Jacinda

[TheDemonLord]

I have to say thinking back to when I was 16 and 17, I and my friends paid absolutely no attention to politics so voting would have been irresponsible.

The woke Court judges have said letting 18 y.o. vote discriminates against 17 y.o. Really? then lower it to 16 and you have just discriminated against 15 y.o. Where does it end. Let newborns vote then you have rid the country of ageist voting discrimination. Well done those Judges.

I'm going to preface this with "I think 16 year olds voting is a dumb fuck idea and the intention is to create a voting block who are wholly indoctrinated to Left-Wing politics by a Left-Wing school system"

Right (heh), that said, I have a degree of sympathy for the Judges reasoning: If someone is working and paying tax, then they ought to have the right to decide how that money is spent - As the Yanks are fond to say "No Taxation without representation" - furthermore they do point out that a 16 year old can leave home, sign up to the Military (16.5 according to the website - the caveat is that you have to be 18 once you finish the recruiting process) - and so, for the 16 yo that:

1: Is working and
2: Has left home
3: Is generally paying their way in the world

for that specific 16 year old who is no longer under the care of someone else and has to be responsible for themselves, perhaps I could stretch to them voting.

But I would hazard a guess that this is a single digit percentage, if that.

[Berries]

I think only 16 year olds should be allowed to vote. You get one shot and it affects your future.

Look at the complete shit of a mess we have got into allowing 'educated' adults to vote.

And no politicians above the age of 25.

[george formby]

1: Is working and
2: Has left home
3: Is generally paying their way in the world

for that specific 16 year old who is no longer under the care of someone else and has to be responsible for themselves, perhaps I could stretch to them voting.

But I would hazard a guess that this is a single digit percentage, if that.

To the best of my knowledge almost 50% of the year 11 pupils I've taught this year will be out in the work force come January. That's only the ones I have spoken too about their spare time jobs, jobs now available to them full time.

Most have quite a fatalistic attitude to a career, they just want to stand on their own two feet and make a dollar.

I suspect they couldn't care less about voting.

[Berries]

Most have quite a fatalistic attitude to a career, they just want to stand on their own two feet and make a dollar.

I suspect they couldn't care less about voting.

Sums me up and I'm in my 50's. I still don't know what I want to do when I grow up and have always considered myself lucky to have a well paid job, although I had to emigrate to get it. I have always thought it was something to do with leaving school in England in the fairly bleak early 1980's.

And me being a dosser, probably.

[george formby]

Sums me up and I'm in my 50's. I still don't know what I want to do when I grow up and have always considered myself lucky to have a well paid job, although I had to emigrate to get it. I have always thought it was something to do with leaving school in England in the fairly bleak early 1980's.

And me being a dosser, probably.

I relate to that 100%, were we separated at birth?

[MD]

I think the tragic murder yesterday of the Rose Cottage Dairy manager is going to be the turning point and last nail in this pathetic Governments coffin. Ardern's face when interviewed today said it all 'Oh shit we have screwed up beyond belief'

It is so sad, more so in that it was so predictable and preventable and everyone except Labour knew it was going to happen if this Government kept its head in the sand waiting for crime to stop all by itself. Dairy owners and NZers have been asking for a tougher response to rising crime and this Government has refused to listen or act.

My Missus has been a long time Labour supporter and big fan of Ardern. She came home tonight and after the news coverage said, I'm over this Labour Government and won't be voting for them again. They have failed us.

There needs to be far more serious punishment for carrying weapons. Let's look at this week so far. An 18 y.o. goes to Bexley Park at 6am and has a knife on them and kills someone who was just out walking his dog. Who the hell needs to carry a knife to a park at 6am or anytime?
Someone robs a Dairy of what? $66, $108 if you're lucky and a packet of fags and a can of coke and yet again has a knife on them. Who the hell needs to carry a knife to a Dairy?
Couple of people have an argument outside a Laundromat and one runs the other over with his car, killing him and them brandishes a handgun. Who the hell needs to carry a gun to a Laundromat? I could go one typing for hours to list this year's depressing violent crime. I can write quite quickly what this Government has done to stop it. Here it is...NOTHING

[R650R]

I think the tragic murder yesterday of the Rose Cottage Dairy manager is going to be the turning point and last nail in this pathetic Governments coffin. Ardern's face when interviewed today said it all 'Oh shit we have screwed up beyond belief'

It is so sad, more so in that it was so predictable and preventable and everyone except Labour knew it was going to happen if this Government kept its head in the sand waiting for crime to stop all by itself. Dairy owners and NZers have been asking for a tougher response to rising crime and this Government has refused to listen or act.

My Missus has been a long time Labour supporter and big fan of Ardern. She came home tonight and after the news coverage said, I'm over this Labour Government and won't be voting for them again. They have failed us.

For the undecided maybe. But I’d say they lost it well before that...

The massively under achieved housing promises....
The emergency housing fiasco meaning when someone finally can afford to take kids away to Rotorua or say rainbows end they’ll be staying in motels alongside domestic violence roadshows.
The helicopter cash causing runaway inflation, and what’s worse is most of that money spent on woke idealism that deliver a nothing.
The five press secretaries for the PM.
The indecisiveness and inconsistentcies on lockdown and traffic lights.
MIQ fiasco
All people who never got to say goodbye to loved ones at funerals.
It will be a long time before people forget the last five and the coming year....

