Who gives way to whom?

**Ixion** · 19th May 2009, 22:09

I think you are misinterpreting the words "centre line" in the road code. It doesn't mean a hypothetical "centre" of the road. It means an actual painted line on the road.

If there is a continuous white line painted on the road (and I am not sure but I thnk it must be continous, solid, not dashed - all I have seen thus have been solid), then that has special significance. It means that the road is assumed to continue along that path , and the "corner" becomes a "curve"

You drawing is not clear because although it shows a line, it is not solid or continuous.

If there is NO continuous centre line painted on the road, then there are three roads. "Blue car road", "red car road", and "no car road". It is a T intersection and the right hand rule applies.

If there IS a continuous centre line , then there are only two roads. "Blue and red car road", which curves through 90 degrees, and "no car road" . Both the blue car and the red car are both travelling on "blue and red car road". The red car intends to turn off it , making a right turn into "no car road". And must give way to straight through traffic, which blue car is.

Beach Road in East Coast Bays has an actual example of this .

Your drawing needs clarification to make it clear if there is intended to be a continuous centre line or not. Remembering that "continuous centre line" means an actual physical painted line .

Incidentally this is the only situation that I can recall where a continuous line, as opposed to a dashed line, is significant.

**gwigs** · 19th May 2009, 22:26

red gives way

...it is if Im driving the blue car...unless its bigger than my 4x4...

**Skyryder** · 19th May 2009, 22:27

The give way sign suggests to me that both cars are entering a side road.

Both blue and red vehicle appear to be on the main road and this is suggestd by the give way sign. If this is indeed the case then red has the right of way as this vehicle is on blues right who must give way. If on the other hand red is on the side road and turning into the main road then blue has the right of way. So I'm not too sure it is the vehicle position but the road.

Skyryder

**steve_t** · 19th May 2009, 22:28

Red car gives way

**Ragingrob** · 19th May 2009, 22:29

Originally Posted by Ixion

No such thing in law as a main road or side road. They've not existed for over 60 years. Amazing how many people keep insisting on reinventing this archaic theory.

Question is , is there a continuous centre line ? Your sketch isn't quite clear. It appears that there is a continuous centre line around the curve . If so, the blue car is following the centr eline and has right of way. But if the line stops, then it is a T intersection.

The centre line is solid... But the damn blue car ain't going around that corner man! It's turning off the road into the road straight ahead! So the blue car is NOT following the centre line! Which I tried to explain in my first reply to you!

So... Who in your mind gives way? If you understand the picture better now.

**Ixion** · 19th May 2009, 22:36

Oh, I see what you mean now. I made the same mistake I think as Mr Noidy, I thought you meant the blue car intended to bear right into "red car road".

If both the blue and red car intend to go into "no car road", then blue car is making a left turn , and must give way.

**Ragingrob** · 19th May 2009, 22:40

Originally Posted by Ixion

Oh, I see what you mean now. I made the same mistake I think as Mr Noidy, I thought you meant the blue car intended to bear right into "red car road".

If both the blue and red car intend to go into "no car road", then blue car is making a left turn , and must give way.

Sweet

Lol Squiggles tells me I should've extended the blue car's arrow right over to that road

Paint with a touchpad is not easy guys!

Sweet well that's all cleared up then.

There are a few people who have said the red car, yet offered no reasoning... But I guess that makes sense lol!

**Skyryder** · 19th May 2009, 22:43

I had a bet bothways. Still got first place................

Skyryder

**Max Preload** · 19th May 2009, 22:44

Blue car gives way. Or at least SHOULD.

**FJRider** · 19th May 2009, 22:49

Originally Posted by Ixion

If both the blue and red car intend to go into "no car road", then blue car is making a left turn , and must give way.

I concur ... the blue car is effectively turning left.... thus, must give way to the red car.

**Jantar** · 19th May 2009, 22:51

Originally Posted by Max Preload

Blue car gives way. Or at least SHOULD.

That IS the way our road rules are written. Once again the laws of man and the laws of physics are in conflict as the natural laws of motion suggest that it is much more efficient for the blue car to continue straight ahead without giving way or chaging speed. That would cause neither car to lose any time, but if the blue car has to give way to the red car then everyone loses. (particularly the green car that isn't in the picture but is 2 seconds behind the blue car and doesn't have to give way to anyone as it slams into the red car crossing the centerline).

**FJRider** · 20th May 2009, 07:43

Originally Posted by Jantar

That IS the way our road rules are written. Once again the laws of man and the laws of physics are in conflict as the natural laws of motion suggest that it is much more efficient for the blue car to continue straight ahead without giving way or chaging speed. That would cause neither car to lose any time, but if the blue car has to give way to the red car then everyone loses. (particularly the green car that isn't in the picture but is 2 seconds behind the blue car and doesn't have to give way to anyone as it slams into the red car crossing the centerline).

But the Red car has to give way to the Green car, if the green car is not taking the same route as the Blue car. If the blue car has to wait for the Red, so will the Green.

**bane** · 20th May 2009, 08:02

Blue car gives way, as Red car is turning from the right (in respect of the blue car) - and blue car turning from left (in respect of red car).

This often confuses the general masses as most intersections of reasonable traffic density will be controlled via a give way (or even a stop sign) where the red car is sitting. Therefore Blue rarely has to give way.

Hitchers rule is the best one, you only have right of way when you are given it... especially if you are riding a motorbike....

**pzkpfw** · 20th May 2009, 08:43

Originally Posted by Ragingrob

Lol Squiggles tells me I should've extended the blue car's arrow right over to that road

Your blue car doesn't have its' left indicator on.

So red car will give way, thinking blue might be following the centre line and bearing right.

But blue won't turn, and will think red is "giving way" and go physically straight (a left turn off the road).

So they'll all carry on blissfully unaware of the rules.

---

I have a road like that near home. I indicate left to turn off the road (when I'm like that blue car). People at the give way tend to stop for me (for no reason). I think that they see my left indicator, equate it with "he's turning" and think I'm going to go "around the corner" (bearing right, following the centre line). How they think a left indicator means that, I don't know.

When I stop for the red car, they always wave at me like I've done them a favour.

When I am the red car, I damn well treat it as a stop sign, because plenty of clowns go screaming up that road (as blue car) with no idea they need to give way to me.

This is in Tawa, home of the indicate-right-when-going-"straight"-at-roundabouts people.

**Max Preload** · 20th May 2009, 09:12

The easiest way to deal with troublesome intersections like this when you're not completely aware of the GIVE WAY rule is to change it to a Y junction in your head to eliminate the tendancy to invent "the main road rule".

Originally Posted by pzkpfw

Your blue car doesn't have it's left indicator on.

Oh, it's on. It's just that it was in the off time of the flash when that hi-res image was captured.