Unmasking Elon Musk

[george formby]

I hope you fanbois all bought in to this…

Er, no. 2t's and diesel for me.

[Laava]

Pftt, can't start no spontaneous rampant fires with that shit!

The all new Tesla external combustion engine!������

[Al Bundy 4eva!]

The opinion of 10,000 men is of no value if none of them don't know anything about the subject.

[neels]

The opinion of 10,000 men is of no value if none of them don't know anything about the subject.

As you apparently don't work, you should probably spend some of your spare time getting english lessons.

That way you won't end up suggesting that there is no value in the opinion of 10,000 men who all know what they're talking about.

Also, you could consider asking some women, and non-binary people have opinions too.....

[pritch]

Some interesting comments on electric cars around the 'Net. An American has sold his Ford electric truck. He found the range insufficient. It seems in some cities the charging stations have been built where the real estate prices were low, it would be unwise to get out of your vehicle. In other places it seems some people hook up to the charger and go to work, they come back to the charger after work

Someone conducted a towing test. Towing a caravan reduced the range below what would be useful.

A guy in Britain had a good idea, he hired a Tesla to see if he liked it. Too many charging stations are not operating, a simple phone call is the fix but nobody bothers. He decided that it's too soon to own an electric car. He thinks hybrids are the answer until the infrastructure is widely available - and working.

There are reports in Australia that the BYD Atto 3, New Zealand's car of the year, has a rust problem. Whether it is just cosmetic or more serious will become apparent in time. I'll leave that for somebody else to discover.

[TheDemonLord]

Well in a pragmatic neutral way - rather than a give Elon a break TDL way
1. Agreed
2. How many other car manufacturers have only 2 styles of car? Hint:sweet fuck all. Correct answer - fail.

Well....

His brief was 'Major Segments' - and in the extended press release, IIRC - he said Sedan, SUV and a Pickup.

Granted there isn't a Tesla Pickup yet - but 2/3 isn't bad.

3. Self driving = fail
4. As you point out, related to point 2 - so also fail. How many self driving tesla uber vehicles have you seen driving about making money for their owners? Zero, which as it happens is also the same score as your "not very creative" answers to points 2, 3 and 4

Oh come on - I thought the joke about point 3 was hilarious.

I agree though that Points 3 and 4 haven't been achieved - still though, the progress of self-driving Teslas, putting aside all the hyperbolic headlines, has been nothing short of phenomenal.

If I'm being really picky - I don't think his vision on Point 4 is entirely realistic. It would be a nice idea that after I go to work, my Car goes off on little automated errands to earn me $$$ - but this has to be weighed against the risk of Theft, Wear and Tear, Crashing and how much money this would make.

Currently the cost for an Uber is hypothetically predicated on compensation for a person's time. If it's just the cost of the Vehicle, I'd expect the cost would plummet - making it not very economical - massively increase supply, massively reduce price.

I'm actually pretty neutral when it comes to musk and tesla. If I were to buy an EV which wont happen until charging stations actually would support my NZ driving habits would be a long range model 3. Musk in my opinion is a genius. His space x work is very impressive. Many aspects of Tesla are very impressive too. Though the jury is out on if the cyber truck will be fit for purpose. Musk should stop predicting tesla model roll out dates though.

I've stated many times - I'm not against Electric Cars per se. I just don't think that currently they are ready to replace Petrol. The recharge vs refuelling time being the biggest issue for me. On top of that is the looming issue that our Power generation and our Electricity distribution infrastructure is going to need a complete redesign and overhaul if the majority of households in NZ are going to be plugging their Cars in overnight to charge.

We would pretty much need to invest in Nuclear power to supply enough Electricity to feed a private car fleet that is majority Electric.

There are other issues looming for Electric vehicles - Battery Fires and the mining of Lithium and other minerals needed.

As above - for small scale and for people who like them - I think the Electric Car is fine - the change happening to provide the infrastructure to support them is a good sign.

And imo he is driving twitter into the toilet, which I also feel is by design - and I feel the toilet is a good place for twitter to be.

Okay - same question I asked to Pritch, I'll ask to you:

Exactly how is he driving it into the toilet?

[TheDemonLord]

As you apparently don't work, you should probably spend some of your spare time getting english lessons.

That way you won't end up suggesting that there is no value in the opinion of 10,000 men who all know what they're talking about.

Also, you could consider asking some women, and non-binary people have opinions too.....

"A Hundred Authors Against Einstein"

To which he replied:

"that if he were wrong, then one author would have been enough"

There have been a good number of instances of late where the opinion of hundreds or even thousands of people who profess to know what they're talking about have been catastrophically wrong.

[neels]

There have been a good number of instances of late where the opinion of hundreds or even thousands of people who profess to know what they're talking about have been catastrophically wrong.

I'm not sure what the point of that was.

