Adversarial attitude to road use

[slofox]

(2000th post…I thought about this one…)

Some of you will disagree with certain aspects of what I have to say here – especially the bit about malicious intent. That’s OK, feel free. The focus is the anger thing. On that point, I stand my ground. Please read on…

We New Zealand road users seem to have an adversarial attitude to road use. The other driver is always “an idiot” who is “out to kill me”.ie the other driver is deliberately trying to harm us and is therefore a worthy object of our righteous indignation.

In 46 years of road use, 41 of them as a motorbiker, I think I have only met one other road user who I believe actually tried to do me harm. He was driving an SUV (funny that!) and deliberately swerved across in front of me for reasons unknown. That’s one case in who knows how many million vehicle interactions in all that time. Not the most frequent occurrence.

This is not to say that other road users don’t put you at risk. We all know they do. But I doubt that many of them actually intend harm to others in the first instance. In most cases, it is ignorance, distraction, arrogance, incompetence or something else that results in other road users being put at risk.

The adversarial attitude generates anger on the road. “Did you see that bastard? Fuckim! Tried to fuckin kill me! I’ll get ‘im. Grrrrsnortrantraveroararrrrggghhhhh!” You know the drill and so do I because I do it myself. Once this attitude is fired up, anger follows. And angry drivers are dangerous drivers, more likely to, in their turn, put other road users at risk. Next thing you know, the roads are full of anger and it degenerates into a bun fight. No wonder we have a road toll…everybody is steamed up and pissed off. This is when deliberate harm is more likely to occur.

Contrast certain other countries around the world. I spent time in Cardiff a decade ago now, with its narrow streets and gazillions of cars. And its Welsh citizens who are not always renowned for cool heads…But on the roads, I saw no anger displayed. I saw no aggressive driving like I see here. What I did see was consideration, people allowing others to merge, people making allowances for the errors of others without instantly declaring the erring driver an enemy with evil intent. A bit of tolerance of human fraility and the tendency to make errors.

In China, so I am told by those who visit there, if you want to cross the road as a pedestrian, you fix your eyes on where you want to get to and just start walking. If you just make steady progress, everyone avoids you. Try that here and see how long you last…Again, there is allowance being made for inconvenience caused and for human imperfection. We don’t seem to be able to do that here. We have a national “anger on the roads” mindset. A very dangerous attitude in my book.

I ask myself why we are so aggressive as road users and to be honest I don’t know. But I do firmly believe that with less anger out there, our roads would be safer places. We need to make more allowance for the errors of others without losing our rags and becoming angry drivers ourselves. A cool head makes better decisions. Somewhere along the line, someone has to start the ball rolling and stop being so reactive. Displays of anger almost always result in the same sort of display in return. Tiime to defuse our roads I reckon.

[vifferman]

Yes.


You also forgot to mention that when we're driving, if someone's going too slow, they're a fuckwit, but if they pass us, they're a dangerous maniac (and we resent them, because it impugns our manhood/womanliness).
I reckon as a nation, we have a bad attitude problem, and it's the root cause of our crap driving.
I've always said it's based on our "pioneering spirit", but that's just something I plucked out of my head (or arse, it's the same thing).
It must be true, and if you don't agree with me, you're a dick.

[Slyer]

People just needs anger management, not just for driving but all aspects of life.
Relax guy, sit down take a load off. Sip some ice water.

[Usarka]

And a societal change around this would make more difference than 20 of those road safety initiative reports.

[MSTRS:Me]

It's the visible sign of our dislike of being controlled in most every part of our lives. Our vehicles give us a sense of 'remove' from all that, and therefore we grant ourselves permission to unload on whoever represents a check on what we are doing or want to do.
The correlation between increasing instances of roadrage and the plethora of extra laws etc we are subject to, compared with (say) 20 years ago, cannot be dismissed.
We do not like to have our freedoms curtailed.

[YellowDog]

Congrats on the 2000 posts Mr Fox!

It is hard to dissagree with anything you have said. All I would say is that as you get older and more experienced, you do learn to recognise the potential for anger and to avoid it.

I have also riden/driven in many countries and have noticed a huge variance in driver attitude and aggression levels. Rural Wales is a prime example of where drivers are relaxed and considerate. The same can't be said about London/Paris/Rome/Auckland drivers.

All I would say is that maybe if the Police were pulling people up driving badly, for example, for hogging the outside lane at 70kph, so that other road users have to pass on the inside; then people would have to drive better or get stopped. Smoking a cigarette, using a mobile phone, eating your lunch are all actions that contribute towards bad driving. (Shaving whilst driving is however perfectly safe and acceptable - must stop doing that). Instead the Police are picking on 111kph road users who may be driving carefully and considerately. This is not helping. The 'speed kills' obsession is a bit too general.

