Wire (cheese cutter) barriers

[sunhuntin]

The worst use of cheesecutter (I think) in the Greater Wellington region is on SH58 -- the Haywards Hill road, where it is used as a median barrier on a stretch of narrow road with off-camber corners and an extremely marginal road surface.

do you mean the actual hill, or the road that runs along the water? been a year since i was over that way, and my memory has faded somewhat.

[swbarnett]

The life of one motorcyclist is far cheaper than the lives of 10 car drivers. Simple fact.

Another fact is that this, although true, is discrimination.

The effort in this situation needs to be implementing the safest possible option (eg the idea about sleeves).

If there is no room to install a barrier properly one should not be installed. They need to pull finger and widen the road first.

[swbarnett]

Murder requires intent. The road designers and builders have a genuine intention to improve road safety. It is ignorance that is the problem.

What about manslaughter then?

[Colapop]

do you mean the actual hill, or the road that runs along the water? been a year since i was over that way, and my memory has faded somewhat.

On the Hutt Valley side of the hill. As you come over the rise at the top of the hill heading down to the Hutt Valley past the substation.

[sunhuntin]

On the Hutt Valley side of the hill. As you come over the rise at the top of the hill heading down to the Hutt Valley past the substation.

ok, thanks for that. i hate that road with a vengence... went over it last year and damn near didnt make it out the other end. damn cagers who tailgate an l plater on a new road, fucktards. never again [cept as pillion or in a car]

[limbimtimwim]

do you mean the actual hill, or the road that runs along the water? been a year since i was over that way, and my memory has faded somewhat.

It is discussed/advertised here: http://www.mwhglobal.co.nz/Files/TMW03-Chisnall.pdf .

If you read between the lines, they kinda own up to breaking the standard ('Agreed in consultation with Transit'), cost cutting and experimenting on us ('first “retrofit” installation on a 3-lane highway').

[motorbyclist]

For the record, the police has not complete the investigations. I suspect they are basing off my approximate estimation in my statement to them for their estimate. (I was the single witness to the incident)

can you say what you saw or the speed involved, or should we wait for the police report?

[motorbyclist]

When was this interview on TV3 last night, has anybody got a link to it?

http://tv3.co.nz/VideoBrowseAll/Nati...ID=37392#video

Was on the 6pm News

that was on a while ago....

[motorbyclist]

Motorcycling safety consultant Allan Kirk told the New Zealand Herald the wire barriers could be justified in some places, such as the narrow coastal highway north of Wellington, but it was "utterly unforgivable" of Transit to install them where there was room for steel ones.


wasn't he just saying a few days ago that there was nothing wrong with them!?

[candor]

Are others now unable to ride/drive by graters without getting transfixed?

The Haywards grater is quite easy to visualise something nasty happening.

Idea - chunk it - focus efforts on one or two obvious high risks to get covers. Like Rangiriri or Haywards. And in heavy density Auckland motorway.

Find out how many bikes travel that road/s chosen daily then ask Transit how many skewered bikers are built in to its projections along with how many likely to be saved from head ons.

Once it's achieved in one place you know the hurdles of approvals etc are overcome, and it makes for a good focus on the goal initially as well, rather than having vague nationwide goals.

[motorbyclist]

exactly: if we go asking for some extreme measures like banning them, we wont get anywhere

[sunhuntin]

Are others now unable to ride/drive by graters without getting transfixed?

The Haywards grater is quite easy to visualise something nasty happening.

Idea - chunk it - focus efforts on one or two obvious high risks to get covers. Like Rangiriri or Haywards. And in heavy density Auckland motorway.

Find out how many bikes travel that road/s chosen daily then ask Transit how many skewered bikers are built in to its projections along with how many likely to be saved from head ons.

Once it's achieved in one place you know the hurdles of approvals etc are overcome, and it makes for a good focus on the goal initially as well, rather than having vague nationwide goals.

i cope alright with the welly coastal road in daylight, but the one time ive done it at night, i was a nervous wreck, crawling at about 50k and as far left as i could get. same goes for the kaitoke ones and others ive seen... they are ok in daylight, but bad at night, due to the lack of reflectors. you know they are there, but not where!

[Drum]

.... The life of one motorcyclist is far cheaper than the lives of 10 car drivers. Simple fact.......

Actually, the cost of a fatal motorcycle crash is similar to that of a fatal car crash, it's just that there are many more cars than bikes.

[Ocean1]

i cope alright with the welly coastal road in daylight, but the one time ive done it at night, i was a nervous wreck, crawling at about 50k and as far left as i could get. same goes for the kaitoke ones and others ive seen... they are ok in daylight, but bad at night, due to the lack of reflectors. you know they are there, but not where!

Yes, most of Haywards hill is unlit, and the rest poorly, the Buell's headlight's aren't great, but they're at least average. It really surprised me how little of the barrier I could see when heading down into the valley, and that little reduces to nill in the lights of oncoming traffic. Scary. The disturbing thing is that reflectors would make a big difference at very little extra cost, and yet they're not fitted...

[Usarka]

Another fact is that this, although true, is discrimination.

Actually, the cost of a fatal motorcycle crash is similar to that of a fatal car crash, it's just that there are many more cars than bikes.

I'll rephrase; a median barrier may save ten lives and cause one death. that's a net gain of nine lives saved. (numbers made up obviously, but you get the picture).

the economics of removing a barrier to save that one life do not make sense and would (IMHO) be a futile and counter productive argument.