Trans-Pacific Partnership Agreement

[Ocean1]

i cannot see that any "agreement" that gives a conglomerate the ability to overturn a countries own laws can be good for the average Joe Lunchbox.It reveals imho just who really want this agreement

Phillip Morris thing again?

Is existing law. Harks back to the West Indies Company in the 1700's.

[FJRider]

i cannot see that any "agreement" that gives a conglomerate the ability to overturn a countries own laws can be good for the average

Ability but NOT legality ... in that country.

[sugilite:Me]

Dude, repeating the same thing ad infinitum don't constitute valid discourse. If it did I'd simply refer you back to my last answer to essentially the same post.

Trendy socialists, union leaders and unemployable academics have been bleating about trade agreements since forever. Funnily enough if you look at the history of trade agreements New Zealand are currently participants in you'll see pretty much nothing but benefits to the NZ public.


And for transparency: http://www.rbnz.govt.nz/research_and...4/5617432.html

Yeah I know, THIS time it's different, the bogeymen really are here this time.

What does that link you posted have anything to do with transparency in regards to the tppa? And yes I did read it.

Nowhere in my posts are I saying that previous trade agreements have been bad for NZ. The TPPA is a completely different animal, as you I'm sure you well know.
I do not care what political party, unions and unemployable academics have said in the past or now. what I care about is this TPPA and the masses of gullible public that think politicians and big business have our interests at heart. People like you as it would appear.

You do not address much of what I say at all. You just post diffusing bullshit instead.

I wonder if that big business cock you have shoved down your throat and smooth talking politician tongue stuck in your arse will feel so good if your relatives get sent to an early grave because pharmac has been nobbled and they cannot get access to the medicine they need?

[T.W.R]

Phillip Morris thing again?

Is existing law. Harks back to the West Indies Company in the 1700's.

Further back......HBC in the 1600's

[puddytat]

Some proof to earlier allegations about Israel....
http://www.commondreams.org/news/201...boycott-Israel
https://www.popularresistance.org/pr...e-unanimously/

and even the Israelis admit it
http://forward.com/opinion/306743/co...ment-boycotts/ for you Zionist denialists.

[oldrider]

Some proof to earlier allegations about Israel....
http://www.commondreams.org/news/201...boycott-Israel
https://www.popularresistance.org/pr...e-unanimously/

and even the Israelis admit it
http://forward.com/opinion/306743/co...ment-boycotts/ for you Zionist denialists.

NO to TPPA! - based on that crap - Absolutely NO!

Edit: Is that what Key came back home to NZ to ascertain? - Conflict of interest???

[puddytat]

NO to TPPA! - based on that crap - Absolutely NO!

Edit: Is that what Key came back home to NZ to ascertain? - Conflict of interest???

Or conflict of loyalty......

[Brian d marge]

Further back......HBC in the 1600's

hey but that was some good shyt they were sellin .....



Stephen

[Brian d marge]

Dude, repeating the same thing ad infinitum don't constitute valid discourse. If it did I'd simply refer you back to my last answer to essentially the same post.

Trendy socialists, union leaders and unemployable academics have been bleating about trade agreements since forever. Funnily enough if you look at the history of trade agreements New Zealand are currently participants in you'll see pretty much nothing but benefits to the NZ public.

Allow me... Attachment 312770

Note that NZ's free trade agreement with China was signed in 2008.

And for transparency: http://www.rbnz.govt.nz/research_and...4/5617432.html

Yeah I know, THIS time it's different, the bogeymen really are here this time.

Hahahahahaaaaa OMG

A chart , showing the increased movement of shyt .....and the profit or prosperity will trickle down ...Roger wilco

and

A speech delivered to the
Canterbury Employers’ Chamber of Commerce, in Christchurch

On 31 January 2014
By Graeme Wheeler, Governor


Paul wolfowitz bum buddy ......like trusting a kiddy fiddler in a pre school .........

They got you hook line and sinker ....... better find that Donovan record its ya only hope !

Stephen

[R650R]

Do you seriously think politicians and businesses are out to make you less well off? Where's the benefit in that? Where's the profit? Trade deals can and have benefited both parties before now and there's no reason to suspect that won't be the case for any future ones. Sure, individual markets / industries / jobs are likely to become better or worse off, but a mutually advantageous agreement means the overall economy is better off. Why else sign it?

Politicians are only ever out for what looks good on paper in time for the next election. They already have their exit strategys lined up with cushy corporate jobs with their masters or like Aunty Helen a job at the UN for cowtowing to their PC demands of changes to our society, anti smacking, no fireplaces etc...

There is nothing to be gained by allowing free trade with a nation whose workers are on slave wages. We are exporting jobs with things like timber raw materials that could instead be processed here to create secondary industry.
Very rapidly all low skilled manufacturing jobs are being off shored. Trouble is our education system cant evolve fast enough to train our kids for the new future ahead, certainly the politicians are doing nothing about it.
And as we are now educating the rest of the world via our universities and polytechs it wont be long before even skilled jobs like welding are offshored. It will be done so cheap that the job will be emailed to say Indonesia and be here on a boat a couple weeks later.

