RUC's for all road vehicles, this will be fun.

[Laava]

This device sounds expensive! I might wrap mine in a lead sheet to protect it…

[jellywrestler]

On the TV item the required device was compared to an Apple air tag but it would presumably need to be connected to the cars battery.

that'll be the journalist making things up, trying to do some filming but no idea at all what it would look like most liekley

[BMWST?]

many many cars since at least 2018 will have a gps already fitted as standard,so thats half of the puzzle right there.Presumable the sub models of those cars will have a wiring loom which will accept a pigtail to power such a device.
But as someone has already stated there is a lot of work to fit these devices to every car in the NZ fleet. What happens in the meantime? Who will pay?

[sugilite:Me]

Who will pay?

Hopefully national at the ballot box.
However, at the minimum, labour will need to do the following:
Ditch hipkins as leader, he is a proficient minister but a seriously weak leader.
Put forward well thought out and presented policies with robust plans of implementation. Including a better ruc policy than this one.

The ill advised, arrogant and worn out "just trust us" trope was on full display from hipkins last week when labour were accused of getting carried away with the money hose during covid. His response "No we didn't" was hardly a compelling rebuttal, and simply reminded us of how in their last term they spent most of the time sitting on their hands whilst wallowing in a quagmire of Ineffectiveness.

Wouldn't it be great if NZ voters had something better than the usual choice between either the shit sandwich or turd burger combos this election?

[nerrrd]

Maybe we’ll just end up with a slightly modified version of the existing system. Compliance could be a big issue either way, instead of petrol users subsidising others you’ll get the compliant vehicle owners subsidising the non-compliant, and all the associated costs with policing that. Non-compliance isn’t something the existing commercial GPS based systems with have had to deal with. Will these extra costs end up far outweighing any increase in revenue?

Or you could just increase the existing excise tax.*
* and RUCs.

[pritch]

I've been looking at the Eroad site, seems there's a difference between knowing where something is at a single point in time and tracking something over time, the former can be a tiny battery powered thingumy like an Airtag, the latter looks like it's more involved and needs more power than that. Interesting that they don't publish pricing on their website.

It's the tracking something over time aspect that raises privacy issues. We can see why that would be a concern but I don't see how anyone else could access the device and its contents. A suspicious significant other excluded?

[R650R]

Hopefully national at the ballot box.
However, at the minimum, labour will need to do the following:
Ditch hipkins as leader, he is a proficient minister but a seriously weak leader.
Put forward well thought out and presented policies with robust plans of implementation. Including a better ruc policy than this one.

The ill advised, arrogant and worn out "just trust us" trope was on full display from hipkins last week when labour were accused of getting carried away with the money hose during covid. His response "No we didn't" was hardly a compelling rebuttal, and simply reminded us of how in their last term they spent most of the time sitting on their hands whilst wallowing in a quagmire of Ineffectiveness.

Wouldn't it be great if NZ voters had something better than the usual choice between either the shit sandwich or turd burger combos this election?

Just out of interest what’s your idea of a better RUC system? At least under National it’s going to be a simple vehicle weight and distance calculation. If labour bought this in it would have all sorts of fishhooks in system around engine size and prob still give EV owners unfair advantage.

[R650R]

With regard to compliance and mention of hubometers. Hub meters can be quite unreliable due to vibration they are subject to. Trucking operators often get a free ride here and there in a few trailers in the fleet.
As long as it’s not significant enforcement action isn’t usually cost effective.
You want to see how fast your boss moves though to replace one when you inform him it’s over reading which does happen too 😂🤣😂.

I’d say at WOF time a check will be made against odometer (very high reliability) and what the govt system says you have travelled. At a guess I reckon a generous 5% discrepancy will be allowed maybe more. Even then it would prob just flag you for extra attention initially at say a random breath test traffic stop.
Like fisheries or drug busts they will be after the big offenders first to make example.

The bonus for those that play off road or have a long driveway on rural property is you can claim
Back off highway miles automatically on eroad. That’s what gets a lot of truck companies onto Eroad. Once your on a large industrial site or quarry etc you’d be surprised how many kms ate done off road.

[jellywrestler]

With regard to compliance and mention of hubometers. Hub meters can be quite unreliable due to vibration they are subject to. Trucking operators often get a free ride here and there in a few trailers in the fleet..

the only reason they exist is that was the best they could do decades ago no sane person would consider them now and apart from single sided swingarms how will they ever fit on a bike?, or tidy looking on cars?

[nerrrd]

Odometers are already there, come up with a remote or automated system based on reading odometers and all the privacy concerns go away.

[neels]

How accurate is the average odometer vs GPS? Might need some tolerance there. If they're using WOF mileage figures for reference, that's a possible data entry failure point. They'll need a credible error resolution process as well.

The electronic RUC system does end up with differences, neither is perfect as gps distance measurement is dependent on time between data points, and odometers are measuring how far your wheels have actually travelled which also changes with tyre size and tyre wear.

Currently there is a process for I think correcting the electronic RUC machine to match the odometer, so you don't end up with a significant difference over time.

Compliance could be a big issue either way, instead of petrol users subsidising others you’ll get the compliant vehicle owners subsidising the non-compliant, and all the associated costs with policing that.

We already have that, for example couriers in 4 year old diesel vans with 40,000k on the odometer, who use a fuel card so there is a record of how many litres they've tipped into the thing.

[Moi]

I doubt if much will change before the next election. Chris Bishop's announcement was very thin on specifics - he'd have been better to have not said anything until there was a more definite plan forward. This government is very good on having announcementts to announce an upcoming announcement...

Anyhow, someone who has a light vehicle, ute or EV, that is on RUCs maybe able to answer this - ignoring HGVs in this question:

When you go to trade-in your vehicle, does the dealer check the RUC against the odometer?

[jellywrestler]

Odometers are already there, come up with a remote or automated system based on reading odometers and all the privacy concerns go away.

several of mine are proven to be up to 8% out, fucked if i want to be taxed another 8% charges cause of a shitty speedo,

[jellywrestler]

When you go to trade-in your vehicle, does the dealer check the RUC against the odometer?

why even ask that? any dealer would be a fool to not, it's like checking to see if there's any money oweing

[Moi]

why even ask that? any dealer would be a fool to not, it's like checking to see if there's any money oweing

So the present system for light vehicles is working, why change it?