Staggered formation is wrong

[NordieBoy]

Ahhh...

Enforce, pack, know your place, road captain, sergents...

We can think for ourselves thanks (Apart from the idiots of course).

[bikemike]

Some folks should maybe get the train.

[warewolf]

if the following vehicles are passing the group your either riding too slowly or driving out west.

Who said anyone was passing? What I was suggesting was to leave room for passing... there is a legal limit to the number of vehicles travelling in convoy. For large trucks, it is one, IIRC.

[warewolf]

Enforce, pack, know your place, road captain, sergents...

That's not a ride, it's a parade.

I only do parades for charity, certainly not when I'm out for a ride. And even then, I'll still think for myself, thankyouverymuch.

[EnzoYug]

Staggered formation increases the area of the road that a motorcyclist can see directly in front of them. Following distance is importance but has nothing on reaction time when it comes to crash avoidance.

Most of the guys/girls I've ridden with understand two things:
1- you should never be in another bikes manoeuvring envelope.
2- When approaching a corner the group "brakes" formation and takes the line appropriate.
Anyone who cant follow these unspoken rules doesn't ride with me, no matter the formation.

[James Deuce]

It's cool on a motorway or straight open highway.

Just not in the twisties.

Riding in a staggered formation shouldn't be an absolute though. If you're trapped by riders around you and have no space to move, then you're all riding far too close, which often happens with the staggered formation if people don't pay close attention to speed and following distance.

No riding tip or observation is a rule, there are always times when you need to do something out of the norm and thy brain should be flexible enough to cope if need be.

[Ixion]

all I can comment is, from riding staggered formation in the 80's with as many a 90 bikes!
With a road captain setting the pace, sergents taking care of the center, and Tail end charlies at the end,
I can remember moving large , controlled numbers of riders in staggered formation without problems from Invercargill to the Cape and everywhere inbetween! Minimum fuss, max distance covered, Know your place!
The biggest problem I see is that you fuckers dont like having somebody in the front leading telling you what speed to STAY AT!!!
There an is attitude that that is comming out in these posts, EGO!
To ride in a staggered formation, you need to enforce ALL members of the pack to ride the right way, enforce rules that EVERYBODY sticks with.
I hear that KB'ers have a bad rep for group rides, too many fall off!
only because your fuckin egos dont let somebody be in control!
..

Yep. Tight stagger, 50, 60 bikes in formation for miles on end at 60mph.

It's not hard. You have your place. Mark your wheelman (the guy in front of you and to the right or left) , you keep in formation with him. You don't overtake unless he does and he won't unless the whole group does, and it won't unless the ride captain decides to. All you do is make sure you keep your place realtive to him.

It's all about self control and discipline. And if you don't have it, the Sargeant at Arms will explain it to you. You don't want that, you REALLY don't want that.

[CookMySock]

But you are compromised because you now only have half a lane to play in[...]

You must be able to maintain your bike in half a lane.. or less, or the rest of the group will be keeping a very wary eye on you. Practice doing this with tiny countersteer pushes.

This is also a good way to practice countersteering since you are doing it continuously instead of just in corners. Push to steer only. If you get a fright and want out, well you are in a straight line so its no biggy. It feels very wrong to begin with but then that godlike feeling starts to set in as you master it. Nice.

Thats what I'm trying at the moment anyway

DB

[McJim]

Another point about staggered formation is from the point of view of a car waiting at an intersection who looks right - sees a bike, looks left, the way is clear, the bike passes his nose and he pulls out not realising Warewolf and his buddies were riding in single file to hide their numbers, takes out riders 2 and 3 coz the 2 seconds they left between them and the rider in front wasn't enough to stop in before hitting a completely stationary object.....

[scumdog]

I mostly ride staggered formation - 99% the same distance behind the bike on front that I would be if actually in line directly behind it.

Gives even more fresh air between me and the bike on front - and hitting fresh air hasn't done me much harm so far.

[FROSTY:Me]

No rule should ever be an apsolute. I prefer the staggered formation for big group rides in the city

[Subike]

Another point about staggered formation is from the point of view of a car waiting at an intersection who looks right - sees a bike, looks left, the way is clear, the bike passes his nose and he pulls out not realising Warewolf and his buddies were riding in single file to hide their numbers, takes out riders 2 and 3 coz the 2 seconds they left between them and the rider in front wasn't enough to stop in before hitting a completely stationary object.....

A very good point
two headlights are easier to see than one

[GrayWolf]

May I add a small 'thought' here?
Fundamentaly, the way of driving or riding that is taught to young/new drivers/riders is a quite basic, easily 'processed' no brainer road position. EG: keep to the left of the lane. Which anyone who has read the English Police roadcraft manual (the system) or attended advanced riding courses, know is totaly wrong as far an visibility is concerned when approaching a left hand bend. However, would you want a new/inexperienced rider attempting to use the lane fully while still learning 'road skills' and now have to anticipate white line crossers as well?
I can see the 'merit' in both arguements visa vi distance and road position. I think if analysed, most riders would 'stagger' on the open road, but if driving to the 'system', will naturaly 'single file' through bends.

Just My two pennorth.
the Gray One

[jonbuoy]

Don't see a problem on a straight road, can't see how it would work in the corners - theres only one proper line through a left or right hander and you'll both be wanting it, so you'll be inline anyway. 2 seconds for "enthusiastic" riding is a bit close. my 10c.

[Subike]

staggered riding around corners is easy
If you are riding with in the leagl speed limit, the a large majority of the main roads have sweaping bends that heave recomended safe speeds of 65kph average.If you are staggered riding formation,from 65kph corners and up you should be able to maintain position in eithere in inner or outer track of the left lane, without compromising your position, the riders infront and inmediatly behinds position either.Coordernating and control.
As far as single lane ridding with 2 second spacing an the open road.
One word
CRAP
Dangerous, cant see anything infront of the rider in front of you,cant be on the watch for cages, again view blocked, cant work out passing distances, again clear view blocked.
Tried it today with 10 other rides
Not a comfortable way of pack riding
Thus CARP