Not allowed to hand out BikersAgainstACCLevies pamphlet at CHCH Biketoberfest

**Kiwi Graham:Me** · 2nd November 2009, 12:30

Having read all that has been said. I have to say I'm impressed that Chris has fronted up and attempted answering the questions/accusations put to him.

Not living on the mainland meant on this occasion I was unable to attend the show. I would have attended regardless of wether ACC sponsored it or not. I would not have minded being give a leaflet objecting to the ACC levy and probably been more supprised had there been no representation of the struggle the motorcycle industry and motorcyclists are having with this issue.

I am dissapointed the OP hasn't taken up the invitation of further debate in the thread. and clarify the points Chris has made.

I dont agree that handing out leaflets would have marred the positive vibe of the days intention (anybody would need to have their head well buried in the sand not to realise about the ACC levy issue) In fact as mentioned in other threads its the general public that are behind us and are generally well informed. Its a little patronising to try and protect them from what is happening and only direct this to other motorcyclists.

I have yet to see any ugly scenes relating to motorcyclist protesting this proposed increase. I was part of the contingent that called on John Keys office in Kumeu and can say we were all perfectly respectable and polite and at no point did it stand a chance of being anything else.

If you had your time over again Chris after hearing how the motorcyclists (on KB anyway) feels would you have allowed the freedom of the OP to 'peacfully' hand out his flyers within the general population of the show?

**shrub** · 2nd November 2009, 12:41

I think Chris did a great job, and handing out flyers is probably now a bit irrelevant. Anyone in the bike community who doesn't know about the levies is either asleep or doesn't care. The most important thing we (as a community that includes dealers like Chris) is build bridges between us, meet, talk and plan reasoned, rational, legal and effective action. Biketoberfest was a valuable part of that process.

I know David Golightly well, and have met Chris several times, and both men are passionate and committed motorcyclists with total integrity who add a lot of value to the community (and BTW I don't ride a Harley).

**gothavealaugh** · 2nd November 2009, 12:46

Well I think we need to vote with our wallets and I for one am not happy about hearing this attude towards a effort to get the message out to the general public. I don't live in christchurch so I don't need to worry about Rolling Thunder ever getting a cent of mine and golightly/Honda Riders Club Insurance (only the insurance part mind you) and vero insurance have no chance of getting a dollar from me and I will move my policy for my business elsewhere does any body know of a supporting company I can take my money to.

**shrub** · 2nd November 2009, 12:57

or more to the point, they know all about the levy rises (their cars are going up too) and there has been a truck load of media coverage. Handing out flyers may be easy and feel good, but that's not what's needed right now. What is needed is reasoned and concerted action by a united motorcycling community. We need to get heard by the Select Committee and we need to win over ACC, the Government and the non-motorcycling community.

Otherwise we'll get what we deserve.

**cowboyz** · 2nd November 2009, 12:59

Originally Posted by Kiwi Graham

.

I am dissapointed the OP hasn't taken up the invitation of further debate in the thread. and clarify the points Chris has made.

If you had your time over again Chris after hearing how the motorcyclists (on KB anyway) feels would you have allowed the freedom of the OP to 'peacfully' hand out his flyers within the general population of the show?

what points need debating? Both agree the Op was there handing out pamphlets. Both agree RT asked him to stop.

The merit of such a decision has been shaddowed with (actually, if I going to be honest - pretty badly written) PR spin doctoring.

Your question is very valid though.. Given the same circumstances, would RT act in the same manner?

**JimO** · 2nd November 2009, 13:02

Originally Posted by gothavealaugh

Well I think we need to vote with our wallets and I for one am not happy about hearing this attude towards a effort to get the message out to the general public. I don't live in christchurch so I don't need to worry about Rolling Thunder ever getting a cent of mine and golightly/Honda Riders Club Insurance (only the insurance part mind you) and vero insurance have no chance of getting a dollar from me and I will move my policy for my business elsewhere does any body know of a supporting company I can take my money to.

overreaction??? my bike is insured with vero and will continue to be

**JimO** · 2nd November 2009, 13:04

Originally Posted by cowboyz

what points need debating? Both agree the Op was there handing out pamphlets. Both agree RT asked him to stop.

