Pack mentality

[The Stranger:Me]

What is KB to you? I expect it is different things to different people.
To me it is a community, in virtually every sense of the word.
Like most communities it is made up of people with different views, backgrounds, ethnicity etc. I think without exception all the KBers I have met are caring, responsible and kind individuals

I have commented before (many times) on how you meet the nicest people riding motorbikes. Not just a few, the vast majority. I have also singled out the youf for a special mention frequently. I often have the pleasure of entertaining many KBers here and I genuinely consider this an honour and a privilege.

Against this background, why is it we abuse or persecute certain individuals?
What motivates seemingly good, rational, caring individuals to act in this way?

Certain mods have been known to lament the “pack mentality”. If by that you mean the pack taking care of the pack (community), then yeah guilty as charged, though I fail to see why this should be a problem. It is the very essence of a community.

Every now and then we see a new member of the community come along who rocks the boat. They may start, or step outside community norms. What happens? The community (pack) closes ranks and seeks to protect its own – as it should.
It is remarkable to watch as some young dickhead rider gets sorted. Some are resistant to learning and it may take some time, but the community eventually wins out with perseverance.
Sometimes on the other hand the mods seem to believe that they must step in, change rules and spend countless hours sorting out a pack attack which they simply can’t comprehend. Often this is simply the community saying “enough dickhead, sort your shit out!” Rarely does this happen without warning, usually it has been made quite clear to the individual that they are out of line in a calm and rational manner – just the individual concerned cannot receive clue. Whilst this could well be considered a “pack mentality” it is in fact the pack acting for the benefit of the pack (or community) – which is what any community should do.

Mods could consider instead binning the individual. Whilst the individual may not be too happy about it, think of it as protective custody.
Noobs no longer get ill conceived, bad or dangerous advice,
It will stop the individual making a fool of themselves and going postal
The community no longer need to make corrective posts and set out to discredit the individual.
And the mods lives will be easier.

It’s a win, win, win, win solution.

[MSTRS:Me]

You are thinking too much. Who needs that sort of commonsense approach? You need to get out more.

[Hitcher]

KB as a community is dynamic and constantly changing. As it has become a more established and mature community, so too has the role of Moderator changed.

Compared with a few years ago, the numbers of Moderator interventions are significantly less and also different in nature. The days of the gun slinging Mod are disappearing as the wild west recedes. The site tends to self-moderate a lot now, particularly regarding trolls and troublemakers.

I'm not saying that things don't get untidy from time to time and that people don't abuse others through all of the mechanisms this site offers members to communicate with each other, and more. I'm saying that that happens much less than previously.

The site's rules have also evolved over time. It is impossible to predict in advance what rules may be needed to smoothly manage any organisation or group of people.

What is best practice on other forums does not necessarily apply here. For example there are few other forums where members meet in reality or where members get killed or badly injured as a consequence of the primary purpose of that forum (unless there are snuff/mutilation sites that I have yet to discover).

Years ago in my golfing era, the club of which I was a member had signs up imploring members not to use their cellphones on the course in a manner which may require the committee to pass a new rule. Hopefully Kiwi Biker doesn't need any more rules!

[enigma51]

KB as a community is dynamic and constantly changing. As it has become a more established and mature community, so too has the role of Moderator changed.

Compared with a few years ago, the numbers of Moderator interventions are significantly less and also different in nature. The days of the gun slinging Mod are disappearing as the wild west recedes. The site tends to self-moderate a lot now, particularly regarding trolls and troublemakers.

I'm not saying that things don't get untidy from time to time and that people don't abuse others through all of the mechanisms this site offers members to communicate with each other, and more. I'm saying that that happens much less than previously.

The site's rules have also evolved over time. It is impossible to predict in advance what rules may be needed to smoothly manage any organisation or group of people.

What is best practice on other forums does not necessarily apply here. For example there are few other forums where members meet in reality or where members get killed or badly injured as a consequence of the primary purpose of that forum (unless there are snuff/mutilation sites that I have yet to discover).

Years ago in my golfing era, the club of which I was a member had signs up imploring members not to use their cellphones on the course in a manner which may require the committee to pass a new rule. Hopefully Kiwi Biker doesn't need any more rules!

You right the only time mods do anything substantial is when they get harassed by the fuckwit saying he is being abused.

[Cajun]

The pack often attacks people, when they have not done anything wrong, everyone is allowed the opinions and ideas, some people put there ideas across in good ways others do not,

if everyone had same ideas nothing new would come.

Honstly kb is like a school playground, kids picking on other kids, due to they act different talk different, or something different than normal.
Some people use online persons on site, and are very different on line.
Some people have personally clashes, people have falling outs, and like always you will get fuckwits & dickheads in every group no matter what no way you can stop it.

But members should not be repeatly targeted by a many members of the pack for really doing bad. To many people us.

Some people really need to grow up, pull head out of there arses, and actually do something go ride play in garage, go enjoy friends, and meet some people off real life people.

We are all bikers a small % of nz total population we shouldn't be targeting each other due to somethign minor we should be trying to make NZ a safer/better place for motorcycles, and not targeting each other for jobs/looks/beliefs.

[R6_kid:Me]

I find it interesting that over the years a certain 'elite' have come and gone. The 'fast' riders from the very early days have decided they dont like this spot anymore and stick to themselves, but their community was more or less established here, and this happens from time to time - and as The Stranger has said - it is much like real life society.

The other select few 'elite' have removed themselves for other reasons, generally due to egos that were even too big for the internet. In one sense they are missed, but in another it has allowed for the community to move on, and 99% of the time for the better.

I like this place, and as long as I keep on meeting great people and ride a bike then I intend to stick around as long as possible!

