Have the Police blown it?

[Skyryder]

[QUOTE=Blue Velvet;1346674]+1

Jesus IIIRyder, why is it you cherish these antic in your beloved labour party then yet condemn them in the Police force?

I don't believe that I have 'cherished' any antics with Labour. See my posts on Benson-Pope as an example. I like to think that I can see the differnce between a rape and political decision even thought that decision many believe to be unethical.

Skyryder

[kave]

After having to wait four hours for the police to turn up to a 111 call, when there was a violent person outside trying to break into a friends house hours after he had been released from prison, I have lost faith in the police.
I am not anti-police, I just understand that they are understaffed, underfunded and mismanaged to the point where they have become useless. I believe that most police officers are worthy of respect, but that the force as a whole is a farce. Even when the police do manage to get a criminal into court, the justice system is so toothless that they must be left wondering why they bothered.

[Blue Velvet]

...I acknowledge that they have a difficult job but they start on one of the higest saleries that compensates for this and are well paid

Yep some fallacy.

I disagree. It's not well paid. Above 'average' perhaps, if you're comparing stats from NZ Labour Market surveys. But considering skilled vs unskilled and all the other variables that come with the police profession, it's low.

[MSTRS:Me]

Even when the police do manage to get a criminal into court, the justice system is so toothless that they must be left wondering why they bothered.

As do we, as do we.

[Swoop]

I feel that our Police are indicative of our society as a whole. Completely overburdened by bullshit paperwork and administration.

Shortage of police officers? No. Just get the rest of them back on the beat where they belong.
Response times will fall dramatically.

[spudchucka]

Yep some fallacy.

skyryder

Would you do the job for that kind of money?

[Pex Adams]

Christ I've wasted my time reading some crap on this site in the past - but Skyryder you really must have your head up your ass, or can you get someone to get you a bib for christmas, to whipe that verbal diaorrhoea from you lips!!!!

How can you say that the police are well paid on $50K per annum???
Thats a crap wage, and you know it. There is no way anyone on that income could even afford to save up to buy a house in todays market, yet alone actually pay the mortgage for the house once they've purchased it - then add to that what if they have a family, superannuation blarblarblar...
Then add on top of this, everytime they do there job they get critised by halfwits like yourself, who think anyone who wears a blue uniform is a waste of oxygen.

Why don't you actually spend half a day going out with some cops and actually see what really goes on in the job, and then come back and tell me they are underpaid.

You really have NO IDEA what your talking about!!!!

[sunhuntin]

there are bad eggs in every bunch... but just because some have bad pasts, doesnt mean they all do.

i have much respect for the police force in general. most of the local cops i know are great people. i do what i can by givin em a smile when they come in for gas and asking a bit about their shift [ie busy or quiet]
the cop that breath tested me down south and then accused me of breaking the speed limit... hes a jerk in uniform, but im betting that once hes just a normal guy spending time with his wife and kids, hed give the shirt off his back.

while the wage may seem high, it aint really. i read a quote in a paper once after a crim was shot [i think.] cop said "we dont get paid enough to go home in a box" and its damn true. when the face of death looks at you for every call out or car pulled over, it sure as hell aint enough.

[Mr Merde]

..... when the face of death looks at you for every call out or car pulled over, it sure as hell aint enough.

Please explain this statement.

Is New Zealand that dangerous that police officers are in fear for their lives whilst performing their duties?

When was the last police officer unlawfully killed whilst on duty?

Is it our increasingly violent society (?) or is it just a projection of the distrust in our police forces that seems to pervade society?

Apparently (according to government figures) the average wage in NZ is about $25,000. Yes I would call a salary of twice the national average as a career start, high.

I for one would love to see a return to the policing of years gone by. Where a police officer was out there actively trying to deter crime and solve those that have taken place, rather than enforcing a collection agency for those in dictatorial control of the populace who manufacture "crimes" in order to increase their coffers.

Bring back the DOT. Put the average cop back on the beat as they have done in a lot of cities in the UK (to good effect). Drastically cut the buearocracy that burdens those on the frontline and give the courts and prison service the means to make committing a crime something to be avoided. Clean out those persons in the justice system whose job it is just to administer those who do the work. Make it better for them to be actually doing something rather than administering.

