Zero Tolerance

[Squeak the Rat]

i don't agree

there is nothing WRONG with drinking and, therefore, nothing that needs fixing per se?

............ it only becomes a problem when the drinker underestimates the effect it's had on him/her and gets into a car or whatever

Any cops who work in South Auckland want to comment on that?

[MikeyG]

Theres some old guy in Porirua who has Either 20something or 50something drunk driving convictions. They just can't stop him driving. If they take his lisence he drives disqualified. If they take his car he buys a new one. What is a zero tolerance approach going to do to stop people like this.

Only if people who have been drinking but are below the limit are significantly represented in accidents should a zero tolerance law be introduced.

We need harsher penalties for those who repetitively drive over the limit though.

As most perfumes/aftershaves, and some mouthwashes and medications have an alcohol base zero tolerance to alcohol would be very hard to enforce.

[mstriumph]

I ride better after a drink

no, you don't

the small loss in inhibition and gain in confidence makes my riding smoother.

no, it doesn't

I wouldn't touch my bike if I were drunk.

hope not

but interesting post ..... thinking you drive [sing, dance, fight, argue, etc etc 'better after a drink' unquote is a common enough dillusion to be parodied in stand up comedy AND YET NO-ONE ACTS ACCORDINGLY

[mstriumph]

You are right .. instead it shows why people do not get tageted for manslaughter charges when they kill someone when drinking and driving ... with half the jury thinking "oh its just an accident .. s/he didn't mean it" when you get in the car you take responsbility for what you do ... or do you?

absolutely

if it's one good thing that a 0% permitted level would do it would be to deny idiots the 'oh - i was drunk and didn't know what i was doing' defence

[ceebie13]

I ride better after a drink, the small loss in inhibition and gain in confidence makes my riding smoother....

...and what about the gain in your reaction time?

[Grahameeboy]

Theres some old guy in Porirua who has Either 20something or 50something drunk driving convictions. They just can't stop him driving. If they take his lisence he drives disqualified. If they take his car he buys a new one. What is a zero tolerance approach going to do to stop people like this.

Only if people who have been drinking but are below the limit are significantly represented in accidents should a zero tolerance law be introduced.

We need harsher penalties for those who repetitively drive over the limit though.

As most perfumes/aftershaves, and some mouthwashes and medications have an alcohol base zero tolerance to alcohol would be very hard to enforce.

You will always get exceptions like the old guy who smoked roll ups all his life and lived to 92, however, most smokers will not reach the 'life expectancy'

I do not know but I suspect the limit in Sweden allows for the small amounts of alcohol in medicines and how would perfume/aftershaves and mouthwashes get into the blood system so even if this upset a breathyliser, the blood test would be more accurate.

[NotaGoth]

My very first accident I had when I was 18 was drink driving... (red rep me if you want) Went through a silly stage after losing my father.. Drunk myself silly one night.. I had tried to get hold of my old lady for a lift home.. Couldn't get in touch... So I made the choice to drive home....

Went off the road out Whangaroa, into the harbour.. Just about killed myself.... And no one can understand how I walked away.. The possibility that I could have taken someone elses life now scares me half to death... And it was a HUGE wakeup call...

I was only just over the limit but at the end of the day, one court case later.. I was hugely suprised at the "light slap on the wrist" I recieved.. It felt like I wasn't being punished at all by the law... And that I was only being punished by the damage I had done to myself..

I've learned my lesson from it purely because I had an experience where I'm lucky to be here...

If you get pulled over, and end up with a light slap on the wrist at the end of the day you'll usually just keep doing it.. How many drink drivers bite the bullet and take the risk of driving even if they have been caught before..?

Its only because I'm very lucky to have walked away that I for one won't ever do it again..

I think the penalties should be much much higher if you are caught drink driving.. Not just a "sit in the corner and think about what you've done, 1 minute for each year of your life"

My personal opinion is that something much harsher is in order if you are found over the set limit..

[MSTRS:Me]

- i'm just trying to get my head around the impact children's rights in sweden has with the amount of tax paid and how either of those things impacts their drunk driving laws ......................

