Busted? Help!

[FJRider]

We need to make people think in all areas of life, not just driving.


I have no problem understanding the rules. This does not, however, mean that I agree with them. I have a problem when it is becomes clear that the law does not achieve it's stated goal and imposes restrictions on people for no good reason.

Just how will you suggest we get people thinking ? TV campaign, adds in the papers, NEW laws, web sites disscussing the issues ?????


It matters little if you AGREE with the rules or not. Ignoring rules that dont achieve their stated goal, or rules you dont like, WONT make it OK. AND THEY WERE MADE FOR GOOD REASONS.
If you want the rules changed, VOTE for it (OLDRIDER for P.M.)



good luck

[swbarnett]

Just how will you suggest we get people thinking ? TV campaign, adds in the papers, NEW laws, web sites disscussing the issues ?????

Schools would be a good place to start. Stop reducing the pass requirements and accept the fact that failing a class/paper is not the end of the world. The standard of graduates from University is dropping all the time because it's becoming easier and easier to pass in an attempt to raise the pass rate. In practice all that happens is that people put in less effort and the pass rate stays roughly the same.

It matters little if you AGREE with the rules or not. Ignoring rules that dont achieve their stated goal, or rules you dont like, WONT make it OK.

So if you were a black man in the 50's you'd happily stick to your assigned areas simply because it was the law? Civil disobedience is where it starts.

AND THEY WERE MADE FOR GOOD REASONS.

The intentions may have been good but the actuality is far from it. The road to hell is paved with good intentions.

If you want the rules changed, VOTE for it (OLDRIDER for P.M.)

There's no difference between our major parties. Voting is little more than a lottery. Although, at least under MMP we stand a small chance of getting some cooler heads onto the committee. I'm starting to think that, although I don't agree with everything they say, a few Libertarianz would be a good influence.

[FJRider]

Schools would be a good place to start. Stop reducing the pass requirements and accept the fact that failing a class/paper is not the end of the world. The standard of graduates from University is dropping all the time because it's becoming easier and easier to pass in an attempt to raise the pass rate. In practice all that happens is that people put in less effort and the pass rate stays roughly the same.


So if you were a black man in the 50's you'd happily stick to your assigned areas simply because it was the law? Civil disobedience is where it starts.


The intentions may have been good but the actuality is far from it. The road to hell is paved with good intentions.


There's no difference between our major parties. Voting is little more than a lottery. Although, at least under MMP we stand a small chance of getting some cooler heads onto the committee. I'm starting to think that, although I don't agree with everything they say, a few Libertarianz would be a good influence.

You dont need a University Degree to know, speed comes with RISKS and PENALTYS. The bigger Speed, the bigger the risk to yourself AND others. AND the bigger PENALTY if you get caught. Injurys may be part of the penalty.
Road safety is taught in schools. REALITY you learn on the road. People CAN get hurt. Factors you have no control over, play a big part of what happens out on the road. Often factors you could have never even considered. AND THE FIRST WORDS SAID AFTERWARDS ARE... "IT WASN'T MY FAULT".
AND IF THE PASS MARKS ARE SOW LOW, WHY DO SO MANY STILL FAIL ??

Civil disobedience didn't get the speed limits changed. Or any other road rule just because a number (any number) of people disagree with its purpose or result. The rules for public GOOD will take longer to be changed than those for public CONVENIENCE.
On the road, on the track, on the rugby field, rules are there. To REDUCE the risks (for all the players), not remove them. And make it fair for all players, big, small, fast or slow.


The licence restrictions in place, are to encourage safer driving, with time to gain skills and abilitys needed later when a full licence is gained.
THESE BASIC ARE BEING IGNORED, AND PEOPLE DIE !!! No matter how sensible the rules are, no matter how good the reason is, people still ignore them, if it suits them at the time. The paving on the road to hell must be pretty smooth, because its a busy road, and moving bloody quick.

Can you name ONE Politician, that you believe, is,or could be , motorcycle friendly. OR a political party that may be able to make changes on OUR behalf. No rush, but the election IS coming up...
What CHANGES would propose IF YOU COULD, that would get the PM's (any PM) approval.

