Police crackdown

[bogan]

You are missing the point of where the stats are coming from.
Registered cars/injury crashes is around .5%
registered bikes/injury crashes is around 10%

So therefore 20x more likely to be in a injury crash.

Its all just basic maths, its how they sell it thats the problem because if you use the formula its safer to be a pillion than a car passenger

Registered cars/injury passengers is around .11%
registered bikes/injury pillion is around .07%

so therefore nearly twice as likely to be injuryed as a passenger than a pillion.

where did those figures come from? cos they are well misleading/wrong.

[MSTRS:Me]

Registered cars/injury crashes is around .5%
registered bikes/injury crashes is around 10%

Wrong.
Cars = .5%
Bikes = 1%

[Katman]

All this talk of stats is rather pointless.

The fact is that there are too many accidents happening. We need to work out how to reduce them.

[DMNTD:Me]

All this talk of stats is rather pointless.

The fact is that there are too many accidents happening. We need to work out how to reduce them.

Now this I do agree with. Yes stats do have their place however what I deem is the real issue is working out how to minimise the accidents in the first place.

[MSTRS:Me]

All this talk of stats is rather pointless.

The fact is that there are too many accidents happening. We need to work out how to reduce them.

Agreed.
However, when anyone starts quoting statistics, figures, percentages etc - and uses them to set $levies or policies- they should be correct. None of the bullshit TPTB are foisting on us, and calling it truth..

[Scuba_Steve]

All this talk of stats is rather pointless.

The fact is that there are too many accidents happening. We need to work out how to reduce them.

Stop speed scams
Less "pretty coloured lights" at intersections
police bad/slow/inconsiderate driving WITH discretion & warnings
Learners period to be done on 2-wheels
No automatics.
teach people how to merge!

This would be a HUGE step forward in reducing accidents & thus deaths... it aint gonna happen.

[Patrick]

I'd be happier just knowing the breakdown of the actual costs of motorcycle crashes attributable in part and full (individually) to those motorcyclists. I mean, that's the absolute minimum standard of information required to make the excessive ACC levy argument even begin stack up. But it just doesn't appear to exist.

I've asked about this exact thing, with ACC here in the Naki... no joy either...

the way the quote is written it sounds more like if you are involved in a crash, a biker is 20x more likely to be hurt. Makes no mention of the rate at which the different classes crash.... but thats just my take on it

At last... someone who gets it.....

IF you are in a crash, and you are on a motorbike, you are 20x more likely to be hurt..., than if you are in a car, and have a crash in that car....

And as for the conspiracy theorists... if they are wanting to be rid of bikes, why are they going down this path of refresher education, pamplet handouts etc - mainly aimed at those who think they are bullet proof and above all road laws and common sense....???

Even those that are absolutely certain that know it all and can't be taught anything, might pick up something from it all.... or not....

[Katman]

Agreed.
However, when anyone starts quoting statistics, figures, percentages etc - and uses them to set $levies or policies- they should be correct. None of the bullshit TPTB are foisting on us, and calling it truth..

If we put as much effort into trying to reduce accidents as we seem to put into analysing stats we'd have half the problem solved by now and be in a position to start using our own stats against them.

[Patrick]

All this talk of stats is rather pointless.

The fact is that there are too many accidents happening. We need to work out how to reduce them.

Yay... two now.... who get it, that is...

Stop speed scams stop speeding - -leave it on the track... sorted.
Less "pretty coloured lights" at intersections - red means stop, orange means should stop, green = go... those coloured lights???? I'm usually glad they are there...
police bad/slow/inconsiderate driving WITH discretion & warnings - discretion and warnings for bad/slow/inconsiderate police drivers? Then what would KB bitch about then...?
Learners period to be done on 2-wheels - hell yeah - more attentive drivers, once in cars, then and only then!
No automatics.Hell yeah...! Autos are for lazy folk.
teach people how to merge! - They know - just won't let anyone get in front of their car, at any cost, how dare them think they could do such a heinous thing... that's all...
This would be a HUGE step forward in reducing accidents & thus deaths... it aint gonna happen.

Sad, but true....

[Bald Eagle]

It is a really basic situation folks. A lot of motorcycle riders need serious AA ( attitude adjustment ) as do an equal number of other vehicle operators.

When we all take responsibility for ourselves and stop driving/riding without any mantrol then the stats will all improve.

Simple really.

[mashman]

IF you are in a crash, and you are on a motorbike, you are 20x more likely to be hurt..., than if you are in a car, and have a crash in that car....

