Lost in the rush

[Coldrider]

Don't play the anecdotal game. Where's your data?

As for the Australian article? I could kiss its author for a well crafted and reasoned article. I await with interest somebody submitting credible data to refute his assumptions.

Exactly, I thought we all die on road of statistics.

[vifferman]

Exactly, I thought we all die on road of statistics.

LOL!
That's the sort of thing I say when driving past those execrable signs near Maramarua:
"97.59% of road deaths are caused by statistics!"
"38% of all crashes are caused by irritating signs."

[*caution*]

.....poor driving does not cause serious accidents.

HUH???????????????

[warewolf]

HUH???????????????

Quote it all; it's not worded the best, but what he means to convey is paraphrased as "the gummit says speed is bad, poor driving is not the problem" and we should debate that.

It's almost a 1:1 correlation between stupidity and drunk driving though, so it's not worth arguing.

What is worth arguing is that speed is inhernently unsafe and poor driving does not cause serious accidents.

[SPman]

..."the gummit says speed is bad, poor driving is not the problem" and we should debate that.

Debate?

KB?

Pshaw.......

[warewolf]

Debate?

KB?

That's a royal "we", as in the wider community.

[paturoa]

My observations while doing several hundred K's in the cage over summer (Coro) were more than the usual bunch of tail gaters and people cutting blind corners.

Both these are deliberate acts. If I was a plain clothes rozza I would have made a considerable amount of pingas for the chief thief!

[Horse]

I analysis Police traffic crash reports for a crust (traffic and transportation engineer). It is often obvious the factors they are pushing but they mostly include the real details, i.e. failing to look, distracted, to hot into a corner etc. There are 86 basic crash types codes and in the order of 900 cause codes i.e. alcohol, diverted attention etc etc. Interesting thing is that on the lists to pic from the speed ones occupy the second block and contribute a sum total of 10.

Is this data publicly available?

[mowgli]

In my opinion, the REAL list would read like this:
1. Extremely poor attitude to the very serious business of driving.
2. Poor basic skills.
3. Impaired mental/physical condition due to alcohol and/or drugs and/or tiredness and/or other distractions.

The results of these would be:
1. Excessive speed for the conditions, coupled with allowing insufficient distance to other vehicles, coupled with poor decision making.
2. Failure to allow for changes in conditions or potential hazards (including weather, crap road conditions, mechanical faults, other drivers' poor driving).

Well stated. The answer (I think) is education but I am at a loss as to how we would fix this in NZ. Our road user edumication cistem is as poor as my spelling of it

[mowgli]

My observations while doing several hundred K's in the cage over summer (Coro) were more than the usual bunch of tail gaters and people cutting blind corners.

Both these are deliberate acts. If I was a plain clothes rozza I would have made a considerable amount of pingas for the chief thief!

I agree with your observation but would prefer the term negligent to deliberate. These guys aren't thinking "I know it's illegal but I'm gonna tailgate anyway". Rather they're not thinking at all ..... except perhaps about the latest txt or the 027 on the back of the car in front.

[MSTRS:Me]

Everyone 'knows' that speed kills...we are told often enough. What we are not told, and most are too thick to figure out, is that any motion, in any direction, has a 'speed' component. Including being stationary. Being in the wrong place, at the wrong time, and/or possessing any ability to manage one's weapon of choice is the problem within the slogan 'Speed kills'. The paper-war-mongers are obviously not allowed to have a category titled 'Stupidity'.

[cooneyr]

Is this data publicly available?

No.

PM sent.

Cheers R

[steveb64]

Snip'd
"38% of all crashes are caused by irritating signs."

Particularly those shitty new (over the last couple of years) yellow 'corner' markers. Who was the bloody moron who thought those up?

I mean - the idea of marking the worst corners is great - even reduces the number of accidents - except where they use them on EVERY corner, regardless of whether there's ever been an accident on that corner or not, or whether there's full vision of the road all the way through the corner or not.
The worst thing about them (and it nearly caused me to crash, with all the family on board just the other night) is the reflectivity! The small ones are bad enough, but the big 5 chevron ones are terrible when you're driving with the lights on high beam. The glare back is like having an oncoming vehicle with un-dipped lights.
What's that? Just dip your lights you say? Yeah. Great idea - then you still can't see the road - and the feckin sign is still blasting you with reflected light.
And what's even worse - is the sunlight reflection from the same damn signs. Driving along, minding my own business, and FLASH arrrggghh. Where'd the road go?

Solution? Keep the signs, but paint over the reflective coating (must be able to find something out there to reduce the reflection/glare without removing the ability to see the sign).
And move the ones in stupidly obvious places to where they'll do some good.

[Ixion]

BRONZ has raised the question of the blinding corner signs with Transit. They have promised to review their design and location. For whatever that mayn be worth

[steveb64]

Uh, no.... inappropriate stopping does the killing.

Ya need to have speed before you can stop, inappropriately or otherwise.

You also need to have speed before you can go anywhere.

So back to the initial days of motoring then - have a man walking along in front of each vehicle, waving a red flag?... Then there'd be an outcry over the number of 'flag bearers' run over by drivers falling asleep.

Why do the authorities seem to have this fixation on 'stopping' as being the only means of avoiding an accident? In my experience (30 years on and off road motorcycling, road and dirt competition, NO other vehicle accidents, last 2 tickets were 160k and 180k - 15 years apart), straightline stopping (or trying to) is the surest way of having an accident!
What's wrong with accident AVOIDENCE? You know - where you jam on the brakes to scrub off some speed, then let go of the brakes, and SWERVE around the obstruction - or at least aim for a less hazardous target?

It doesn't matter what speed you're doing - if you don't hit anything!