Singh family complaining about the police

[spudchucka]

Nor the public I would imagine. If it could be shown that officers received regular intensive training backed up with some sort of stringent 'police gun licence' it would be a hell of a lot easier to bring arms in.
This needs to be coupled with a realistic attitude to a copper making the inevitable mistake. Are we ready for that?

The vast majority of cops will never find themselves in the position of having to draw a weapon on an offender. From personal experience I can say that it is a very humbling experience to find yourself only moments away from having to squeeze the trigger.

Having gone as far as you can without actually having fired the weapon I felt afterwards that the training I'd had was sufficient. However I have always found weapons handling comes completely naturally to me. Not everyone has naturally ability though and the training needs to allow for the lowest common denominator

There is no police gun licence, in fact you can be qualified to use firearms as a police officer and not hold a current NZ firearms licence. However you do need to pass the training requirements, if you don't you can't draw a weapon from the armoury.

[SixPackBack]

The Singh family have laid an official complaint with the PCA. Will be interesting to see both the outcome and public reaction.
Not gunna bring papa Singh back regardless of the outcome!

[98tls]

If Helen fast tracks the paperwork and throws a decent amount of $ at them that should ensure the vote of another large portion of our population.

[HenryDorsetCase]

If Helen fast tracks the paperwork and throws a decent amount of $ at them that should ensure the vote of another large portion of our population.

so cynical.



so right.

[HenryDorsetCase]

the LAPD seem to like firearms training and shotguns: I think their gangs and slums are somewhat more hardcore than ours.

check this out

[Genestho]

The Singh family have laid an official complaint with the PCA. Will be interesting to see both the outcome and public reaction.
Not gunna bring papa Singh back regardless of the outcome!

I can understand your comment as a bystander - It wont bring him back.
But from an insiders point of view, if there was a way that his death could've been prevented then its only natural that they want answers.

If this was your loved one in this situation, what you do? Thats probably not a fair question to ask because you wouldn't know the answer until you were going through it.
Grief affects people individually, callous acts provoke anger, this is their focus. If there was a cockup and they can prevent the cockup from happening again, good on them.
The situation will happen again, but maybe the alleged cockup wont.
Sometimes there needs to be accountability from more than just the offender, which has been lacking in alot of cases.

Watch what happens when the Dept of Corrections gets sued by the survivor of the RSA killings, finally for the first time there will be accountability and from that will openup a flood of cases. And so there should be.

[SixPackBack]

I can understand your comment as a bystander - It wont bring him back.
But from an insiders point of view, if there was a way that his death could've been prevented then its only natural that they want answers.

If this was your loved one in this situation, what you do?
Grief affects people individually, callous acts provoke anger, this is their focus. And if they can prevent the cockup from happening again, good on them.
The situation will happen again, but maybe the cockup wont.
Sometimes there needs to be accountability from more than just the offender, which has been lacking in alot of cases.

Watch what happens when the Dept of Corrections gets sued by the survivor of the RSA killings, finally for the first time there will be accountability and from that will openup a flood of cases. And so there should be.

Good post. What would I do?...nothing! having personally been through the wringer with more than my fair share of tragedy including a family death from 'P' and a close family friend brutally stabbed to death I can work through anger-grief-blame appropriation without a flicker.

The copper may not receive a glowing performance appraisal next time around-the criminal will receive a long jail sentence. No amount of hand wringing will change that.

[FJRider]

The vast majority of cops will never find themselves in the position of having to draw a weapon on an offender. From personal experience I can say that it is a very humbling experience to find yourself only moments away from having to squeeze the trigger.

Having gone as far as you can without actually having fired the weapon I felt afterwards that the training I'd had was sufficient. However I have always found weapons handling comes completely naturally to me. Not everyone has naturally ability though and the training needs to allow for the lowest common denominator

There is no police gun licence, in fact you can be qualified to use firearms as a police officer and not hold a current NZ firearms licence. However you do need to pass the training requirements, if you don't you can't draw a weapon from the armoury.

