Wellington City Council, parking charges. MAG-NZ correspondence

[Hitcher]

So you judge groups not by what they stand for, but by their members conduct?

Yes, particularly members in leadership and representational roles. Deeds count more for me than mere words, particularly from organisations that claim to be acting in my best interests.

[apes]

The frontal area argument holds no weight as a bike's cd is usually between .45 and .60, while the average small car (I've used a Hyundai i30) is .329. The less weight argument holds no weight with me personally as I've previously posted the comparative consumption and running costs between my old '05 Z750 and my '99 Ford Ka (cd of .36). The Ka beats the bike hands down, being some $2500 a year less expensive to run.

but is the Ford Ka a comperable vehicle to the Z750, me thinks not, I would compare the Z750 to a TVR, an Aerial Atom, a Z4 or the such, this is the problem of comparing cars with bikes, don't compare a high performance bike to a low capacity commuter car, you wouldn't compare your Ka to a Mustang would you

[apes]

Yes, particularly members in leadership and representational roles. Deeds count more for me than mere words, particularly from organisations that claim to be acting in my best interests.

if you can do better then do it, if you have advice for me then provide it, but whatever you do be pro biker, that is what we are fighting for here

[apes]

The cynic in me wondered idly if they were trying to force people into their flash new trains (that don't work)...

Make it too hard/expensive to ride = take a car; then
Make it too congested to drive = take the train.

But a local Gummint would never be so cynical, right?

i would be that cynical, but as I believe in todays culture some will never give up their personal transport

[Smifffy]

So you judge groups not by what they stand for, but by their members conduct? Fuck you must have trouble come voting time

I actually judge them a great deal on the conduct and public behaviour of their officials and designated spokespeople.

Much like I judge the political party for whom I would cast my vote.

I admire much of what a few of the political parties stand for, however they allow themselves to be represented by a bunch of dim-witted morons for whom there is no other suitable occupation.

[Hitcher]

if you can do better then do it, if you have advice for me then provide it, but whatever you do be pro biker, that is what we are fighting for here

You're missing the point. I thought I had provided advice in my first contribution to this thread. The OP, who I presume is a MAG-NZ officer of some sort, disagreed with that and took a shot at me in the process.

Anybody who thinks that I'm anti-biker may not know me that well.

I have a smattering of experience in dealing with policy officials in central and local government, enough to know how they operate and, in some cases, who they are. Trust me when I suggest that they are not well disposed to badgering and threats.

[Ronin]

If you can do better then do it. If you have advice for me then provide it. But whatever you do be pro biker, that is what we are fighting for here.

Fixed that right up for you.

So by your logic you will be running for Priminister then? Either that or you have no complaints. Not all of us are interested in being involved in the 'fight'. However, if someone is going to stand up and 'represent' all Bikers then they should do so in a profession manner.

[Smifffy]

As an aside, if I were to receive a formal letter with the salutation of "My dear....." I would bin it smartly without further ado, as I would presume that it originates from someone whose intent is to patronise me.

Formal letters should be addressed as "Dear *title*" if they are to be taken seriously.

That isn't my rule by the way.

http://www.google.co.nz/search?q=for...ter+salutation

There's another piece of advice for y'all.

[bogan]

I actually judge them a great deal on the conduct and public behaviour of their officials and designated spokespeople.

Much like I judge the political party for whom I would cast my vote.

I admire much of what a few of the political parties stand for, however they allow themselves to be represented by a bunch of dim-witted morons for whom there is no other suitable occupation.

yeh I know what you mean, was mostly taking the piss in an effort to stop this getting personal.

For the record MAG-NZ doesn't get in the way of our member's right to call the shots on actions they are working on, unless their actions break our rules. I reckon we may cop some flak because some disagree with our members methods or people skills etc, but it isn't a fucking popularity contest here. So to those who do get offended, just un-wad your panties and watch shit get done

[apes]

Fixed that right up for you.

So by your logic you will be running for Priminister then? Either that or you have no complaints. Not all of us are interested in being involved in the 'fight'. However, if someone is going to stand up and 'represent' all Bikers then they should do so in a profession manner.

no by that logic, this is not my profession, no one else stood up in the region to have everyone say what a bad job they were doing, to have no one say i don't totally agree with what you are saying but can we meet up and discuss a few things as we have some things in common.
i have no interest in the professional side of politics, but if no one else will make themselves a target to fight for what we believe in, i will step in. i will make mistakes, i listen to constructive advice.
i accept confrontation is not the best way of dealing with officialdom, but as 38 years of fighting for riders right in the UK has proved, along with other protest movements over the centuries it is often the way through the door. i am not asking anyone to break the law, i am just looking for a number of people who willingly want to be political irritants, whether it be physical action or letter writing or as we already have in place through our colleagues at BRoNZ a petition, all of these back up the formal consultations which work alongside the action. the action demonstrates how that community felt about such an issue.
as some of you have noticed i consider free parking to be a right, to this date i have never paid to park a motorbike anywhere and i intend to carry on that way, if you have other arguments you would like me to raise with the council them pm me or email wellington@mag-nz.org, we need to stand as one and stop fighting amongst ourselves otherwise we will find ourselves all considered as outlaws even the granny on her 50cc scooter

[Ronin]

.
as some of you have noticed i consider free parking to be a right,

And there you go. It is not a right. It never has been. It would be nice if the status quo were to continue but it won't.

[apes]

As an aside, if I were to receive a formal letter with the salutation of "My dear....." I would bin it smartly without further ado, as I would presume that it originates from someone whose intent is to patronise me.

Formal letters should be addressed as "Dear *title*" if they are to be taken seriously.

That isn't my rule by the way.

http://www.google.co.nz/search?q=for...ter+salutation

There's another piece of advice for y'all.

and should be finished yours faithfully or yours sincerely, but in the realm of emails the rules are a little more relaxed as it is a half way house between written and verbal communication as the reply can sometimes be near instant

[BMWST?]

It would be nice if the status quo were to continue but it won't.

we dont know that yet

[CookMySock]

The whole idea of discussing this with the WCC is based on the idea that they are interested in what you have to say, and they are prepared to be equitable.



So now that we have that out of the way, I'd suggest you completely forget trying to discuss anything with them, and put your energy into figuring out how to getting out of their tickets and preventing them from "towing" your bike.

[Hitcher]

i have no interest in the professional side of politics, but if no one else will make themselves a target to fight for what we believe in, i will step in. i will make mistakes, i listen to constructive advice.

Good on you. But my earlier comments weren't about you or aimed at you.

There are some good eggs whose hearts are in the right places who volunteer a lot of time to work hard on issues that affect bikers. Good on them. It's largely thankless work.

Some are a bit naive when it comes to developing an argument and don't do themselves any favours by not noticing when somebody's boss has been cced into an email and also for not knowing that there is a difference between a superior and a direct report. They also don't do themselves or their organisation any favours when they lose their temper. Causes like this shouldn't be about personalities. They should be about articulate, reasoned and compelling argument.