The merit of such a decision has been shaddowed with (actually, if I going to be honest - pretty badly written) PR spin doctoring.

Your question is very valid though.. Given the same circumstances, would RT act in the same manner?

its R/Ts party they can do what they want

**gothavealaugh** · 2nd November 2009, 13:13

Originally Posted by jimjim

overreaction??? my bike is insured with vero and will continue to be

Good on you thats your choice, but do you support what was done, I will need to be wise with dollars with the increases and nothing hurts more than giving money to a company that doesn't support my passion for Motorcycles

**The Stranger:Me** · 2nd November 2009, 13:21

Originally Posted by lakedaemonian

Getting our hands dirty over the past year with a good number of rider safety training events at Ruapuna that happens to be using rideforever.co.nz literature is doing more for keeping our fellow riders upright than what most are doing.

Do you have research to back that position?
The Police have clearly stated that rider training is counter productive. Their "logic" is that confident rider/drivers drive faster and speed kills ergo training kills.
This view is to all intents and purposes consistent with the government's view as they really do NOT support driver or rider training in any meaningful way. Any of their "education" is about the perils of driving etc, not about how to actually drive or ride.
A number of years ago they trialed the competency based training. This was axed and not re-instituted, perhaps they do know more than we do in this regard.

**JimO** · 2nd November 2009, 13:22

Originally Posted by gothavealaugh

Good on you thats your choice, but do you support what was done, I will need to be wise with dollars with the increases and nothing hurts more than giving money to a company that doesn't support my passion for Motorcycles

im self employed have 5 cars, 2 bikes so will have a huge amount going to acc and i dont support the increases but do support Rolling Thunder and Dave Golightly not wanting the pamphlets handed out....would you be happy if you were having a party to christen a new baby and the anti aborting crew wanted to hand out their pamphlets. I know its not the same thing but!! .....the op was told where he could hand out the flyers but chose to stir things up on here, the great KB knocking machine

**cowboyz** · 2nd November 2009, 13:26

Originally Posted by jimjim

its R/Ts party they can do what they want

absoultley!

and if I decide to go skydiving without a parachute then I should be allowed to.. Just have to face the consequences of my decision midflight.

**avgas** · 2nd November 2009, 13:29

Originally Posted by shrub

(and BTW I don't ride a Harley).

So do you wave?

**imdying** · 2nd November 2009, 13:29

Originally Posted by gothavealaugh

Good on you thats your choice, but do you support what was done, I will need to be wise with dollars with the increases and nothing hurts more than giving money to a company that doesn't support my passion for Motorcycles

David Golightly has done more for local motorcycling than you ever will

To suggest that he doesn't support your passion for motorcycles just shows you up as an uninformed moron

**shrub** · 2nd November 2009, 13:33

Originally Posted by imdying

David Golightly has done more for local motorcycling than you ever will

To suggest that he doesn't support your passion for motorcycles just shows you up as an uninformed moron

I'm insured with him and always will be.

**gothavealaugh** · 2nd November 2009, 13:35

Originally Posted by jimjim

im self employed have 5 cars, 2 bikes so will have a huge amount going to acc and i dont support the increases but do support Rolling Thunder and Dave Golightly not wanting the pamphlets handed out....would you be happy if you were having a party to christen a new baby and the anti aborting crew wanted to hand out their pamphlets. I know its not the same thing but!! .....the op was told where he could hand out the flyers but chose to stir things up on here, the great KB knocking machine

Maybe not the best example to use there at all, how bout if you went to a political event and some was handing out info on how to vote would you be offended, thats what was being done just information being passed out. We need the support of the Masses not just the motorcyclists if we are to be heard so getting the info to all people is important. I was at the Auckland Uylesses ride and if some came there handing out info on a Bike Shop or Business that supported the cause I would not have complained or if someone came from Acc I would have enjoyed getting to discuss the issues with the proposed changes. Guess thats me I support free speech