Based on what Information? There's a HUGE difference between 20x more likely and it actually happening. Take a look at the injury stats published, 78% of all reported road injuries are car related. Yet we're 20x more likely ... Can you explain that one?

And as for the conspiracy theorists... if they are wanting to be rid of bikes, why are they going down this path of refresher education, pamplet handouts etc - mainly aimed at those who think they are bullet proof and above all road laws and common sense....???

I'm not one of the conspiracy theorists, well not really... the education being handed out is, as per usual, shite (here, suck eggs), and judging by the stats, the education is being directed at the wrong "user" group . That's a fact and not a conspiracy theory, they're published numbers. Sounds like a pathetic excuse to do something, may as well be getting the dirty dirty motorcyclists off the road...

Even those that are absolutely certain that know it all and can't be taught anything, might pick up something from it all.... or not....

Well obviously not because TPTB are still using dodgy numbers to suit their own agenda...

[Scuba_Steve]

stop speeding - -leave it on the track... sorted.
-- yes if everyone went 0km/h crashes would be VERY hard to achieve. current speed laws are and speed scams endanger lives while increasing accident rates, scrap them & excessive speed will be charged with "dangerous driving" as will driving dangerously at any speed. safer roads, less crashes, harsher penalties for those who are actually dangerous. Simple.

Less "pretty coloured lights" at intersections - red means stop, orange means should stop, green = go... those coloured lights???? I'm usually glad they are there...
--"pretty coloured lights" make lazy drivers, lazy drivers are dangerous!

[Patrick]

Based on what Information? There's a HUGE difference between 20x more likely and it actually happening. Take a look at the injury stats published, 78% of all reported road injuries are car related. Yet we're 20x more likely ... Can you explain that one?

Yes.

As a motorbike rider, if you are involved in a crash, YOU, as a motorbike rider, are 20 times more likely to be injured.... Doesn't matter who is at fault... Dunno how to make it any clearer.

I'm not one of the conspiracy theorists, well not really... the education being handed out is, as per usual, shite (here, suck eggs), and judging by the stats, the education is being directed at the wrong "user" group . That's a fact and not a conspiracy theory, they're published numbers. Sounds like a pathetic excuse to do something, may as well be getting the dirty dirty motorcyclists off the road...

Again, why bother... Who says it is the wrong user group? Too many Motorbike riders can bring misery onto themselves... apparently... This is something that is hard to comprehend, I know... but.....

Well obviously not because TPTB are still using dodgy numbers to suit their own agenda...

Sigh...

stop speeding - -leave it on the track... sorted.
-- yes if everyone went 0km/h crashes would be VERY hard to achieve.

True - but 0km/h isn't what the signs say. Ones round here say 50 and 100 - not 237....

current speed laws are and speed scams endanger lives while increasing accident rates, scrap them & excessive speed will be charged with "dangerous driving" as will driving dangerously at any speed. safer roads, less crashes, harsher penalties for those who are actually dangerous. Simple.

This doesn't make sense... do away with "speed scams" and then saying charge them with dangerous driving?

Less "pretty coloured lights" at intersections - red means stop, orange means should stop, green = go... those coloured lights???? I'm usually glad they are there...
--"pretty coloured lights" make lazy drivers, lazy drivers are dangerous!

True. Just have a look what happens when any set of traffic lights goes out for any reason... The sheer look of horror on drivers faces when they have to "think" what to do....

[BoristheBiter]

where did those figures come from? cos they are well misleading/wrong.

http://www.transport.govt.nz/researc...hs-2009-v2.xls

other than the decimal point in the wrong place they are correct.
It is the way it is looked at that changes.


All that the stats tell us that in 2009 a % of cars had injury crashes and a % of bikes had injury crashes and % wise more bikes had injury crashes.

[bogan]

True. Just have a look what happens when any set of traffic lights goes out for any reason... The sheer look of horror on drivers faces when they have to "think" what to do....

no crashes though cos nobody moves! Was glad I was on my bike that day an could just split through it.

As always you got balance the efficiencies, causes of crashes such as speed or inattention have to balance out with efficiency of transport, slow is safer but it's not exactly efficient travel.
The speed limits are to balance safety with efficiency, it's not some arbitrary number where things magically get dangerous. Seems to me you can balance speed with some extra attention (over a journey, not a lot can balance doing 75 through a 30kmhr corner!) and gets you extra efficiency too; and we all know your average biker pays more attention than your average cager...