Look back to the days before free trade and how successful and secure our nation was. And when imported goods are expensive only quality is accepted instead of the rubbish disposable goods we get now.

[Ocean1]

Politicians are only ever out for what looks good on paper in time for the next election.

Probably. But a large part of what looks good on paper actually is good for the people who voted for them. Of course those that didn't want it and voted elsewhere can only claim that the majority are gullible idiots. Meh.

They already have their exit strategys lined up with cushy corporate jobs with their masters or like Aunty Helen a job at the UN for cowtowing to their PC demands of changes to our society, anti smacking, no fireplaces etc...

Their masters? Isn't it more likely their abilities and experience simply made them more suitable for such roles? Occam's razor, dude, don't go inventing complicated motives when simple ones describe the situation. Their masters ffs.

There is nothing to be gained by allowing free trade with a nation whose workers are on slave wages.

No? What about reducing most of the world's population living in extreme poverty to fuck all?

We are exporting jobs with things like timber raw materials that could instead be processed here to create secondary industry.
Very rapidly all low skilled manufacturing jobs are being off shored. Trouble is our education system cant evolve fast enough to train our kids for the new future ahead, certainly the politicians are doing nothing about it.

Again with the govt's fault. What are the kids and their parents doing about training for the new future ahead?

And as we are now educating the rest of the world via our universities and polytechs it wont be long before even skilled jobs like welding are offshored. It will be done so cheap that the job will be emailed to say Indonesia and be here on a boat a couple weeks later.

Allowing you to buy welded products at a fraction of the cost. Swings and roundabouts.

Look back to the days before free trade and how successful and secure our nation was. And when imported goods are expensive only quality is accepted instead of the rubbish disposable goods we get now.

Protectionism was successful? Fuck me were you not paying attention when Ford NZ made the most outrageous shit possible? On the days they weren't on strike... When the govt charged you more to import shit than the shit costs to supply? When the unions on the BNZ site killed the structural steel industry in NZ stone cold dead? Sorry mate, if you think huge import tariffs guaranteeing high wage jobs for producing fuck all of value are the way to go then you slept through most of the 60's and 70's. It was shit. It was shit when the Japanese tried it, it was shit when the Russian tried it and it'll be shit for fucking Africa for everyone if we allow the anti-globalisation rabble to reinvent that particular brand of socialism.

[gjm]

The 'news' says that Tim Groser is suggesting NZ may not participate in this trade deal; this would be the fallout/aftermath of the US House of Representatives (Republican majority - pretty much anti anything Obama or the Democrats suggest).

Of course, other news channels spin this differently. One suggests TPPA is "crucial" for NZ. Another says the loss of the "potential" $3bn of trade (no mention of when that would be realised, or the cost associated) would be sad but NZ would cope. NZ might have, were it not for the current borrowing situation, and I can't help wondering if that might not be leveraged to coerce assent to sign.

This is a significant part of the problem. Snippets of the TPPA have been released, and in isolation form a damning indictment of over-zealous and secretive political shenanigans. The 'bad' info we have seen may be balanced if the rest of the docs were available, but the way these things are reported is also twisting perspective. John Key spins the positive and completely sidesteps any potential negativity. Consummate politician.

The press sell copy based on sensationalism, and the best way to stir people up is to tell them someone has it in for them.

So, where is the TRUTH? I dislike National and their continued policy of selling NZ to the highest bidder which leaves me predisposed to believe the anti-TPPA brigade. Any argument from either side can be readily countered because we just do not know everything we need to, to be able to make an accurate assessment.

None of what has been released has been denied. Maybe there is much, much worse hiding in the rest of the agreement?

[puddytat]

Protectionism was successful? Fuck me were you not paying attention when Ford NZ made the most outrageous shit possible? On the days they weren't on strike... When the govt charged you more to import shit than the shit costs to supply? When the unions on the BNZ site killed the structural steel industry in NZ stone cold dead? Sorry mate, if you think huge import tariffs guaranteeing high wage jobs for producing fuck all of value are the way to go then you slept through most of the 60's and 70's. It was shit. It was shit when the Japanese tried it, it was shit when the Russian tried it and it'll be shit for fucking Africa for everyone if we allow the anti-globalisation rabble to reinvent that particular brand of socialism.

Riiiiight..............so what is to say that it couldn't be done better this time? The times have changed a lot .The rules have changed even more.

But a lot of peoples opinions are still stuck way back then.

[oldrider]

Riiiiight..............so what is to say that it couldn't be done better this time? The times have changed a lot .The rules have changed even more.

But a lot of peoples opinions are still stuck way back then.

Historical evidence suggests it would all go straight back the way it was before - not enough time has passed to break the mould. (Appropriate English spelling)

[Brian d marge]

I have just planted this years herb garden

Im all right jack

Stephen

Oh btw that bike rego is a bit steep aint it ...oh well mustnt grumble eh .....