & I bought one back for that reason.

''Just in time'' only works if someone somewhere has huge inventory, and the intestinal fortitude to do so. With a population of 4 million that is never going to happen here.
What is overlooked is that many or most manufacturers have lead times and you have to often commit to numbers of lines well in advance. You may be required to place your firm committment in say week 14 of that year, with production slated for say week 32 and delivery by surface would add another 4 to 5 weeks. Such an example is very typical.Manufacturers do not have limitless production capacity! And the ideal scenario is to slightly underproduce so you dont impact negatively on your nett profit by having run out specials. And they get their distributors to commit so that the very highest percentage of each production run is committed to sale. Smart economics.
The problem is that there is now no respect from especially US companies about relative distributors appointed territory. Many are seemingly oblivious to stop and think how this is impacting on their own long term security of employment.

[Robert Taylor]

Some people have warped view on what RRP and trade should be etc.

Internet direct sellers like trade me whores rape the shit out of the industry. Have you noticed that alot of smaller shops and stuff these days have closed their doors? Toy shops are a real prime example of this.

US gear is cheaper mainly due to volume. You get a country that big buying that much gear gets cheaper. The volumes they buy in are huge. we buy in 10 - 100. They buy in 1000 - 100,000

Next time you moan about how much retailers charge take this into consideration.

Rent, power, insurance etc for your shop. Not cheap bills.
The initial outlay costs for stock. You walk into most shops and I bet you look around and most shops think about how much outlay they have forked out.
Staff to run the shops - that gets more expensive every year.

I try to supports shops where I can.

Im sure that many think that shops have a secure room where huge bundles of cash are hoarded. Never found such a room in any building that Ive worked in, only in banks.

[camchain]

Been following this thread with interest. It's good for us to always keep in mind that our buying decisions have more significance than just the dollar 'price' we pay.

But the issue of how 'legitimate' any particuar deal might be is really due to government regulation or lack of it. That's what creates these situations. Stupid global economy. Principle of deregulating the hell out of everything has led to a lot of benefits but maybe even more failures (eg the sheer madness of ridiculous leaking buildings). It's such a dog eat dog world now.

Not every cloud has a silver lining but at least anyone tempted in buying one of these US bikes will still be buying plenty of local parts, tyres etc & may have saved enough to afford some suspension tuning?