The youth...

[jazfender]

I'm from the same generation as a lot of these people, but I can't for the life of me see the appeal in driving in a $300 car with $3000 wheels, wear a silly hat with a straight peak, listen to nothing but bass in my car and spend the other half of my time pulling my pants up.....the ladies love seeing boxers........

-Indy

Same generation but entirely different culture.

Are you saying that is is the stupid kids adopting a stupid culture when obviously most kids don't try to be gangsta wannabes? Well I didn't want to infer that. Clearly they are not trying to better themselves by going to school.

And why are you having a go at the intellectually handicapped? That's not very nice.

I said impressionable, not stupid. What else do you turn to when you are raised in an environment without hope?

And it was just an expression.

what do these shitheads do that desirves respecting

That's impossible to answer without actually knowing them.

I'm no fan of kneejerk racism or rednecks. However I honestly don't think that is an issue here. Youth of any background tagging defacing or breaking other peoples property is wrong. It's nasty disrespectful stuff. If someone spraypainted your bike Jaz, you'd be a saint if you weren't at least slightly annoyed. If someone wandered into your home and scribbled on the walls, you'd be astonished and unimpressed.

Public spaces belong to all of us and deserve to be respected by all of us. I don't want my young children examining crude penis drawings and abusive language when I take them to the park. I don't want my dear old mum to see it either.

I know, vandalism sounds small-time. It isn't murder or burglary or drug dealing. However it is a signature - of disrespect and arrogance towards the rest of society who provide the parks, the schools, the hospitals - all for free.

Similarly cruelty to animals is a signature of a potential violent offender. If we ignore the nasty small stuff we encourage the larger dangerous stuff.

The parks the schools and the hospitals don't compare to an environment free of violence.

Anyway, what this racist Headbanger chump did was see some kids tagging, charge over like a hero, spit the dummy and come straight online to congratulate himself as if he's somehow 'cracked the code' to stopping vandalism. A few cheeky handjobs and a backrub from his mates later and everyone agrees that this is the ANSWER to property damage.

Typical bunch of fat white old men reinforcing attitudes that might have applied sixty years ago but are NO LONGER RELEVANT AND DO NOT WORK.

Chumpbanger most probably reinforced their idea of cool because they sure as fuck don't wanna be like him.

-

As an aside, tagging is not about disrespecting peoples' property for the sake of disrespecting peoples' property. It's an expression, a voice, a statement or an idea and humans have been doing it for millenia.

Shit, there's a table in a Blenheim pub covered in scrawls from people going back decades - it has been lacquered over to preserve them.

[ducatilover]

As an aside, tagging is not about disrespecting peoples' property for the sake of disrespecting peoples' property. It's an expression, a voice, a statement or an idea and humans have been doing it for millenia.

Shit, there's a table in a Blenheim pub covered in scrawls from people going back decades - it has been lacquered over to preserve them.

Having grown up in Wainuiomata, I learned that the majority of taggers (most of my old mates, I never bothered, I had cars and naked women to draw) did so because they wanted to fuck someone off, it was not art, they hated the art idea. It was not an expressive thing, they just wanted to wind people up.
We ended up painting our fences with diesel to stop the paint from sticking.
I've been involved with that culture and I do not tolerate people defacing others property, or public property.
If you have something helpful to say that points us towards a root cause, I'd like to read it.


I'd rather not have some misguided, neglected hoodlum paint all over my stuff.
If they spent their time doing something practical, everything would be nice. Like, they could make me a cup of tea or trim my hedge.

[unstuck]

I wonder how many people are sitting around verbalizing their disaproval about tagging and vandalism, while their kids are at the mall or park with a marker or can, leaving their mark.

[MIXONE]

I wonder how many people are sitting around verbalizing their disaproval about tagging and vandalism, while their kids are at the mall or park with a marker or can, leaving their mark.

Not mine for a start.I'm with Headbanger on this one.Sitting back and letting these young tosspots get away with it is not the answer.A swift kick to the nether regions would be a good start.Don't know the whole answer though.

