My first poll for the NZ public

**bogan** · 29th May 2015, 21:51

Originally Posted by mashman

I do, yes... but "my" society involves "everyone" in the country. So I can't, and don't want to live there with just 1%.

Why does it need everyone?

**mashman** · 29th May 2015, 22:28

Originally Posted by bogan

Why does it need everyone?

When I weigh up the pros and cons, an R.B.E. is most likely to stick if it is an entire country saying, fuck it, let's do it our way. Ubuntu. It takes a village to raise a child. Because I'd like to see science not be hamstrung by finance or indeed the brain drain of rocket sciency types into the banking sector. Because I'd like money not to be an incentive to falsify "evidence". Because I'd like to see every single kid educated to a level that would make Einstein look like an amoeba. Because every single person on this planet deserves better and what better way to prove an R.B.E. than on a countrywide level in order to have the world follow. Because there could be an education system in place that surpasses our wildest dreams as the next generation innovates upon our innovation. Because every single person deserves enough food, water, electrickery blah blah blah and a healthcare service that is built upon the prevention of illness of the individual. Because the old guy who got robbed for money got robbed for money. Because there is needless starvation given the tools we have. Because because because because because etc... money related bullshit.

It needs everyone because of all of those becauses.

**bogan** · 29th May 2015, 22:35

Originally Posted by mashman

When I weigh up the pros and cons, an R.B.E. is most likely to stick if it is an entire country saying, fuck it, let's do it our way. Ubuntu. It takes a village to raise a child. Because I'd like to see science not be hamstrung by finance or indeed the brain drain of rocket sciency types into the banking sector. Because I'd like money not to be an incentive to falsify "evidence". Because I'd like to see every single kid educated to a level that would make Einstein look like an amoeba. Because every single person on this planet deserves better and what better way to prove an R.B.E. than on a countrywide level in order to have the world follow. Because there could be an education system in place that surpasses our wildest dreams as the next generation innovates upon our innovation. Because every single person deserves enough food, water, electrickery blah blah blah and a healthcare service that is built upon the prevention of illness of the individual. Because the old guy who got robbed for money got robbed for money. Because there is needless starvation given the tools we have. Because because because because because etc... money related bullshit.

It needs everyone because of all of those becauses.

So why don't you want to live in a smaller version of your society until we all join you?

**mashman** · 29th May 2015, 22:44

Originally Posted by bogan

So why don't you want to live in a smaller version of your society until we all join you?

Because we are happy where we are, in the broad sense. There's no need for everyone's life to change. It's an education campaign, a lot of discussion, a political party, and a vote away. Why are you so keen to wait?

**bogan** · 29th May 2015, 22:56

Originally Posted by mashman

Because we are happy where we are, in the broad sense. There's no need for everyone's life to change. It's an education campaign, a lot of discussion, a political party, and a vote away. Why are you so keen to wait?

Seriously? all your negativity towards the financial system and you are happy where you are?

Keen to wait? I'm keen to do.

**Brian d marge** · 29th May 2015, 23:00

Some stuff that might be worth time to watch.....
https://youtu.be/NjWOwa0IHBk

socialisim , news in the first 40 min , so jump to 41min if ya havent time

https://youtu.be/_WhZXhRS3F4

Greece explained

https://youtu.be/pcOooD1dM3g

What will happen ( Detroit )

and for Bogie san ;

The quote " apple flown to south africa and back to britain is from this woman.

http://www.unesco.org/new/fileadmin/...rberghodge.pdf

She has done quite a bit of work in this area ... shes quite well known .

I trust this source.

**mashman** · 29th May 2015, 23:07

Originally Posted by bogan

Seriously? all your negativity towards the financial system and you are happy where you are?

Keen to wait? I'm keen to do.

You still can't reconcile the two? I can tell you why though. Ditch the negative perception and try this one. If you can embrace an R.B.E. as an absolutely inevitability based on the fact that it is absolutely feasible, then you'll understand 1) why I've not actually been negative in my honest critique of the financial system and that you've read negativity (4 peeps and a bloke outside a pub, 2 say he negative, 2 say he not) in to it yourself, and 2) that my prevalent disposition is that of love and laughter... and that quite frankly, you fuckers are busting my calm on that front

Awesome. So when it comes you'll vote for it without caring what the herd are gonna do?

