The rules are the rules

[roogazza]

Hot cams have always been available, ya just need to have them built up and machined. That's been done for friggin ages.

I have tried and tried to get Deano to buy another set, but he refuses.

I argue that since we know heaps of the front bikes are cheating, he has fuck all choice if he wants to keep up. He just puts his bottom lip out and mutters about two wrongs or something romatically stupid like that.

Drew, if thems the rules dean needs to protest and clear his head.
To my mind cams won't be the difference. I seem to remember him being about 6 feet, and if he's around 12.5 stone thats more like his problem. For my thinking weight is a bigger handicap than a few horsepower.
He might come into his own in a bigger class of bike ?
I did a lot of testing on small prod bikes and it's all uphill unless you're 7 or 8 stone. (I was never less than 12 and a half) Makes it hard work if abilities are the same.

[Skunk]

I just wasn't aware that a club could unilaterally make up supplementary regs that contradicted the MNZ Rules. Doesn't quite seem kosher that a criteria is defined by MNZ but a club can ignore it. I don't mean to be argumentative, it's just farkin' confusing is all even after reading and re-reading the rules of both club and MNZ.

MNZ don't have any rules for F1 or F2 nor F3. We can write entire rules for 100cc bikes and call the class F1 if we wanted. It would be bloody confusing. We can make up whatever we please under those names as long as the Road Race Commissioner is happy with it.

I think you're confusing Superbikes with F1...

[Drew]

Drew, if thems the rules dean needs to protest and clear his head.
To my mind cams won't be the difference. I seem to remember him being about 6 feet, and if he's around 12.5 stone thats more like his problem. For my thinking weight is a bigger handicap than a few horsepower.
He might come into his own in a bigger class of bike ?
I did a lot of testing on small prod bikes and it's all uphill unless you're 7 or 8 stone. (I was never less than 12 and a half) Makes it hard work if abilities are the same.

Dean is between 70 and 80 kgs most of the time. Another rider in teh same class used Deans bike last year for Taupo. He told Dean it was slow also.

Protest? Have you ever tried it? You must quote the specific rule you think is being breached. If you're wrong, you're out $500 and an engine rebuild.

It aint about who's cheating, it's about who's cheating best. Shaun Harris gave us that wee gem...When he was supplying Jimmy with a 'cough', supersport bike.

[Kickaha]

I argue that since we know heaps of the front bikes are cheating, he has fuck all choice if he wants to keep up. He just puts his bottom lip out and mutters about two wrongs or something romatically stupid like that.

Wihtout stripping those bikes you dont know shit

If you're wrong, you're out $500 and an engine rebuild.

How can you be wrong? You just said "we know heaps of the front bikes are cheating" so you wont be out anything, obviously you dont have the balls to back up your accusations

Calling guys cheats and not backing it up is fucking bullshit

[jellywrestler]

Wihtout stripping those bikes you dont know shit

you should know that old marathon mouth knows everything by now

[yungatart]

you should know that old marathon mouth knows everything by now

Really? I thought only teenagers knew everything.

[Billy]

Dean is between 70 and 80 kgs most of the time. Another rider in teh same class used Deans bike last year for Taupo. He told Dean it was slow also.

Protest? Have you ever tried it? You must quote the specific rule you think is being breached. If you're wrong, you're out $500 and an engine rebuild.

It aint about who's cheating, it's about who's cheating best. Shaun Harris gave us that wee gem...When he was supplying Jimmy with a 'cough', supersport bike.

Err,

That would be $35.00,Unless your wrong,Then it will cost you big bucks,The $500 fee is for an appeal

[scott411]

its about time that some bikes were pulled down and checked at random, MNZ is the only form of motorsport body in NZ i know if that do not pull down motors at random, or require some sort of engine sealing on assembly,

their is so little chance of being caught that i would be very suprised if people are not cheating already,

[Drew]

Wihtout stripping those bikes you dont know shit


How can you be wrong? You just said "we know heaps of the front bikes are cheating" so you wont be out anything, obviously you dont have the balls to back up your accusations

Calling guys cheats and not backing it up is fucking bullshit

you should know that old marathon mouth knows everything by now

Seems to me, that it's you two cunt that know everything.

Balls to back it up Warwick? Get fucked ya cock! I don't race in the class, Why would I protest? And what rule do I protest?

Graeme, who the Fuck are yo calling marathon mouth? You've never shut your hole for more than ten seconds at a time your entire life.