I think the point there is the amount of State control/intervention that Swede's enjoy - added to how much the Swede-in-the-street is prepared to 'behave'

[Ixion]

Originally Posted by Grahameeboy
Go get plastered to the point that you fail a breath test an hour or so after drinking. then answer your own question

I don't drink.

I don't drink and drive so I can caste stones.

Which brings me back to my point about wowsers and prohibition

The moderate consumption of alcohol is a civilized practice that enriches our lives (Yes, I know that teetotallers won't agree with that. It's true all the ame).

There is no evidence that a glass of wine with dinner renders anyone unfit to drive. The effect is almost certainly MUCh less than driving home tired out after a day at work

Nor is there any validity in the emotive coupling of drinking equals drunk driving. If "drink driving" = "drunken driving" then it is not valid arguement to equate moderate drinking and driving as "drink driving"

[/B]As soon as one drink goes through the lips often there is a change .... either to the attitude or to the abilities ... no matter who you are - or how much you can hold your liquor. Have you ever noticed those who are holding their liquor are slurring.

Cobblers. Preferably ones with cherry brandy.

No but suggests that some of those anti zero tolerance feel that their rights are being impinged on so have the potential to drink and drive.

Yes. You do not drink. You clearly believe that others should be forced to adopt the same teetotalism. I disagree. You ARE attempting to impinge on my rights.

Jeez ... I've just seen the poll results where 25 people say it's ok to drink/drive and only 22 say it isn't!

FFS! What is wrong with everyone? Look at the Rotorua crash thread and see the gnashing of teeth and RIP's over a drunk killing 3 bikers and you STILL support drinking & driving?

Jeez, we have a serious problem ... and those 25 who did not vote for zero tolerance *are* the problem. We have to realise, it's *not* the other guy/guyess .... it's *us*

What a load of emotive baloney. The poll does not say that 25 people (or any people) are "drink drivers". It says that 25 people disagree with you that the demon drink is unacceptable in any circumstances.

See above above trying to forces your own teetoalism on others. The definition of a wowser.

[Nasty]

Nope, it shows one police officers interpretation of why jury's don't convict. How does he know this? I'm sure the jurors don't say "not guilty, hell i drink and drive all the time".

I am sorry bit it doesn't show one officers reasoning .. unless you know my source better than I do. I think you have an interesting point - but your one after research would show I am right.

[ceebie13]

Lemonade please.

coming up madam! Ice and lemon? :-)

[gixermike]

UK breath tests ask you if you have taken anything..e.g medication / breath fresheners. if you have they wait 20mins then do the test. if you're pissed and are over, you're still over. and if it was a lie to try and get off you still fail,
if your telling the truth, then by that time the little affect it's had has worn off. not hard really.

[NotaGoth]

Think about your family that you'll leave behind if you crash and die on the way home.... The pain you'd put them through is gut wrenching... I made it home (in the end) but absolutely broke my mums heart when she just about lost another..

If you've got kids think about how painful it would be for them to lose a parent.. (Its a really hard thing to go through as a child, I know from experience)

How painful it is for someone to lose a partner...

Think about someone else whos life you could turn completely turn upside down... Someone you may or may not know whos life, and those around thems lives that you could turn completely upside down..

All because you wouldn't find a sober driver, take a taxi, stop at your limit, or simply.... Turn down a few drinks...

Its a pretty selfish act.. And most don't think of the affect it has on those around you..

Stick with the limit.. But enforce heftier penalties on those who are found over..

[MSTRS:Me]

UK breath tests ask you if you have taken anything..e.g medication / breath fresheners. if you have they wait 20mins then do the test. if you're pissed and are over, you're still over. and if it was a lie to try and get off you still fail,
if your telling the truth, then by that time the little affect it's had has worn off. not hard really.

No not hard...but damned inconvenient for the innocent. Would you be happy sitting at the roadside for 20mins+ cos you'd just swigged a teaspoon of cough syrup??

[Grahameeboy]

UK breath tests ask you if you have taken anything..e.g medication / breath fresheners. if you have they wait 20mins then do the test. if you're pissed and are over, you're still over. and if it was a lie to try and get off you still fail,
if your telling the truth, then by that time the little affect it's had has worn off. not hard really.

I know but this is NZ mate........lots of too hard baskets