**bogan** · 29th May 2015, 23:13

Originally Posted by Brian d marge

The quote " apple flown to south africa and back to britain is from this woman.

http://www.unesco.org/new/fileadmin/...rberghodge.pdf

She has done quite a bit of work in this area ... shes quite well known .

I trust this source.

A trusted story-teller is still just a story teller though.

Originally Posted by mashman

You still can't reconcile the two? I can tell you why though. Ditch the negative perception and try this one. If you can embrace an R.B.E. as an absolutely inevitability based on the fact that it is absolutely feasible, then you'll understand 1) why I've not actually been negative in my honest critique of the financial system and that you've read negativity (4 peeps and a bloke outside a pub, 2 say he negative, 2 say he not) in to it yourself, and 2) that my prevalent disposition is that of love and laughter... and that quite frankly, you fuckers are busting my calm on that front

Awesome. So when it comes you'll vote for it without caring what the herd are gonna do?

An honest critique which comes to a negative conclusion is still negative. If it is inevitable, why? because it is better than the current system?

No, because I do not think your idea of an RBE is feasible.

**Brian d marge** · 29th May 2015, 23:23

Originally Posted by bogan

A trusted story-teller is still just a story teller though.

.

Hey , dont believe , your chance to prove me wrong .......Im sticking with her account until you come up with something better

good luck

Stephen

**bogan** · 29th May 2015, 23:29

Originally Posted by Brian d marge

Hey , dont believe , your chance to prove me wrong .......Im sticking with her account until you come up with something better

good luck

Stephen

And there it is

**mashman** · 29th May 2015, 23:53

Originally Posted by bogan

An honest critique which comes to a negative conclusion is still negative. If it is inevitable, why? because it is better than the current system?

No, because I do not think your idea of an RBE is feasible.

What's negative about the realisation of Resource Based Economy? Yes it is better in just about every single way. See earlier because list and the fact that people really aren't that stupid.

Which is why you don't understand "my" idea of an R.B.E. You said it yourself, I described our system and then explained how a simple piece of computer software could convert human activity into the exact amount of money that is required at an exact point in time as it would in the normal life cycle of money. Well I know one of "our" R.B.E. ideas will be.

**bogan** · 29th May 2015, 23:56

Originally Posted by mashman

What's negative about the the realisation of Resource Based Economy? Yes, in just about every single way. See earlier because list and the fact that people really aren't that stupid.

Which is why you don't understand "my" idea of an R.B.E. You said it yourself, I described our system and then explained how a simple piece of computer software could convert human activity into the exact amount of money that is required at an exact point in time as it would in the normal life cycle of money. Well I know one of "our" R.B.E. ideas will be.

The negative is the evaluation result of the current system. In the same way that I see your system as a negative when compared to what we have now.

Wrong. I do understand it, we went over it, I know how you think it works. I also disagree with some of the fundamental assumptions you have made. That is all, we share an understanding of it, not the evaluation of it.

**mashman** · 30th May 2015, 00:04

Originally Posted by bogan

The negative is the evaluation result of the current system. In the same way that I see your system as a negative when compared to what we have now.

Wrong. I do understand it, we went over it, I know how you think it works. I also disagree with some of the fundamental assumptions you have made. That is all, we share an understanding of it, not the evaluation of it.

It was a less positive evaluation result than an R.B.E. then, which I also highlighted has some potential negatives. Take yer pick.

Ok.

**Brian d marge** · 30th May 2015, 00:16

Originally Posted by bogan

And there it is

well , are you going to , or write pages and pages of text?
Stephen

**bogan** · 30th May 2015, 00:19

Originally Posted by Brian d marge

well , are you going to , or write pages and pages of text?
Stephen

What, prove a negative?

Not sure you are too familiar with this logic thing, but the onus is on the one who says a thing to prove it. Like if someone said you fuck goats, if you were unable to prove you didn't, would that make it true?