My 2c worth, I'll go back to sleep now.


Merde

[Blue Velvet]

...Apparently (according to government figures) the average wage in NZ is about $25,000. Yes I would call a salary of twice the national average as a career start, high...

Skilled or unskilled?
What field?
Etc, etc.

It's not high for the type of work and the conditions. I don't think working off the national average wage or salary is relevant.

[sunhuntin]

it was merely considering the fact that many nzers are volatile, and the majority of call outs/car pull overs have a chance that the suspect might be on drugs and not exactly thinking right. new zealand society IS becomming increasingly violent, and those that usually fall under that also have a mistrust of the cops, but not for the offences of rikkards etc. its more a mistrust borne of a fear of getting caught.

motorway patrol: how many vehicles pulled up and searched are found to have guns, drugs and other stuff in them? same with police 10/7... how many suspects on that go to a house with that same stuff just waiting to be used? or domestic call outs... tense occupants, possibly highly violent.

there is a high chance that any call out may be that officers last.

i also would like to see beat and traffic cops seperated again.

[mstriumph]

i've abstained

-- i've no 'faith' to lose, per se .....

i have always 'distrusted' talk of a 'calling' to any profession - feeling that most people do things for reasons that suit themselves, no matter what the hype they [or others] wish to put on it ...

i've never expected the police to be composed of saints
- or sinners
- or ANYTHING other than the normal mix of competent and incompetent, trustworthy and venal that comprise the ranks of any employment demograph ......

so - as i've never been a believer, i have no faith to lose

[Mr Merde]

it was merely considering the fact that many nzers are volatile, and the majority of call outs/car pull overs have a chance that the suspect might be on drugs and not exactly thinking right. new zealand society IS becomming increasingly violent, and those that usually fall under that also have a mistrust of the cops, but not for the offences of rikkards etc. its more a mistrust borne of a fear of getting caught.

motorway patrol: how many vehicles pulled up and searched are found to have guns, drugs and other stuff in them? same with police 10/7... how many suspects on that go to a house with that same stuff just waiting to be used? or domestic call outs... tense occupants, possibly highly violent.

there is a high chance that any call out may be that officers last.

i also would like to see beat and traffic cops seperated again.

The UK, which as a society suffers a much higher level of violence in the streets, has re discovered the benifit of putting the police back on the beat. They dont just drive around but have an actual route they have to patrol on foot. Too what result? Much more community involvement and strange as it seems a lower level of crime in those areas. The local bobby gets to know their area and the people in it and therefore are more in tune to what is going on in them. What do we have here? An officer in an expensive car driving around their area without really getting to know it.

I had a friend in Cardiff by the name of Viv Brooks. He retired as Sth Wales Police Assisant Cheif Constable. In the early days of his carreer he walked the beat around "Tiger Bay" (the docks). Everyone knew him and he put the fear of god into those who disturbed his patch. This was in the 50's. In the 80's when I knew him they still talked about Viv with respect down in the docks. He knew everybody and everything that was going on. He knew when there was something not right in his area and the people respected him enough to talk to him and inform him when there was a problem.

Where is that community involvement now.

30 years ago if a cop was in serious trouble "joe citizen" was more than likely to come to his assiatance. Now they have had to pass a law to make it a "crime" not to assit a police officer if requested.

Where is the trust and respect?

Both of these are earned, in all aspects of human relations, they need to be earned again by our police forces. Assistance out of respect rather than fear must be more productive.

Back to sleep

[Mekk]

I'd normally contribute to this kind of thread in a passionate manner but I lost faith in The Herald long before thinking about losing faith in the Police.

[Mr Merde]

I'd normally contribute to this kind of thread in a passionate manner but I lost faith in The Herald long before thinking about losing faith in the Police.

I can understand that. The popular press is just that, popular. As such they do tend to pander to whatever they feel may increase sales. It is very hard to get an honest and objective view from the rags today.

Another loss to modern society.