Not all Germans are great road users and not all Italian's are maniacs. It just seems that way. The reason some Kiwi drivers feel they are legitimately able to murder (RIP Mr Patel) another road user due to their interpretation of bad driving is because everyone is in the right and there is no 'check' (unless you speed) to help raise standards.

[R6_kid:Me]

It's called Fundamental Attribution Error (FAE) - attributing the behaviour/action to the person and not the situation. Any stage one Psychology student should be able to tell you that and explain what it means.

Funnily enough, it happens all he time, and is just one of the many wonderful things that makes us human. Generally, when you are aware of this principle you tend to become a nicer person.

There is a better explanation here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fundame...ribution_error

[vifferman]

I've only driven in NZ, Australia, California, Belgium and the Netherlands, and I'd have to say that apart from Brussels, Auckland is the worst place I've driven, and New Zealand has some of the worst driver attitudes displayed.

In Brussels, I realised when I drove out of the rental car place that I hadn't bothered to check things like what the local laws were, how to get out of the city, minor stuff like that. I figured I'd just reverse UnZUd rules, and watch the locals to find out how things worked. It turned out that they had no idea of the rules either, so I just used my KombatKommuterKaos skills gleaned from motorbicycling around D'Auckland, and watched each car to decide whether they expected me to give way, or vice-versa.
Signage in Brussels was hit'n'miss: either missing entirely, or if it was present, it was somewhere unhelpful, like on the side of a building, and in some random colour and at a random height. Thus it took me about 90 minutes to get out of Brussels (only a few km!). Even the cops had no idea (stopped and asked them).

There are distinct societal influences on driving habits. In Mrka, they tend to be very courteous and polite, which I suspect is in part due to gun ownership laws. My very first time driving in California, I was so busy looking for signs, that my driving was on auto-pilot, and I drove onto the wrong side of the road (6 lanes) as I exited the rental car depot. No-one tootled me (melodiously or otherwise) - they just stopped, waited, and carried on.

Driving on the highways in Yurp, there were things I was made aware of before I went: don't hog the passing lane, and be careful where you speed (some areas are fiercely policed, without tolerance). So, when I passed, I pulled back in again as soon as I had overtaken. It seems like this is taken to extreme, as it was rather unnerving to have a car overtake you, give one flick of the indicator (or quite commonly, none at all) then pull in abruptly, sometimes less than a metre in front of you. That surprised me, as I was expecting a higher standard of driving.

Australia (well... the bits I've driven in: Vic, NSW, SA, WA) isn't much different to here, except in some areas speeding is policed so rigorously that it's ridiculous. In Melbourne, people drive faster in town than on the highway! You can be doing 95 in a taxi, and on the highway people are dribbling along in case a spoter plane or mufti car pings them. As a result, there's a campaign to stop you falling asleep on the long, straightish, boring roads, with rumble strips, free coffee stops, etc. Unfortunately, most of our "road safety initiatives" are lifted straight from Victoria's books.

[vifferman]

The reason some Kiwi drivers feel they are legitimately able to murder (RIP Mr Patel) another road user due to their interpretation of bad driving is because everyone is in the right and there is no 'check' (unless you speed) to help raise standards.

It's because we're all better drivers than everyone else - all the other drivers are idiots.

[lankyman]

People just needs anger management, not just for driving but all aspects of life.
Relax guy, sit down take a load off. Sip some ice water.

Maybe we should legalise cannabis

[Slyer]

Maybe we should legalise cannabis

Maybe indeed.

[AllanB]

I agree.

However ...........

I do believe some drivers are indeed 'idiots'. I usually witness this behavior when driving my car with the family onboard on our way to a holiday destination.
Indeed earlier this year if MrsB had not advised otherwise I would have got out of my car at Springs Junction and punched the idiot who had endangered the life of my children.
The incident, involving 3 cars (and my trailer) was only avoided due to my keeping a watchful eye on my rear mirrors (something I attribute to motorcycling).

Blind corners at open road speeds are never a good place to pass anyone!

And there have be a few occasions over the years on the road when my own brain hit a false neutral .........

[Swoop]

Congrats on Y2K Slofox!


Please don't forget the crap we are fed... "We are a WARRIOR nation", etc...

[Ferkletastic]

Just been reading the "Speeding" thread which is an excellent case study of what you're discussing.

There does seem to be a 'perceived driving prowess == penis size" attitude in NZ and especially amoungst bikers.

Way too much cock waiving in this country. Hopefully one day we grow up a bit.

[Ixion]

But on the roads, I saw no anger displayed. I saw no aggressive driving like I see here. What I did see was consideration, people allowing others to merge, people making allowances for the errors of others without instantly declaring the erring driver an enemy with evil intent. A bit of tolerance of human fraility and the tendency to make errors.

I see many instances of all these every week on Auckland roads. Most people are decent, most drivers reasonably courteous and (for cages, can't expect biker standards) reasonably competent.