[pete376403]

So what can a government do in the short term. Armed police conducting searches on the street for weapons? Bring back capital punishment? Everyone (just about everyone) is blaming the government but who has yet come up with response that will solve or even reduce the problems?

[JimO]

make " children" responsible for the crimes they commit, these ram raiders dont care because there are no consequences

i knew there was a death coming but i thought it would be one of the scrotes beaten to death by a indian shopkeeper with a hockey stick

[Berries]

I blame National.

[nerrrd]

It's such a tragedy, I still live in the area, used to live quite close by.

I don't see how any government is going to reach a kid carrying a knife and bragging about how gangsta he is on social media.

Police, corrections, MSD can't cope with the workloads they have already - corrections are losing staff quicker than they can hire them. Defence force is the same, how keen will they be to babysit delinquents?

I'm not sure 'getting tough on crime' is even legally possible anymore.

[TheDemonLord]

So what can a government do in the short term. Armed police conducting searches on the street for weapons? Bring back capital punishment? Everyone (just about everyone) is blaming the government but who has yet come up with response that will solve or even reduce the problems?

Unfortunately the ship for 'Short-term' has sailed.

This is a problem that has been in the making since around 2017.

JBP (regardless on your views on him) made an excellent point on something similar when discussing Knife Crime: Why do young men feel the need to kill each other? His argument was that for a certain type of young man in a certain circumstance, the only thing of value they have is their reputation and that is worth killing over.

As for solutions - I can see some people proposing solutions and I see a bunch of whaling harpees decrying those solutions as barbaric and draconian, because we can't be tough on the poor little murderers.

This issue has come about purely due to the current strain of Left-Wing philosophy, that has some wildly false a-priori assumptions and is cheered on by a mixture of zealots (who praise climate change 'initiatives', whilst wondering why they can't afford their power bill), insulated Dreamers (those who live literal lives of luxury and will never come face-to-face with a knife wielding thug in a dairy) and the Malevolent (who are just waiting to instigate the Revolution).

Fuck the lot of them, they created this mess, they can wallow in the human suffering they created.

[pete376403]

Unfortunately the ship for 'Short-term' has sailed.

This is a problem that has been in the making since around 2017.

So under National there was no crime and everything was hunky-dory?

Fuck the lot of them, they created this mess, they can wallow in the human suffering they created.

The creators of this mess, the 1% regardless of political affiliation, will not suffer. They just profit from it.

[R650R]

So what can a government do in the short term. Armed police conducting searches on the street for weapons? Bring back capital punishment? Everyone (just about everyone) is blaming the government but who has yet come up with response that will solve or even reduce the problems?

If you vote national they are going to let police doing warrantkess searches of gangs for weapons that will have huge impact.
ItÂ’s the softly softly approach of this govt abandoning pursuits, announcing lowering of prison numbers goal and failure to stand up to Aussie over501s thatÂ’s created a new crime culture.

HereÂ’s what you do, go back to old pursuit policy. If the offender is driving in an exceptionally dangerous manner armed police are authorised to use automatic gunfire to disable vehicle Brazil style. Yes there will be some innocents killed as passengers but kids will learn not to hang around with losers very fast.

No parole for any sentence under 5 years so itÂ’s not just a little stint if you get caught.
Set up a new jail on Campbell Island in Auckland Island chain in south ocean for violent offenders. There will be no cells or guards though just most basic barn style accomodation and sanitary facilities. An airforce C130 will para -drop food off once a month. Oh and new arrivals will get there first parachute jump lesson, hopefully they pay attention on trip over.

If you make it off the island alive unassisted back to the mainland your sentence will be cancelled and youÂ’ll be welcomed back into society. The reason being you will have to have had considerable skill, resilience and gumption to make that happen and your the type of person we need working in society. And the experience should have moulded you into a new person unless your a complete pschycopath.
And person who commits violence to someone unknown to them (eg during robbery or random street bashingÂ’s) will qualify for trip to Campbell island.
After more than three domestic violence call outs to same address those two people will be banned from living together ever again, this will free up a lot of police time.
There will be no such thing as youth crime. If you have the mental capacity to knowingly commit any act of stupidity whatever the crime is you will face real world consequences.
As soon as any of your offspring be found guilty of crime you will be sterilised by the state, this is for both parents.
If you deliberately damage any state owned housing property you will never have access to any emergency accomodation outside of a mental facility.
To encourage independence and work ethic if you want to work for yourself in your community doing basic tasks like fixing cars/mowing lawns/ firewood etc you can conduct that business up to a level of 100,000 income a year free of taxes or state interference of taxes or regulation.

[TheDemonLord]

So under National there was no crime and everything was hunky-dory?

There was significantly less Crime.

Pritch tried to pull this in another thread, I pulled out the NZ stats that show a significant increase in Crime, under Labour. IIRC one source put a 200% rise in Crime. But hey, at least we banned all those Eeeeeeevil Semi-Autos and reduced our Gun Cri...

Oh wait, that's gone up too.

Bugger.

Also Obligatory unfurling of my 'Fuck National' Flag.

The creators of this mess, the 1% regardless of political affiliation, will not suffer. They just profit from it.

Sounds a touch conspiratorial....

Which 1%? I mean, I'm not entirely disagreeing here - There's a reasonable case to be made that a certain group of ultra-wealthy people have a certain agenda (which most definitely has a Political Affiliation) and that their policies are one of the causes of this...