1st Bin: Binned my new bike

[mitchilin]

Found it yet tsmj?If you haven't I can give you a soft copy.

[Stromble]

Ya know the funny thing is.....He's RIGHT!!!

Yep, Strike 2...

[Stromble]

As far as gear goes, is this usually covered under contents?

[discotex]

Bumped over the grass for a bit, thought 'wtf', stopped and checked, then headed back on and continued around.

If I'd done that on a road with no safe runoff, I'd have been upside-down in a ditch, saying naughty words to myself.

Eternal vigilance is the key! Glad you're in one piece, tsmj.

grass at 50km/h is fun eh. Mine was turn 14 when I was surprised by my pegs touching down. Just fucked my line up enough I had to straighten up and go grass. Might have made it but I didn't want to risk hitting the edge of the track while still cranked over.

Target fixation and lack of trust in the bike/tyres/brakes is a bad combo. No better way to get past that than on the track where you can screw up and it's usually no biggie.

[Boob Johnson]

well yes and no.. I was refering to frosty's post about differences in tyres.

As for the yes if you read my post I said was user error but a better tyres would have given more confidence to lean it in more when they were running wide If running to wide a little trick is to tap the back break. It basically drops the bike further into the corner hence tightening your riding line. (for people reading DON'T stamp on the brake you will crash) I have done it once or twice but you need the confidence in yourself and tyres to do it. Personally seeing a newer rider go dirt riding in the ditch after not making a turn it sounds like it was as most suggested target fixation. Experienced riders still get it but they shut it off and react to the situation faster and hence probably come out of it ok. And these fast shifts in a sticky situation are helped by the tyres..... So after a long windedness thingy ma-jig in THIS situation better tyres could have with a bit of experience helped him get out of it. And different tyres DO have an effect on how your bike corners adn it's cornering capabilities....

Hope you're back on the road quick..

Thank goodness for someone else with a little common sense & a level head.

Frosty, a bit quick to shoot ya mouth off there mate.

[CookMySock]

I got to the point where I convinced myself I wasn't going to make the corner and started wondering where I was gonna land..

I did the exact same thing, twice.. Once I ended up in the gravel - slid to a stop in a cloud of dust.. nasty! and once WAY too quick in a 100k corner (entered 140k, out 120k). The first one was fixating and then getting a fright as you did, the second time was just not watching/thinking and way too quick.

My self-training has been ;

a. Learn to countersteer. I MUST have absolute control over my position on the road.
b. Slow Down!
c. Practice countersteering ALL the time until it's natural - even in a straight line.
d. Slow the fuck down!
e. Trust the bike and its tyres - modern bikes will scrape pegs no probs so you have a lot of lean left.
f. Approach my comfort-zone speed in corners rehearsing c. while remembering d. and e. (in that order) Stay in my half-lane - NO APEXING! DISCIPLINE! ACCURACY!
g. CAREFULLY add speed (5 clicks only) in corners that I know well, rehearsing in my mind c. before entering, and looking where I'm going.
h. Consolidate for another 1,000km's. No being a smartass.
i. Rinse and repeat from g. Don't forget h. !!

Now I'm up to weight shifting, a little apexing, and lots and lots and lots of h. and remembering to b. and d. and having a little fun ignoring b. and d. here and there - within reason.

Also I'm a newb so you should probably ignore everything I said, and listen to the experts.


DB

[carver]

Hey folks,

I bought a Kawasaki Versys last week and binned it 100Kmh on a bend in Waitoki last friday. Perfect dry sunny day, not a sharp bend, just one of those long sweepers, felt that I couldnt lean the bike long enough and drifted over the white line and caught the gravel.. Next thing I knew, I was upside down in the ditch with the bike up the embankment and a sore leg..

Damage:

Bike: Bent bars, scratched panels, little scuff on the rear wheel rim.

Me: Lost a few layers of skin, from road burns to right leg, no breaks, just lots of bruises, thank god for good gear.. apart from the jeans. Never again will I go out without my lower gear on. Weird as even when I nip out to the shops up the road, I always kit up from head to toe and the one day I didnt, this happens...!! ah well, lesson learned..

Not quite sure of what happened, been thinking it over for a few days now and replaying the events in my head. Only thing I can think of is that I got a little confident on the new bike quickly, though obviously not confident enough to drop the bike a little further into the corner once I started to drift..

Bike' been booked in for inspection, just need to ensure that there isnt any serious frame damage etc.. but seems to be cosmetic.

My helmet was scratched, mainly the visor went down the road, jacket torn, and half the carbon knuckles ground of my gloves..(hands absolutely fine - thanks to the guys at Motomail for making me spend on good gloves and helmet.!) Though I think I will be switching the Cordura jacket to leather...

The bike has Shinko tyres which arent stock, I think this bike sells new with Bridgestone BT020's 160/60/17 back and 120/70/17 front.. though upon closer inspection, the rear Shinko is 170/60/17...

Without jumping to assumptions that this would be dangerous or have contributed to my bin, I am interested to know the thoughts on fitting oversized tyres to bikes? I know people do it to cars, but doesnt seem as risky when you have 4 wheels..

