Benefits

[Swoop]

will avgas now be voting labour?

http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/poli...pprenticeships

It is interesting to see that liarbore have picked up on a scheme that used to work very well. Pay employers a few dollars to train a young person. It helps train and educate, keep them off the streets, get some self esteem; amongst others. There are benefits for the employer and the country in the longer term.

Really a case of "back to the future" if this eventuates.

It is noted that a similar scheme in The Netherlands has input from their "winz" people, who detect "at risk" youths and give a slightly higher incentive to the employer.
Much better to pay the money out at that stage to an employer, than later having to pay for the judicial system and the incarceration system, the rehabilitation system...

The Labour government of 1984 put an end to all that when they introduced "userpays"!

But... They were/are soooooooooo wise.

[Voltaire]

Do we really want a country in which Grand Parents compete for MacDo jobs with the kids?
And who still employs people over 50?

I'm 50 now..... I could be that old bloke at Bunnings or Mitre 10 who knows stuff without having to ask the computah....

computers/mobile phones/internet and 'networking" have stopped people thinking for themselves.

[Toaster]

Benefits should be a safety net in times of need (e.g. redundancy, injury, income earner leaves the family - child support), not a lifestyle choice for the lazy or those that choose to breed generational bludgers.

Idle hands are never a good thing.

[Clockwork]

I call rubbish to you there. .....
Right now my old man is begging for some workforce help in Chch. Job pays good, but its hard work and most of the sods would rather earn quarter the money doing fuck all.

At the low end of the market the world is your oyster. The problem is like I said. Stupid lazy people have a paid alternative to working.

Sadly, I suspect you are right. My school leaver 18 year old has been temping as a laborer for Allied, Ok he has his own transport and we have been able subsidise his living expenses (as and when needed) but the fact is he consistently working 30+ hours a week, is getting recalled back to clients by name and he's now been asked if he'd be interested in a builder's apprenticeship with one of the "clients"

But... They were/are soooooooooo wise.

Fair's fair, that particular Labour Government now trades as the Act party.

[frogfeaturesFZR]

Benefits should be a safety net in times of need (e.g. redundancy, injury, income earner leaves the family - child support), not a lifestyle choice for the lazy or those that choose to breed generational bludgers.

Idle hands are never a good thing.

Well said that man, now you do realize you'll be ostracized for talking sense ?

[scumdog]

Benefits should be a safety net in times of need (e.g. redundancy, injury, income earner leaves the family - child support), not a lifestyle choice for the lazy or those that choose to breed generational bludgers.

Echos my thoughts on the subject!`

But critcise those that chose that 'lifestyle' (life? - it's eeking out an existence one 'groundhog-day' after the other) at you peril.

"We'z got rights ya know"

[DMNTD:Me]

ha ha ha haaaaaa... sorry, but how would you force them to work?

If they want to eat/pay bills/etc...they have to 'work'

[racefactory]

If they want to eat/pay bills/etc...they have to 'work'

Trouble is it's just not that easy to get 'work' these days. Even unfinished supermarkets have hundreds of desperate lining up. I've seen the depressing sights myself. It's certainly not how it used to be back before 08; it was piss easy to find jobs. I remember getting offered jobs without even asking after them back then! A good indicator is the amount of these cancerous recruitment agencies that have literally sprung out from the floorboards as of recently.

You need a degree to clean toilets and a 'pre-trade' qualification before you can even hope to start an apprenticeship. MacD's is the safest option for career prospects and job security now.

[mashman]

gun point?

heh... no doubt the day will come .

If they want to eat/pay bills/etc...they have to 'work'

or thieve, or contribute to the black market. If it ever comes to that, I'd venture that the like minded, or pocketed in this case, will get together to remedy their financial situation and people will die... and it'll probably be the well fed ones that do the dying... bit dramatic I'm sure some will say (buckets of sand all round), but at the end of the day that sort of shit happens all over the world today!

[BoristheBiter]

heh... no doubt the day will come .



or thieve, or contribute to the black market. If it ever comes to that, I'd venture that the like minded, or pocketed in this case, will get together to remedy their financial situation and people will die... and it'll probably be the well fed ones that do the dying... bit dramatic I'm sure some will say (buckets of sand all round), but at the end of the day that sort of shit happens all over the world today!

Yep because when they are caught for this they are let out to do it again.
But that is a whole other can of worms to open up.

the reason we have the fucked up welfare system we have today is they try and accommodate everything in one go instead of fixing the problems as they go.
Yes there needs to be a bigger picture but trying to get to the end in one go just makes it all that much harder.

[oldrider]

Benefits should be a safety net in times of need (e.g. redundancy, injury, income earner leaves the family - child support), not a lifestyle choice for the lazy or those that choose to breed generational bludgers.

Idle hands are never a good thing.

I have a niece who did just that, set up a lifestyle around the benefit system, knocked out two sprogs, excluded the fathers and is also a lifetime student of fuck all!

Gets all the perks and even has "student" trips overseas! (where one of the fathers of her sprog comes from!)

These spongers certainly know how to work the systems!

Even worse, the system guardians are part of maintaining the bloody deal!

