Announcement on ACC funded $2m scheme

**Usarka** · 24th January 2011, 11:59

Originally Posted by Quasievil

not even one page and there is NZ riders are Voters, Ridesafe Nelson, Bronz

get me point ?

we should start another maybe NZMAO New Zealand Action Motorcycle Action Organisation

New Zealand Legislative Motorcycle Focus Action Organisation. lmfao!

**MSTRS:Me** · 24th January 2011, 12:59

Originally Posted by Nasty

Interesting the article mentioned that it is also for use of education of drivers.

Which was exactly my point, earlier. If 'we' are to be levied, THEN SO SHOULD THEY.

Originally Posted by Roadsafe Nelson

An unpaid ad for a business that utilises existing ACC funds, in conjunction with certain enlightened city councils, for the purposes of creating 'safer' riders.

No MSL needed.

Originally Posted by mashman

If ACC were truly concerned with reducing the accident rates, they'd have a single safety levy, charging $10 on all vehicles. That would drastically swell the safety fund for ALL road users, no bias towards user groups etc...

Hear hear

**Squiggles** · 24th January 2011, 13:22

Originally Posted by Mom

I think the question of transparency is a valid one to be honest.

Terms of Reference etc are on this page...

**StoneY** · 24th January 2011, 13:28

Originally Posted by Squiggles

Terms of Reference etc are on this page...

What he said

There has been transparency ever since the levies went up....there has been no closed doors and no secrets...its all public knowledge.
As well as the NUMEROUS times we have posted updates and information on Kiwibiker....
But then again I suppose us who have been sharing the information are all just too keen to feed at the trough......... after all thats what the average KBer seems to think of us despite the ammout of very public information on the whole process being right there to read on ACCs website

**blackdog** · 24th January 2011, 13:56

Originally Posted by avgas

I got a flyer on my car window today. New boxing gym / fitness center.
If you think that everyone would benefit from "basic skills" bike training........thats fair enough.
I mean clearly someone out there thinks everyone needs a gym membership and is fat.

Don't mean its always true.

the benefits may not be from the training itself, and i'm not sure that we are talking about basic training either, my understanding was that we are talking intermediate to advanced here

if you think there is nothing else you can still learn you are mistaken

**MSTRS:Me** · 24th January 2011, 14:27

Originally Posted by theblackstig

the benefits may not be from the training itself, and i'm not sure that we are talking about basic training either, my understanding was that we are talking intermediate to advanced here

if you think there is nothing else you can still learn you are mistaken

Unless TV ads, roadside billboards etc are what is done, then I reckon the fund will be spent on subsidised training aimed at new bikers and returnees.
Experienced riders won't really be the target.

**Usarka** · 24th January 2011, 14:32

If there's any hint of compuslory hi-vis i will be loading the rifle.

Followed some goose in the car today he wearing his hi-vis and he couldn't ride for shit. I had no idea where he was going (at 40kph) and how safe it was to overtake without killing him. Much better and safer to get some training/skills than to wear a fluoro jacket.

**StoneY** · 24th January 2011, 14:47

Originally Posted by Usarka

If there's any hint of compuslory hi-vis i will be loading the rifle.

I would be holding the bandolier for ya myself...thats simply not gonna happen man, not from MSL anyway.

Training and Engineering/Education projects are likely to be the initial focus points

**Usarka** · 24th January 2011, 14:49

Sweet bro I know you're on our side - do us proud!

**avgas** · 25th January 2011, 08:26

Originally Posted by riffer

Four whiners does not "the public" make.

Are you sure?
Seemed to in the past - isn't that why we have a "safety levy"?

**riffer** · 25th January 2011, 14:27

Originally Posted by avgas

Are you sure?
Seemed to in the past - isn't that why we have a "safety levy"?

I was referring to some of the posts in this thread mate. On the contrary, the reason we have a safety levy is because one particular individual, seeing the writing on the wall, tried to capture some of the ridiculous increase and ring-fence it for a fund that motorcyclists had some say in.

I find it ironic that the majority of the complaints about "noses in the trough" come from individuals sympathetic to persons who were emailing BRONZ enquiring about how to "get their hands on some of that money". Public statements of opposition to the MSL did not come until after it was publicly announced that no-one was getting handouts and that there was no free-for-all.

**Lucyloo** · 25th January 2011, 14:59

[QUOTE=Maha;1129965430]Why would anyone from MAG want to be on a committiee that is duty bound to serve the government and a department thereof, when we apposed to the very reason why the committe was set up in the first place?
You guys have known all along where MAG stands on the MSL issue.
QUOTE]

I agree wholeheartedly - being on the MSL committee would be giving approval of the whole sorry debacle and I am very proud that MAG has chosen the stance that they have.

**rustic101** · 25th January 2011, 18:16

I've just read a few other posts and threads where the Minister is referred to as 'Nick'. I would strongly suggest that you call or refer to him as 'the Minister', and not Nick!!! You need to keep these slippery pricks (all parties) at arms length, anything else will see you being used and manipulated even more than you are already.

I have said this before and will continue to say this! The MSL fund and committee is an absolute joke, in fact its almost insulting. It has been self manufactured out of an issue that does not exist when putting motorcyclists crash and death rate into perspective with other road users. This has been done using statistics and figures that are manipulated to suit that justification rather than the truth.

The committee will bring nothing, yes nothing new to 'reduce' the death, crash or injury rate of motorcyclists that is not already being done by existing agencies like MOT, LTSA, Transit, Police, ACC and a host of NGO's. This includes the education of other road users towards motorcyclists. What the committee have created is another bureaucratic layer that will achieve nothing and further divide other Agencies targeting the alleged issue' and make progress even slower with in house fighting and who controls what....

Individuals and their supporters are saying its a fund that is managed by 'motorcyclists'; yet I have no control over this fund, I do not belong to any of the groups represented on the 'committee', nor would I want any of these people representing me. Other claims have been made they will not be reimbursed, well bollocks.

There are plenty of safety and skills courses that individuals can do if they choose to do so. This committee or its outputs will never, never change the one thing that is killing riders 'Their minds', by this I mean their physiological make up. You can rap them in cotton wool however it is the split second amygdala response that will kill you every time. Further to this licenced and registered riders are not the 'guilty culprits', a very large % of deaths are the direct result of unregistered, unlicensed riders, over powered for class of licences, or individuals on stolen bikes. Again the issue has been squarely label on the 90%ish of us that are law abiding. This is also evident with the likes of firearms; the risk is not with the 'legal registered users.

Personally I feel as if my voice was sold out, prior to the BIKIO I heard, we will never back down, never cave in, all the raa raa, etc etc etc. I stood on Parliament Grounds and clearly heard those words 'BULL SHIT, BULL SHIT'...

It is sometimes better to be beaten, bloodied and torn by a beast yet have the pride to stand tall united than to have pandered to the Master and used as a Mariette.

**Katman** · 25th January 2011, 18:52

Originally Posted by rustic101

Further to this licenced and registered riders are not the 'guilty culprits', a very large % of deaths are the direct result of unregistered, unlicensed riders, over powered for class of licences, or individuals on stolen bikes.

The vast majority of motorcycle accidents are had by motorcyclists who don't have sufficient skills to get themselves out of spots of bother, by motorcyclists who don't have sufficient situational awareness, and by motorcyclists who persist in riding in a manner that makes them an accident waiting to happen.