Any wisdom would be much appreciated..

unless your bike is fully decked, just bring yourself to lean it further and look where ya want to go

[Blackbox]

...when you should be (by instinct, through practicing good cornering technique over and over again), be continuing to look as far ahead through the corner as you can, leaning a bit more, and (if necessary) hanging off the inside a bit.

hey, just a question on your advice...

It seems to me that if you're into a corner, and already worried about the lean angle... how would you have time to move into a hanging off position? And, if you attempted that, wouldn't the extra movement upset the bike (suspension, throttle etc), and cause more problems than it would potentially solve, especially as you are already in a stressed state (so more likely to do things wrong, like roll off the throttle, or countersteer without realising it...)?

[CookMySock]

In MY OPINION ;

It seems to me that if you're into a corner, and already worried about the lean angle...

You shouldn't be there. That is a severe and very dangerous lapse.. But since we are talking hypothetically, we'll move on..

how would you have time to move into a hanging off position?

You don't have any time at all.. So you the best thing to do is just do it anyway - REAL FAST!! Just get your shoulders and head OUT THERE, PRONTO!, and push that inside bar forward, son, and do it NOW, and forget any fear that you have because at this point that fear is about to kill you. If you are really lucky you will carve a big deep arc and end back in your lane.. If you are unlucky, well, then you will be very unlucky.

And, if you attempted that, wouldn't the extra movement upset the bike (suspension, throttle etc), and cause more problems than it would potentially solve, especially as you are already in a stressed state (so more likely to do things wrong, like roll off the throttle, or countersteer without realising it...)?

Well, if they are that far up shit creek, there is no such thing as making more mistakes - they are already fried so now we try the impossible - (seemingly to them).
If the rider did not have ANY briefing whatsoever on this, then I would say they are screwed - they will simply not have the information to apply to the problem.
If the rider was not able to manipulate their emotional state as they so chose, then I would say they are also screwed since the brain loading here as you say will be extreme.

This happened to me once, and it was forget your fears and "do it or die.. do it RIGHT NOW SON, or meet your maker!" So I just did it.

Something like that anyway.

DB

[FruitLooPs]

Wow all the crap bout "those bad tyres" and not one word bout how he chopped off the gas moments before he started sliding. Yes thats right rule number one to twelve on cornering. Even if it is just 500 rpm its gotta stay on or you're going out to the edge of the grippy stuff.

Exactly, have to stay on mean or even increasing throttle or the turn radius will go massively wide. Pitty it feels likes the worst thing to do, but it really does work.

I recall my first time on the port hills, 25w headlights on the RG150 (i'd had for a week or two) following some friends who were more experienced at 10pm at night. Barely even knew about the powerband on the 2-stroke heh.

nearly came off several corners just coming in hot enough to scare myself (not very fast in hindsight) tensing up massively shutting the throttle fixating on the edge of the road which was rapidly approaching and barely making the corner on the edge of the tarmac past the outer white line.

I slowed down pretty quick and decided rather than keep up with them and bin to just stay rubberside down. I physically cannot go at any pace at night on the RG150 still, due to the lights not having enough distance or power to look through the corner at all - its all just darkness out there so you cant really direct the bike properly at speed - have to take it on tiptoes.

Always look through the corner, and use the gas to tighten the turn radius if you must. Or so I reckon. Also learn to fight off that automatic fight or flight tense reaction, it'll do you over one day.

Oh yeah, pretty obvious but never go thrashing through an area of unknown bends - gravel or just horribly sign posted decreasing radius corners can and have caught many a person out

[discotex]

Exactly, have to stay on mean or even increasing throttle or the turn radius will go massively wide. Pitty it feels likes the worst thing to do, but it really does work.

Yep Keith Code explains it pretty well in Twist of the Wrist vol 2.

Backing off the gas loads the front up and will make the bike stand up in a similar way to using the front brake does. Hence running wide.

[Stromble]

Yep Keith Code explains it pretty well in Twist of the Wrist vol 2.

Backing off the gas loads the front up and will make the bike stand up in a similar way to using the front brake does. Hence running wide.

Funny, im now laid in hospital with a copy of that very book...awesome read, cant wait to get back on the road...

[dipshit]

My self-training has been ;

a. Learn to coun....

....Also I'm a newb so you should probably ignore everything I said, and listen to the experts.

That was very good advice! Pushing your envelope occasionally a small bit at a time is good. It will help you to manage tricky situations you may end up in from time to time with less panic and more natural reaction.
But then slow the fuck down for the majority of your riding. This way you will be riding with far more capacity in reserve.

[dipshit]

Funny, im now laid in hospital with a copy of that very book...awesome read, cant wait to get back on the road...

Just remember though that having bike handling skills is only half of it.

They are some other good books out there that also go into having the right attitude and road craft skills necessary for riding as well.

[CookMySock]

[...] have to stay on mean or even increasing throttle or the turn radius will go massively wide. Pitty it feels likes the worst thing to do, but it really does work.

Damn thats hard to do.. Lean it over harder, harder, haaaaaarder, haaaaaaaaaaarder, now power up again.. eek!

DB