ANY ANSWERS, FROM ANYBODY ???

[Jantar]

You dont need a University Degree to know, speed comes with RISKS and PENALTYS. The bigger Speed, the bigger the risk to yourself AND others. AND the bigger PENALTY if you get caught. Injurys may be part of the penalty......

This is where you, and many others, are wrong. Higher speeds DO result in greater injuries and more fatalities in the event of accidents. BUT, Almost every country and state that has increased its speed limits has experienced fewer accidents and a decreased road toll.

[scumdog]

This is where you, and many others, are wrong. Higher speeds DO result in greater injuries and more fatalities in the event of accidents. BUT, Almost every country and state that has increased its speed limits has experienced fewer accidents and a decreased road toll.

All I can say is that a shit-load of people in NZ will have to sharpen their driving/riding up for that to be the same on our roads!!

[Jantar]

All I can say is that a shit-load of people in NZ will have to sharpen their driving/riding up for that to be the same on our roads!!

But it has already happened once. When our speed limits were dropped in 1974 the road toll went up. When it was raised in 1985 the road toll came down.

[scumdog]

But it has already happened once. When our speed limits were dropped in 1974 the road toll went up. When it was raised in 1985 the road toll came down.

Soooo, to be a smart bastard, how high would the speed-limit have to be for the road-toll to be zero??

[McJim]

Soooo, to be a smart bastard, how high would the speed-limit have to be for the road-toll to be zero??

Too high for my bike I'll ned to use my car if they lift the speed that high.

[discotex]

Soooo, to be a smart bastard, how high would the speed-limit have to be for the road-toll to be zero??

As the speed limit approaches the speed of light the apparent road-toll will approach zero.

[Patrick]

But it has already happened once. When our speed limits were dropped in 1974 the road toll went up. When it was raised in 1985 the road toll came down.

But that was when drink driving was quite acceptable, with higher limits (500mg per litre of breath) needed to be over as well... Might have had a bit to do with it perhaps?

[Swoop]

Sooooo, in a nutshell you're saying: as the fleet gets safer and less people get killed we should raise the speed limit to keep the road toll where it is at present?????

The nation has done quite well this year.
How many fatalities on the roads over easter, I wonder. Can we get a high-score?

[jafar]

But that was when drink driving was quite acceptable, with higher limits (500mg per litre of breath) needed to be over as well... Might have had a bit to do with it perhaps?

Drink driving was better accepted back then, dropping the limit from 500mg to the current limit of 400mg?? did nothing except catch the one or two that had a drink with dinner etc. It was a politically motivated knee jerk reaction to a situation.
The ones that need to be caught are & were the pissheads that don't care how drunk they are or who they hurt in their drunken state. They are usually well above either the old limit or the new one.

Lower speed limits cause frustration & that is a well known major cause of accidents.

The nation has done quite well this year.
How many fatalities on the roads over easter, I wonder. Can we get a high-score?

I'll go for 7 & hope i'm too high

[FJRider]

I think the "gentlemen" at the start of this thread were lucky. If two bikes were travelling at speed, on the same piece of road at the same time, they could have been accused of RACING. Bikes impounded till after the court case. A month walking is tame in comparison. Regardless of any fine imposed.

[swbarnett]

You dont need a University Degree to know, speed comes with RISKS and PENALTYS. ...

You just don't get it and nothing that I say will change that.

You believe in absolute safety and I don't. This is a philosophical differences that no amount of debate will resolve. It's tantamount to a religious debate. The only problem is that your beliefs are reflected in law and mine are not. This is not what I call a free society.

Life without risk is meaningless. Just look at the rise of extreme sports in recent years.

[swbarnett]

AND IF THE PASS MARKS ARE SOW LOW, WHY DO SO MANY STILL FAIL ??

This is an observed fact, not theory.

The most likely mechanism is that students are, like all humans, basically lazy. If you can still pass with less effort that's what will happen. As a result the overall pass rate stays the same.

Would you go on a three day hunt for one meal if you could just reach out and pluck it from the nearest tree?