[enigma51]

The pack often attacks people, when they have not done anything wrong, everyone is allowed the opinions and ideas, some people put there ideas across in good ways others do not,

if everyone had same ideas nothing new would come.

Honstly kb is like a school playground, kids picking on other kids, due to they act different talk different, or something different than normal.
Some people use online persons on site, and are very different on line.
Some people have personally clashes, people have falling outs, and like always you will get fuckwits & dickheads in every group no matter what no way you can stop it.

But members should not be repeatly targeted by a many members of the pack for really doing bad. To many people us.

Some people really need to grow up, pull head out of there arses, and actually do something go ride play in garage, go enjoy friends, and meet some people off real life people.

We are all bikers a small % of nz total population we shouldn't be targeting each other due to somethign minor we should be trying to make NZ a safer/better place for motorcycles, and not targeting each other for jobs/looks/beliefs.

I do see your point

The problem is that some people dont get the fact that when they make mistakes or ask stupid question (no question is realy stupid) and they get poked fun at they should take it on the chin and move on not kick and scream like its the end of the world cause that just causes more grief and before you know it it is a massive shit fight.


The DB thing is a classic example he did some stupid things got given advice and though it was abuse
got realy pissie and got more crap
ignored the advice and kick and screamed until the mods took ill informed action just to shut him up which in returned cause more grief for him.

People start letting it go he puts something daft like my chines tyres will not fit what glue should use ( cant realy remember the full thing) got laughed at for being stupid once again threw a tantrem and guess what got shit back

The swing arm thing is one of my favourites but i think one example is enough for know

[Cajun]

I do see your point

The problem is that some people dont get the fact that when they make mistakes or ask stupid question (no question is realy stupid) and they get poked fun at they should take it on the chin and move on not kick and scream like its the end of the world cause that just causes more grief and before you know it it is a massive shit fight.


The DB thing is a classic example he did some stupid things got given advice and though it was abuse
got realy pissie and got more crap
ignored the advice and kick and screamed until the mods took ill informed action just to shut him up which in returned cause more grief for him.

People start letting it go he puts something daft like my chines tyres will not fit what glue should use ( cant realy remember the full thing) got laughed at for being stupid once again threw a tantrem and guess what got shit back

The swing arm thing is one of my favourites but i think one example is enough for know

Issues on both sides on that problem, but its a wider thing across site it happens to many members, some of public some of it in reps/pms, and some people need to build a bridge get over things and forget about them.

You will never be able to get along with everyone in life, and actually the measure of a person is how they deal with those people, do they attack them, do they ignore them, do they try and find out where there problem is and help. But no looking into themselfs is to hard, so take the easy route of attacking them.

but like your mummy says
two wrongs don't make a right
and if you can't say something nice about someone don't say nothing at all.

[Katman]

Is it 'right' for members of a community to sit back and silently allow others to promote a manner of riding which gets members of said community killed at an alarming rate?

And is it 'right' that a 'pack' within that community tries to silence an individual who chooses to speak out about such riding?

[Str8 Jacket]

Is it 'right' for members of a community to sit back and silently allowed others to promote a manner of riding which gets members of said community killed at an alarming rate?

And is it 'right' that a 'pack' inside that community tries to silence an individual who chooses to speak out about such riding?

Who's anyone to say what's right and what's wrong for anyone other than themselves?

[AlBundy]

Like with any 'family', there are good kids and bad kids, 'parents' and other roll models. Some people never do anything wrong, some see how far they can push the limits. Then, there are the ones who get up to mischief but plead innocence all the time, hypocits if you like... There are also bullies which pick on the new/small people...

Some of the ribbing is just that, giving people shit. Lets face it, some of us come here for a bit of serious bike discussion but often just to have some fun.
Given that 'tone' isn't easy to detect on a computer, methinks often the messages are totally misinterpreted and therein is the issue... Use more smilies when being witty, maybe that'll get rid of some of the confusion, when it was meant to be humour...

That aside, opinions will vary, a fact of life... Some people need to appreciate that others won't agree with them. Take it on the chin, don't get abusive, it won't makes things any better... Or change others' opinions.

Another point to consider... A lot of us swear during daily communication. So, when we post it may be taken wrongly. Possibly nothing was meant by it, it's just that persons nature...

[Oscar]

Who's anyone to say what's right and what's wrong for anyone other than themselves?

Who's anyone to say; "Who's anyone to say what's right and what's wrong for anyone other than themselves?"

In saying that, haven't you just told someone (other than yourself) what to do?

[AlBundy]

Is it 'right' for members of a community to sit back and silently allowed others to promote a manner of riding which gets members of said community killed at an alarming rate?

And is it 'right' that a 'pack' inside that community tries to silence an individual who chooses to speak out about such riding?

Once again, here we go...

You'll find that your target audience is a very small one (the naughty kids). The vast majority of people on this site behave (the good kids).

The ones that ride as you describe, can see your point, have digested it and decided to go their own way. You are NOT their keeper. Consider it like parenting... You try your best and hope the kids do the right thing. Some do, some don't...

As far as I'm aware, no one is trying to silence you. It's just that you keep on butting in when it isn't needed. Time and place Katman, time and place... By the sound of it, you used to be a naughty kid. For some reason, you changed your ways. Like most things in life, you hate what you were, or used to do, moreso than the average person seems to care.

[MSTRS:Me]

Who's anyone to say; "Who's anyone to say what's right and what's wrong for anyone other than themselves?"

In saying that, haven't you just told someone (other than yourself) what to do?

Yeah! Make up your own mind and do as I say....

[Oscar]

You'll find that your target audience is a very small one. The vast majority of people on this site behave.

Is it tiring jumping to those conclusions...?