Don't like this, much, either!

**Boob Johnson** · 31st July 2007, 01:34

Originally Posted by katman

Fuck you cockhead. I started by saying I was sorry to hear about his mate and then went on to make a general statement that I think too many motorcyclists refuse to see any fault in their own style of riding

Well your retort im sure will serve to have justified some responses to your original post im sure.

I think the point some are making katman is there is a time and a place for everything, this guy WAS the innocent victim in a senseless cagers moment of madness & you came across as a bit of a smart ass when it wasn't really the time or the place for it.

I had similar comments in my recent crash thread, some clown saying why did I grip the bars when I should of done this or that, blah blah. Having recently been on the receiving end of a fuckstick in a car I can sympathise with this guy, things happen quick out there on the road & we sometime don't want or need to hear "you should of done this or that" when the one making the comment doesn't know the full story.

**Brian d marge** · 31st July 2007, 02:27

SNNIFF ,,,I smell Red Rep being bandied about ... You lot KNOW ...I want ... Sling it my way I ll have the llot ,,, I even give green in exchange for red ......
anyway \100 worth .......

As a courier , for more years than i can count ,,( I get lost in the big numbers like 7 an 9 ) ..fully understand both sides , There is alway a loony on the road and they will get you when you least expect it ,,, So if not concentrating , make sure if it goes pear shaped you aint the one that has the problem ..

have a clear view of the road equal to your stopping distance ...stereotype like mad ... if its a pajero ,,its a soccer mum or testosterone ...

and take the man Juice and leave it at home .... I am guilty of doing exactly ( what a lucky man he was) doing exactly that ... incorrect road position ,, not really concentrating .. and pow ........scary moment

Couple interesting this I heard way back ,, they took 4 riders on Identical bikes ( not sure) and said go for it down these country lanes ( it was an Elglish bike mag back in about 92 ish

The winner

PC Plod on his BMW

the rest , a Noob , A dispatch rider and a Clubmans racer....

The last time I heard Plod gets a desk job and ( may even lose his Job ) if he has a bike accident ,,regardless of whose fault it is ( it does take 2 to have an accident )

When I ride in NZ ,,,I want a form filled in by the other road user ,,in triplicate AND signed by El presidente himself ,,before I m confident on what the other one is doing ,,,,They are just not trust worthy enough ..

Oh they can drive ,,, they have been racing for years ,,and the old mans old ute he used to race , so by default they are good drivers

I wonder how kiwi drivers would react, when the light changes green and the car in front doesnt move ,, they are watching a movie on the DVD and didnt notice ...

. here nothing ..maybe a small toot , and a flick of the hazards to say sorry ..... or a whole line of traffic stopping to let the car out of the gas station ......

Stephen

**Boob Johnson** · 31st July 2007, 03:44

Originally Posted by Brian d'marge

it does take 2 to have an accident

Really Stephen? So when a rider is WELL below the speed limit (bout 80 odd in a 100 zone) with his head light on during the day ambering along on a straight stretch of road, not tail gating or doing anything silly, minding his own business & some 18yr old girl licensed for 6 months pulls out with the biker being a mere few meters from the intersection he's partly to blame?

If im sounding a lil too specific it's because im describing my recent accident, or should I say hers!!!

It's easy to be cliché about it all Stephen, sometimes reality is a lil different

**Katman** · 31st July 2007, 08:17

Anyhow, all friendly banter aside

, my point is I've become somewhat inured to a lot of the tales of motorcycle accidents and near-misses simply because a large proportion of them may well not have happened had the motorcyclist been paying 110% concentration to what they were doing and been able to adequately read the situation. "The bloody driver said he didn't see me" could so often be answered by "did you see that the driver didn't appear to see you?" There's more to 'road-skills' then just being able to get your knee down in a corner. Peace, out.

**Edbear** · 31st July 2007, 09:26

Originally Posted by Grahameeboy

Is it...this Country has been brought up this way....ACC being a classic example...no compulsory vehicle insurance............."she'll be right has a lot to answer".......

LOL!! My comment was very firmly with tongue-in-cheek, my friend! Seems anytime one hears of accidents, injuries, assaults, anything adverse, it's never really the offender's fault, is it? There's always an excuse and a reason why it's really the victims fault because...

**Grahameeboy** · 31st July 2007, 09:33

Originally Posted by Edbear

LOL!! My comment was very firmly with tongue-in-cheek, my friend! Seems anytime one hears of accidents, injuries, assaults, anything adverse, it's never really the offender's fault, is it? There's always an excuse and a reason why it's really the victims fault because...

I did wonder but decided to make the comment anyway as it is a fact..........

**Brian d marge** · 31st July 2007, 12:27

Originally Posted by Boob Johnson

Really Stephen? So when a rider is WELL below the speed limit (bout 80 odd in a 100 zone) with his head light on during the day ambering along on a straight stretch of road, not tail gating or doing anything silly, minding his own business & some 18yr old girl licensed for 6 months pulls out with the biker being a mere few meters from the intersection he's partly to blame?