Jam it up your arse the Fuckin pair of you. The guys Abusing the cam rules aren't cheating in my book, just being smarter to get an advantage. I would rather the rule was clarified for the sake of making it easier on a mate is all. Unless it's already stated that cams must be located in their standard positions, in which case it will need clarified that dialing in is still legit.

[roogazza]

Dean is between 70 and 80 kgs most of the time. Another rider in teh same class used Deans bike last year for Taupo. He told Dean it was slow also.

Protest? Have you ever tried it? You must quote the specific rule you think is being breached. If you're wrong, you're out $500 and an engine rebuild.

Ok ,guess he's lighter than i thought. The old'his bike is faster than mine' has echoed around the pits from year dot huh !

I seem to recall the first three being pulled down once at a Manfeild meet(probably points races?) But it didn't happen much.
Of course pulling off the top of a two stroke was easy but I bet they missed a lot of clever mods much deeper ?

I've never protested, but yes, you pay.
Anyway things are changing by the sound of it.

[Drew]

Anyway things are changing by the sound of it.

Maybe. I applaud the rules being enforced for track rule infringements of course, but I doubt bikes will start being checked properly in motorcycling. The cost is prohibitive, and who the fuck would want the job of checking things anyway? However, if ALL the rules aren't enforced, should anyone obey any rules? Who picks and chooses which ones too?

It doesn't really matter to me. Anyone who openly says that rule bending is going on, is shut down the way I have been with the cry that I can't prove it, so it gets ignored and put in the too hard basket.

The protest/appeal fees are a bit hard to justify I think, but I wouldn't go that route if someone was cheating in a race I was in so it's moot again.

Dunno, I'm all over the show on this issue. No clear thoughts one way or the other, probably because I'm not racing right now.

[Deano]

I'm currently 82kgs - I put on a few kg's after crashing at HD in March - I got up to 86kg's but have been back into the exercise for a couple of months now.

There have been times in club racing when I have struggled to keep up with a few SV's. Even after getting on the gas earlier out of Dunlop at Manfeild - couldn't even slip stream the dude in front which was pretty frustrating - but short of calling him a cheat, he did have a lot of distributor backing and I had heard his motor was balanced and blueprinted - all legal as far as I know.

BUT - I also know a racer in the same class at the time built up his SV motor to the nth degree, plus a little timing advance mod which was not legal (in his words), and he still got dragged off in a straight line by the aforementioned bike. The riders both the same weight too.

I know of another SV which had the same mod done. This was at club level and while frustrating it was still club level and I couldn't be arsed protesting.

I have also heard from top F3 racers about pro twins not being pro twins - I mean, how can a pro twin keep up with a top F3 bike (and top rider) in a straight line? There should be a good 10HP difference between the two.

I'm not grizzling about it but it doesn't add up. I have no proof and so will not publically slander anyone either.

At the Nats earlier this year, there was nothing between the pro twin field that I could see. Slipstreaming occurred - there was some very good close racing. At Timaru the top 6 qualified within 0.6s from memory. Bryan Hill ran away with every race - the one time I was in frotn he came past me on the straight, but I knowingly muffed the exit of the corner and he got way better drive.

At HD, I felt I was all over the SI'ers, so much so that I showed a couple of them around the track in practice to make them faster in the hope I could put them between Bryan and myself so I could claw back some points.

I'm looking forward to the same close competition again this year.

[Edbear]

Really? I thought only teenagers knew everything.

And me... I know stuff..

[Tony.OK]

Unless it's already stated that cams must be located in their standard positions, in which case it will need clarified that dialing in is still legit.

1 Machine Specifications:
a) Twin cylinder four strokes up to 650cc standard engines. (Only OEM engine parts for that model may be fitted)
b) Be fitted with V.I.N compliance plates for the particular machine
c) Be of a make and model lawfully sold in New Zealand,
d) Be as constructed by the original manufacturer

The following OEM parts may be modified:
a) Engine cam wheels may be slotted to alter valve timing




Clear as a clear thing on a clear day innit!

[Drew]

1 Machine Specifications:
a) Twin cylinder four strokes up to 650cc standard engines. (Only OEM engine parts for that model may be fitted)
b) Be fitted with V.I.N compliance plates for the particular machine
c) Be of a make and model lawfully sold in New Zealand,
d) Be as constructed by the original manufacturer

The following OEM parts may be modified:
a) Engine cam wheels may be slotted to alter valve timing




Clear as a clear thing on a clear day innit!

I still interpret that to read, no modification of the parts, assemble as you like.