I spent 8 years in the Army (regular force),PART of that on active service. Had people shooting at ME... it was about that time I wished I had spent MORE time on the range. ALSO at that time, feelings about all sorts of things, change.
ALL armed forces including police, train for things, they hope they will get a chance to do... AND SURVIVE. When (if) they ACTUALLY do it for real ...attitudes to all things, will never be the same.
To those in the "trades" that ARE 'wishing'... I hope you don't need to find out... for yourself.
And no matter HOW much training or practice, you can still make mistakes. I guess thats what makes us human

[Genestho]

Sorry I edited my post as you were replying to mine...I forgot to add the part about the trauma of watching someone go through hell, knowing there couldve been a way to save him.

Very practical answer. Cheers Mate.

I guess it goes back to - you either become apart of the solution or continue to assist in growing the problem and do nothing.
Again everybody deals with this differently.
I wont assume that you dont have your reasons for not wanting answers and culpability beyond what your satisified with in your situation. Maybe you dont need any.
I dont see anything wrong or tragic in what theyre doing, afterall as the old saying goes "evil prevails when good men do nothing"

[FJRider]

Never said that at all, just showed how Kiwis are quite happy with thousands half-assed drivers with no training to share the roads with but a few hundred cops with less than optimum training equiped with firearms they may never fire in their whole career is a big no-no..

But since you mentioned it guess it makes sense......

I wonder if driver behaviour would change if we armed the Highway Patrols.... mmmmmmm

[98tls]

I can understand your comment as a bystander - It wont bring him back.
But from an insiders point of view, if there was a way that his death could've been prevented then its only natural that they want answers.

If this was your loved one in this situation, what you do? Thats probably not a fair question to ask because you wouldn't know the answer until you were going through it.
Grief affects people individually, callous acts provoke anger, this is their focus. If there was a cockup and they can prevent the cockup from happening again, good on them.
The situation will happen again, but maybe the alleged cockup wont.
Sometimes there needs to be accountability from more than just the offender, which has been lacking in alot of cases.

Watch what happens when the Dept of Corrections gets sued by the survivor of the RSA killings, finally for the first time there will be accountability and from that will openup a flood of cases. And so there should be.

In this particular case if the facts are as has been stated then then i wonder if they take a hard look at there own actions after the event,i can understand there grief but will never understand there actions,if by some chance the guy could have survived by getting to a hospital in quick time then if theres blame to be laid i suggest they take a look in the mirror.

[Genestho]

Maybe they are scraping at hope, I dont know, shock affects you like you wouldnt believe (or maybe you would - I dont know). Even now I go back and think what I couldve done differently in my situation. You just watch the whole thing unfold in front of you like a bad movie, no control. Anyway as sixpackback says it will be an interesting outcome either way.

[98tls]

Maybe they are scraping at hope, I dont know, shock affects you like you wouldnt believe (or maybe you would - I dont know). Even now I go back and think what I couldve done differently in my situation. You just watch the whole thing unfold in front of you like a bad movie, no control. Anyway as sixpackback says it will be an interesting outcome either way.

Fair call,at the same time in this particular case it reeks (to me anyway) of blame anyone but myself,apart from that they had no problem despite there grief in trying to set up a donate $ line the very next day,which incidently they were not able to do.

[Genestho]

Crikey, is that right? Didnt know that!

Man, I may be about to do a public u-turn in everything I just said!!!

Makes you wonder why they would want to do that eh? I find that strange behaviour indeed.

[BIHB@0610]

Crikey, is that right? Didnt know that!

Man, I may be about to do a public u-turn in everything I just said!!!

Makes you wonder why they would want to do that eh? I find that strange behaviour indeed.

Maybe they're just freaking out about the widow left behind, with perhaps no life insurance, three young girls, no career, and no way to make ends meet. It would totally suck! I'm on my own with three kids and a bloody decent salary, believe me, it's hard on your own