Anyway.....ultimately a lot of opinions are largely pointless as they are based on the belief of the person holding them, which may or may not be related to the actual facts or truth of the matter, or in some cases have absolutely no basis in reality other than the alternative one that exists in their own head.

[TheDemonLord]

I'm not sure what the point of that was.

Anyway.....ultimately a lot of opinions are largely pointless as they are based on the belief of the person holding them, which may or may not be related to the actual facts or truth of the matter, or in some cases have absolutely no basis in reality other than the alternative one that exists in their own head.

In short:

"Argumentum Ad Populum"

Just because a lot of people believe it to be true, doesn't make it true.

I've got no particular opinion one way or another - if Al is profiting from his Investment and believes in the future growth of his investment - more power to him, if others doubt his returns or think that it's a bubble investment - then more power to them.

I just dislike the invoking of N number of un-named 'Experts' as a form of argument. I disliked it when it was Architects & Engineers for 9/11 Truth, I dislike it when it's 10,000 experts against Elon.

And in recent times when 'Experts' have been used in a way that I think is disgraceful, I dislike it even more.

[Al Bundy 4eva!]

As you apparently don't work, you should probably spend some of your spare time getting english lessons.

That way you won't end up suggesting that there is no value in the opinion of 10,000 men who all know what they're talking about.

Also, you could consider asking some women, and non-binary people have opinions too.....

If you were slightly more enlightened, you would know that

"The opinion of 10,000 men is of no value if none of them don't know anything about the subject."

Is a well known quote from Romen emperor & stoic philosopher Marcus Aurelius.

I thought it only fitting to be added to this thread.

[neels]

"Argumentum Ad Populum"

Just because a lot of people believe it to be true, doesn't make it true.

This is true.

I've got no particular opinion one way or another - if Al is profiting from his Investment and believes in the future growth of his investment - more power to him, if others doubt his returns or think that it's a bubble investment - then more power to them.

This is also true, albeit that he appears to be attempting to persuade others to his point of view, so should therefore expect to be challenged on his assertions

In short:I just dislike the invoking of N number of un-named 'Experts' as a form of argument. I disliked it when it was Architects & Engineers for 9/11 Truth, I dislike it when it's 10,000 experts against Elon.

In terms of the 'number of experts' this is true, increased volume does not directly equate to increased quality

And in recent times when 'Experts' have been used in a way that I think is disgraceful, I dislike it even more.

This is the standard use of 'experts', to promote a particular point of view as determined by those employing them.

For example, on a daily basis there will be experts in court on both sides of an argument, who will be espousing a conclusion drawn from the evidence that is entirely determined by who is buttering their bread.

[neels]

If you were slightly more enlightened, you would know that

"The opinion of 10,000 men is of no value if none of them don't know anything about the subject."

Is a well known quote from Romen emperor & stoic philosopher Marcus Aurelius.

If you were more enlightened you would know that you have misquoted a quote attributed to Marcus Aurelius, however not only have you misquoted you have also missed the point.

[TheDemonLord]

This is true.

This is also true, albeit that he appears to be attempting to persuade others to his point of view, so should therefore expect to be challenged on his assertions

Definitely - from my spectator view of the back-and-forth, a lot of the challenges are tangential at best.

Not that the ripostes are equally convincing either.

In terms of the 'number of experts' this is true, increased volume does not directly equate to increased quality

One might even be of the opinion that it directly equates to a decrease in quality.

This is the standard use of 'experts', to promote a particular point of view as determined by those employing them.

For example, on a daily basis there will be experts in court on both sides of an argument, who will be espousing a conclusion drawn from the evidence that is entirely determined by who is buttering their bread.

The way I see it, in the last 10 or so years the usage has been getting worse and worse.

Whether it's propping someone up who clearly isn't an Expert, but has the 'right opinions' to banning people and labelling them for holding a different (but justifiable) view.

At least with the court process, for all it's faults, an Expert gets to be cross-examined - where every potential hold in what they are putting forward can be challenged before the Jury.

Perhaps if the role of 'experts' in public life were subject to such grilling by an unbiased media (or at least... a Media that still had an interest in Journalism...) then I might hold a different view.

[pete376403]

If you were slightly more enlightened, you would know that

"The opinion of 10,000 men is of no value if none of them don't know anything about the subject."

Is a well known quote from Romen emperor & stoic philosopher Marcus Aurelius.

I thought it only fitting to be added to this thread.

Fake marcus aurelius quote - one of many. But even the fake quotes use proper grammar, which is more than the tesla fanboi does:

https://medium.com/practical-rationa...s-4c0294e4ea65

The last bonus fake quote is an interesting one. Marcus does mention the number 10,000 in the Meditations, but never in any context remotely like that of the passage. Instead, he uses it for years or for numbers of cavalry and infantry.

[Al Bundy 4eva!]

"Why should you feel anger at the world? As if the world would notice'