[avgas]

Trouble is it's just not that easy to get 'work' these days. Even unfinished supermarkets have hundreds of desperate lining up. I've seen the depressing sights myself. It's certainly not how it used to be back before 08; it was piss easy to find jobs. I remember getting offered jobs without even asking after them back then!
You need a degree to clean toilets and a 'pre-trade' qualification before you can even hope to start an apprenticeship. MacD's is the safest option for career prospects and job security now.

Sounds like your scared of competition.

A good indicator is the amount of these cancerous recruitment agencies that have literally sprung out from the floorboards as of recently.

99% of recruitment agents are scum bags who don't have an HR bone in their body. Its the scum we seemed to have sucked from UK and Canada.

I am currently applying for better work. So I have having to deal with them on a weekly basis now. I would rather go to a blind dentist. Argh you have got me started on recruitment agents I need to go sit down.

Down side of being a nice place to live. All the scum soon come to rest.

[imdying]

Benefits should be a safety net in times of need (e.g. redundancy, injury, income earner leaves the family - child support), not a lifestyle choice for the lazy or those that choose to breed generational bludgers.

This is rubbish.

If people don't want to work, why do you think that you should be able to make them? People are not your fucking slaves.

The majority of society that believes working is king, that giving a third or more of your life to make other people rich, is the way to go. Good on them. However there is no reason why everybody should have to follow that path.

This is a fact. We already know this to be true. We currently do not expect prisoners, pensioners, or children to work. We know that the world doesn't collapse if we don't all do what is the current norm as we've had the majority of humanities life span with prisoners, pensioners, and children, working.

You can either pay a benefit to those people who do not want to follow the path of all the other sheeple, or you can suffer the result of giving them no other option than to live in the one narrow minded society we currently have without money.

Really, as I've said many times before, the problem is one of over population. We don't have 200,000 unemployed in this country, we have about 2,000,000 more people than we need.

The other problem we have is that we insist on trying to bring up everybody to the same level. Well I've got news for you sunshine, ALL PEOPLE ARE NOT EQUAL. That whole notion is fucking ridiculous. Problem is, people are too blind to see that not equal does not mean better or worse, IT JUST MEANS THAT THEY ARE NOT EQUAL. Big fucking deal. You can't have a relentless greedy society like we have without people at the top, and people at the bottom. Simple as that.

[oneofsix]

This is rubbish.

If people don't want to work, why do you think that you should be able to make them? People are not your fucking slaves.

The majority of society that believes working is king, that giving a third or more of your life to make other people rich, is the way to go. Good on them. However there is no reason why everybody should have to follow that path.

This is a fact. We already know this to be true. We currently do not expect prisoners, pensioners, or children to work. We know that the world doesn't collapse if we don't all do what is the current norm as we've had the majority of humanities life span with prisoners, pensioners, and children, working.

You can either pay a benefit to those people who do not want to follow the path of all the other sheeple, or you can suffer the result of giving them no other option than to live in the one narrow minded society we currently have without money.

Really, as I've said many times before, the problem is one of over population. We don't have 200,000 unemployed in this country, we have about 2,000,000 more people than we need.

The other problem we have is that we insist on trying to bring up everybody to the same level. Well I've got news for you sunshine, ALL PEOPLE ARE NOT EQUAL. That whole notion is fucking ridiculous. Problem is, people are too blind to see that not equal does not mean better or worse, IT JUST MEANS THAT THEY ARE NOT EQUAL. Big fucking deal. You can't have a relentless greedy society like we have without people at the top, and people at the bottom. Simple as that.

All people are equal, they are not all the same.
If they don't want to work they don't have to, there are some who make this choice but don't rely on the benefit.
The benefit should only be a safety net. I have one using it as that at the moment whilst trying hard to find work.
IMO the benefit is a form of employment, you are employed to find work or bring up a kid or whatever. If they don't like the rules they can find another way providing it is within the rules of society or take the consequences.

[BoristheBiter]

This is rubbish.

If people don't want to work, why do you think that you should be able to make them? People are not your fucking slaves.

The majority of society that believes working is king, that giving a third or more of your life to make other people rich, is the way to go. Good on them. However there is no reason why everybody should have to follow that path.

This is a fact. We already know this to be true. We currently do not expect prisoners, pensioners, or children to work. We know that the world doesn't collapse if we don't all do what is the current norm as we've had the majority of humanities life span with prisoners, pensioners, and children, working.

You can either pay a benefit to those people who do not want to follow the path of all the other sheeple, or you can suffer the result of giving them no other option than to live in the one narrow minded society we currently have without money.

Really, as I've said many times before, the problem is one of over population. We don't have 200,000 unemployed in this country, we have about 2,000,000 more people than we need.

The other problem we have is that we insist on trying to bring up everybody to the same level. Well I've got news for you sunshine, ALL PEOPLE ARE NOT EQUAL. That whole notion is fucking ridiculous. Problem is, people are too blind to see that not equal does not mean better or worse, IT JUST MEANS THAT THEY ARE NOT EQUAL. Big fucking deal. You can't have a relentless greedy society like we have without people at the top, and people at the bottom. Simple as that.

Your right if people don't want to work that's fine, just don't expect to be paid for that choice. and why should i pay for that?

And you are right, people are not all equal, to think that you are an equal to me, don't make me laugh you don't even come close.