[Headbanger]

-

As an aside, tagging is not about disrespecting peoples' property for the sake of disrespecting peoples' property. It's an expression, a voice, a statement or an idea and humans have been doing it for millenia.

Shit, there's a table in a Blenheim pub covered in scrawls from people going back decades - it has been lacquered over to preserve them.

You have some growing up to do, Perspective will come with maturity,Hopefully your delusion will lift. Petty vandalism is just that, and people don't want that scribble on our shit, And no one has the right to put it there.Your justification is pointless,weak, and pathetic. You are a disgrace. Take note that you are out of step with every single other person who has entered into the discussion, There is something to be taken from that, and its not that everyone else is a twat, its you.

The post wasn't made to highlight my actions which were fruitless and pointless but to raise the subject and highlight there arrogance and brazenness, Its not something to be proud of, Its not cultural, Its something that needs to be stopped, we as a community shouldn't allow it.

And that isn't a call to arms, Against children,even thick ones that's pathetic, They just need to be shamed.

[unstuck]

Not mine for a start.I'm with Headbanger on this one.Sitting back and letting these young tosspots get away with it is not the answer.A swift kick to the nether regions would be a good start.Don't know the whole answer though.

Yeah, violence has worked in the past I guess No easy answers, has got to start at home In my opinion. Maybe the young ones caught tagging should be taken home and their parents made to pay for the clean up or clean it up themselves. But a lot of these familys dont give a fuck about what their kids are getting up to, too busy getting stoned and pissed or some shit to worry about it I guess. Really dont think flying off the handle at them is the way to solve anything though. Maybe paint the world in that anti tag paint or something.I dont know the answers either. Just dont think getting violent with them is going to make it better,although I know a few in this town I would like to give a good hiding to.

[Edbear]

... What else do you turn to when you are raised in an environment without hope?And it was just an expression.

That's impossible to answer without actually knowing them....

You make two good points here, and as another poster said, for most or many their parents couldn't care less about what they are up to.

Many of these kids grow up in an atmosphere of selfish irresponsibility, drunkenness and violence and are never given the time and attention they need with guidance for growing up successfully. Very few parents of even basically good kids think to teach consequences and outcomes of decisions the kids make.

Children need love and nurturing from birth and by 5 years old their basic personality is very much set. By 14, they are firmly established with their values and beliefs and behaviour. It takes intensive interest and persistent effort to turn such ones around and NZ simply does not have the human resources to do so for the thousands of wayward kids.

Get them alone and you can usually talk to them if you show an interest in them, it is possible to defuse the pack bravado too, if you approach them right. However, the worse their behaviour, the more likely they are going to be attacked by adults who are rightly fed-up with them. We are going to see more vigilante action and violence by homeowners against these kids.

Go into the schools and notice how the five year olds relate to their teachers, and you'll see one or two in a class with no feelings of respect or moral values at all. The poor teachers are tearing their hair out trying to engage the parents in meaningful conversation and to offer advice about child-rearing. With years of experience in early childhood education, my wife and I are constantly amazed at how ignorant many parents are and we shudder to realise their kids are going to grow up and take over. But you cannot tell the parents anything, they are defensive and anti-advice in the extreme!

[SMOKEU]

What the government really should do is have compulsory boot camps for repeat youth (and adult) offenders. If they are unable, or unwilling to be a productive member of society then they should be forced to learn the hard way through physical labour in order to be taught some discipline.

Children need love and nurturing from birth and by 5 years old their basic personality is very much set. By 14, they are firmly established with their values and beliefs and behaviour. It takes intensive interest and persistent effort to turn such ones around and NZ simply does not have the human resources to do so for the thousands of wayward kids.

That's exactly why the government needs to spend a lot of money now on free contraceptive campaigns so we don't have more unwanted kids running around with little, if any parental supervision. Fewer people on the dole, less crime, everyone WINZ!

[scissorhands]

I love the smell of divide and conquer in the morning
and heart warming to see Jaz flying the aspie honesty flag
brings a tear to my eye.