If im sounding a lil too specific it's because im describing my recent accident, or should I say hers!!!

It's easy to be cliché about it all Stephen, sometimes reality is a lil different

Yes i saw the damage you did , really hope you are mending well Technically no the other party in that case was to blame But it still took two and you are hurting ( and the damage to the bike looks like it hurt ,,big ouchy )

The same accident happened to me years ago on a Cb360 ,, old lady panicked when she heard the bike put her foot on the gas instead of the brake ,and shot into the middle of the intersection ... ..Now If I see a driver who I dont trust ,, I will Narrow the angle , ( anything below 45 deg you will glance off the car , ,,,Have an escape route..ie move over to the other side , and start slowing , changing down ,,,, I really dont trust em they could have a tea party for all I care , I dont want to be anywhere near them

There was one accident I read about , that shoots my argument int he foot , there was a dip in the road and the poor fella saw a clear road ahead pulled out to overtake and was collected by the car hidden in the dip ...( think I know that bit of road and yes it would look like its a straight and clear road , )... when I overtake I do it on the centre line the other side of the road is nomans land and a mighty scary place ......

Stephen

**KATWYN** · 31st July 2007, 13:24

Originally Posted by katman

"The bloody driver said he didn't see me" could so often be answered by "did you see that the driver didn't appear to see you?" :

I know what you mean I have tried and tried over the years to convince myself that a lot of near misses or accidents are the riders fault and could be avoided -to justify my riding and feel better about being in control and safe. But sadly after 10 years continuous riding and experience it is so not the case.

The bottom line is, despite our motorcycling skill levels, we are all sittting ducks out on the road - someone will always invite us into their accident

(btw, at 16 years old in the mid 80's the first bike I ever rode was a Katana 1100..awesome bike, way ahead of its time )

**Boob Johnson** · 31st July 2007, 14:16

Originally Posted by Brian d'marge

Yes i saw the damage you did

Stephen I think you need to choose your wording a lil better mate. I didn't do any damage, she caused it all. Take her out of the equation & I wouldn't have gone under the knife, simple at that.

Originally Posted by Brian d'marge

Technically no the other party in that case was to blame, but it still took two

Technically? Still took two? Are you for real? Again man your wording needs a bit more attention. She pulled out in front of me METERS from the intersection, I had no chance to even THINK about scrubbing off any speed/swerving, it happened THAT quick. Im not to blame in ANY WAY SHAPE OR FORM! Stick your chicle's where the sun don't shine lol.

By your reckoning when we approach a T intersection on the open road should be slow RIGHT down to 20Km's just in case an 18yr old has a laps in concentration?

There is no "technically" or "it takes two" in my case. I was minding my own busines doing EVERYTHING correctly, even going well under the 100Km/h speed limit, the ambulance staff estimate my speed at between 70/80Km/h, front head light on, wasn't tail gating blah blah blah.

So excuse me if I TOTALLY disagree with your lil cliché

**Brian d marge** · 31st July 2007, 15:22

Originally Posted by Boob Johnson

Stephen I think you need to choose your wording a lil better mate. I didn't do any damage, she caused it all. Take her out of the equation & I wouldn't have gone under the knife, simple at that.

So excuse me if I TOTALLY disagree with your lil cliché

Yes sorry after reading it again I meant the same thing ,,but yes she did it all. You may be getting hung up on the blame thing
( and I dont want to go into you should j\have dont this ,and this )

I am in no way saying the accident is your fault or anything like that

but My accident was the same intersection . green for me all cars sitting at their respective red .... I arrive at the intersection , slightly slower than you around 60 to 70 kph ..and bang her mini shoots into the intersection and pow ( just as you said no time to react )

She lurched off down the road till a car cut her off and she returned ..tshe said she pushed the accelerator instead of the brake

I was no way at fault , She caused the accident It took me a couple of months to walk properly again

So yes on an open road if I think the situation calls to stop ..yes I stop

What ever reason we disagree thats ok . this is just my way of avoiding a similar situation ,,,

but thinking back ..the car driver has always done something ,,, turned their head to watch on coming traffic even if it was a quick glance

All my accidents have been caused by Me..

2 fast for the condition ( thinking I am valetino rossi )

Day dreaming and not having a escape route ..cause I have been distracted

and one I didnt see you mate , she turn in front , completely clear road just me and her , 2am in the morning .... but yes ,,black leather jacket , boots and jeans and a pissy 1974 XL250 headlamp so to be honest she probably didnt see me ( 3 months in a wheel chair for me )

So once again sorry bout the wording .. dont think I am blaming ... but my comments arnt wildly plucked from the either. it is what I find works for me when I ride and I am to old and set in me ways to change now !!!

Good luck in the healing, hope it all comes right please disagree again , cause maybe some one is reading this and may debate and become a better rider because of it

Stephen