Double fatal crash, Rotorua (29 April)

[Str8 Jacket]

RIP Leon and friends, my thoughts are with your families. Your gonna be missed man!

[Patrick]

IActually police say alcohol may have been a contributor

But wait and see, it "WILL" have been....

[scumdog]

'Not trying to go off topic but I noticed how differently the Herald treated this story to the Dompost. I think the Dom has it in for bikes. They never print any of my letters to the Ed with the word motorcycle in it- oh bikes, trash that letter. Whereas the herald today painted a sympathetic and comprehensive story on the bike victims AND made no doubt who was at fault. Monday's Dompost "2 motorcyclists died when they crossed the centreline. Police suspect alcohol and speed may have contributed' The wording clearly implied the riders were at fault. Tuesday's Dompost, no correction I notice.

If this is true I would not use the DungPost as arse-wipe - even in dire emergency.

[Edbear]

If this is true I would not use the DungPost as arse-wipe - even in dire emergency.

What would you use...?

[scumdog]

What would you use...?

Nettles, Bush lawyer (remember that thread) and ANYTHING but the DungPost

Would rather scour in me leather chaps.

But hey let's keep on topic.

[Chickadee]

Such a waste of human life, condolenses to the families of the bikers.

I don't know if anyone know's the family with wee ones left behind, is it worth asking if they are accepting money for a trust for kids of the bikers left behind. I know they did that in the UK for a fellow workmate who died in a freak accident (he was relatively young & had a wee baby with his Mrs). The company set up a trust fund for the wee girl).

Anyway such a loss, makes you realise how mortal we all are out there, cages generally have the odds stacked in their favour. Feel bad for the little girls in the car and the families of the bikers. Such a waste.

[RT527]

As a truck driver Driving a Mack I have been in to Truck stops Mt Maunganui.

This is where Leon worked, He was an awesome mechanic and has worked on my truck A couple of times, but mostly he was the guy that made it happen.

I never new Leon Privately only as the foreman at truck stops.

RIP Leon and Many condolences to his wife and Children.


Also Rip to the Two other riders who's lives were tragically taken.

[KATWYN]

But wait and see, it "WILL" have been....

I agree....but one thing i'm learning is to never jump the gun and assume
anything until all facts are presented.

As an example of jumping the gun, based on pretty damming evidence someone may have the smell of alcohol on their breath in the workplace - Do you jump the gun and fire them immediately? Or could it be, that they may possibly have diabetes which contributes to the alcohol smell on their breath? They may not be boozing or drunk at work afterall. (this example has nothing to do with the detection of alcohol and this incident btw)

Anyway back on topic

[Patrick]

[QUOTE=candor;1036641]
As Police and hospitals do not standardly test the crash deceased for alcohol (only three quarters of the time) or drugs (only once in a blue moon) there is a fair chance the cause will never come out in the wash.

Since when? ALL deceased involved in a motor vehicle crash are tested. Mind you, that is only in my 22 years experience...

If a Coroners inquest is permitted (Police may fight it as they currently are regarding my Mums crash death 3 years ago) it may come out whether the driver was drunk - or drugged (only on the off chance drug tests were ordered against usual protocols).

Drugs are more difficult..but again, can be done and is normally done by way of toxicology testing, post-mortem...don't understand why not in the case you are mentioning??

Many many crashes are not gotten to the bottom of in NZ. If you are killed by a truck you will not get a fair investigation as - usually no breathalysing!

Ummm... you're dead... (P/T)

Dunno where this stuff is coming from... if you are involved in a fatal crash, no matter what you drive, you will be tested - breath at the roadside if you are uninjured, bloods at the hospital if you are injured...

But whatever the cause we know this man was a suspect type to let drive your kids based on his past record. People need to be more realistic about their relatives achilles heels. And stop entrusting their kids to those who aren't up to it. Problem is - that DUI is rampant in some families, they're blase.

Fair call here... the family knows what he is like...

[Patrick]

I agree....but one thing i'm learning is to never jump the gun and assume
anything until all facts are presented.

As an example of jumping the gun, based on pretty damming evidence someone may have the smell of alcohol on their breath in the workplace - Do you jump the gun and fire them immediately? Or could it be, that they may possibly have diabetes which contributes to the alcohol smell on their breath? They may not be boozing or drunk at work afterall. (this example has nothing to do with the detection of alcohol and this incident btw)

Anyway back on topic

Fair call... I did that "ONCE"... but that is another thread

To have mentioned it in the first place to the media, must have been fairly obvious to the cops/ambo/fireys who attended...

[Blondini]

.................

[peasea]

They are surprisingly not thorough and there is a 16% chance it will not all come out in the wash.

The Police claim they estimate 16% of fatal NZ crashes (ie 25% of fatalities) have drug intoxication as a main factor. Under half these drug related cases feature alcohol.

As Police and hospitals do not standardly test the crash deceased for alcohol (only three quarters of the time) or drugs (only once in a blue moon) there is a fair chance the cause will never come out in the wash.

If a Coroners inquest is permitted (Police may fight it as they currently are regarding my Mums crash death 3 years ago) it may come out whether the driver was drunk - or drugged (only on the off chance drug tests were ordered against usual protocols).

The acknowledged main cause of such crashes is alcohol &/or drugs (by all international experts), our serious crash unit does not automatically cover either of these bases via testing of deceaseds blood as that costs about a grand to check for ALL the 5 traffic risk drugs including alcohol ($250 EACH). So the cause may well remain a mystery.

Many many crashes are not gotten to the bottom of in NZ. If you are killed by a truck you will not get a fair investigation as - usually no breathalysing!

But whatever the cause we know this man was a suspect type to let drive your kids based on his past record. People need to be more realistic about their relatives achilles heels. And stop entrusting their kids to those who aren't up to it. Problem is - that DUI is rampant in some families, they're blase.

....and you know all this coz?

Not the right thread for this, surely.

[scumdog]

[QUOTE=Patrick;1036935]

Many many crashes are not gotten to the bottom of in NZ. If you are killed by a truck you will not get a fair investigation as - usually no breathalysing!

Ummm... you're dead... (P/T)
Dunno where this stuff is coming from... if you are involved in a fatal crash, no matter what you drive, you will be tested - breath at the roadside if you are uninjured, bloods at the hospital if you are injured...

I'm with Patrick - you crash? - your'e breath screened, regardless of who/what caused crash.

[peasea]

[QUOTE=scumdog;1037010]

I'm with Patrick - you crash? - your'e breath screened, regardless of who/what caused crash.

Yup, that'll give a reasonably fair indication of who's at fault, surely? The likelihood of a sober driver cruising along and hitting a drunk have to be pretty slim, right?

[scumdog]

[QUOTE=peasea;1037069]

Yup, that'll give a reasonably fair indication of who's at fault, surely? The likelihood of a sober driver cruising along and hitting a drunk have to be pretty slim, right?

VERY, ferkin VERY slim.