However, remember whos house you are at nigger, jesters have a higher than normal mortality rate I heard...

Show some respect when in this culture... otherwise you'll have your ass tagged but probably with a cock and balls eh?

Would you defend whitey when cruising with the bros?....

[SMOKEU]

I love the smell of divide and conquer in the morning
and heart warming to see Jaz flying the aspie honesty flag
brings a tear to my eye.


However, remember whos house you are at nigger, jesters have a higher than normal mortality rate I heard...

Show some respect when in this culture... otherwise you'll have your ass tagged but probably with a cock and balls eh?

Would you defend whitey when cruising with the bros?....

Who's the nigger?

[scissorhands]

Who's the nigger?

I'm using the dark zone, its all black on black to me

[HenryDorsetCase]

Same generation but entirely different culture.



I said impressionable, not stupid. What else do you turn to when you are raised in an environment without hope?

And it was just an expression.



That's impossible to answer without actually knowing them.



The parks the schools and the hospitals don't compare to an environment free of violence.

Anyway, what this racist Headbanger chump did was see some kids tagging, charge over like a hero, spit the dummy and come straight online to congratulate himself as if he's somehow 'cracked the code' to stopping vandalism. A few cheeky handjobs and a backrub from his mates later and everyone agrees that this is the ANSWER to property damage.

Typical bunch of fat white old men reinforcing attitudes that might have applied sixty years ago but are NO LONGER RELEVANT AND DO NOT WORK.

Chumpbanger most probably reinforced their idea of cool because they sure as fuck don't wanna be like him.

-

As an aside, tagging is not about disrespecting peoples' property for the sake of disrespecting peoples' property. It's an expression, a voice, a statement or an idea and humans have been doing it for millenia.

Shit, there's a table in a Blenheim pub covered in scrawls from people going back decades - it has been lacquered over to preserve them.

I never got a handjob. Just saying. I wanted one too.

I do enjoy you railing against stereotyping, and saying respect their culture then going on about "fat old white men". I am middle aged thank you.

whatever.

[F5 Dave]

. What else do you turn to when you are raised in an environment without hope?
. . .

Aww boohoo. FFS this isn't Lebanon, This isn't Sudan. Without hope? yer shitting me. Plenty of immigrants come here with sod all of nothing & try, fail, work hard fail, try again & make something of their lives. They are more disadvantaged.

And plenty of Kiwis go over to Auss & the UK etc & make something happen as well. Without hope? Lets all listen to Emo music.

. And it was just an expression.

. . .

Lots of things are just an expression that offend others. You shout Racism, but then marginalise your own bigotry as just an expression.

[bogan]

As an aside, tagging is not about disrespecting peoples' property for the sake of disrespecting peoples' property. It's an expression, a voice, a statement or an idea and humans have been doing it for millenia.

Shit, there's a table in a Blenheim pub covered in scrawls from people going back decades - it has been lacquered over to preserve them.

Well if its an expression hang on, I'd like to express myself by putting foot to ass, contains a stronger statement than a few ballbags (and whatever they decide to scribble) on park benches too I would think

[Swoop]

Yup and it doesn't work and it doesn't work and it doesn't work but they keep spending your money.

Strangely it (removing graffiti) does work.
West Auckland has a scheme financed by The Trust, where vans are able to go around eliminating any form of graffiti almost instantly. A hotline phone call and the area is graffiti-free.
A superb system and the "artists" know their hard work will be gone without recognition.

tagging is not about disrespecting peoples' property for the sake of disrespecting peoples' property. It's an expression, a voice, a statement or an idea and humans have been doing it for millenia.

No. It is like a dog pissing on a lamp post trying to mark a territory and very little else.

Decent graffiti artists' can produce some superb artwork worthy of exhibition in public places and galleries. A shop on my road has a very nice mural on one exterior sidewall, yet there have been a few attempts to "scribble" on it by a, shall we say, "less prominent artist", sadly.