Gravel is scary and terrible - how to navigate?

**mister.koz** · 13th October 2009, 10:46

Appologies if this is a repost - i did search!

So, I know a few guys who are quite uncomfortable about gravel, hard packed or not. In my experience (short-ish) I have found the following advice from other riders really useful when navigating gravel patches, please ammend and correct me if needed.

Disclaimer - this is not an epitome, just a collection of advice I have been given - riders should try and find their way rather than follow all advice like sheep.

Keep your weight low & central by putting more weight on the pegs and leaning back a bit - don't stand up totally unless you are on a motard
Keep your speed down and your bike in the lower rev range (2nd gear at 20 - 30 on my zx10r works nicely on all sorts of gravel assofar)
Wind your steering damper softer a click or two if its set really hard
Don't lean, put pressure on the pegs and steer slightly - you may see people spinning the back wheel to turn.. all power to them but my bike is quite shiny so I aint trying that.
Keep all actions small, especially the brakes & throttle.
Do not use the front brake unless you are in a hard-packed spot, use engine breaking where possible or the rear brake - both really smoothly
Aim for car tracks where the loose portions of the gravel are pushed aside.
If you are riding the clutch you are probably going too slow, change down a gear and keep a constant speed - preferably not 1st on a sports bike.
Scan ahead for tire tracks and loose patches and pick your lines early.
Always stay on your side of the road, brakes are relatively useless on gravel so oncoming traffic wont stop
Keep your distance from other vehicles front, back & sides - if you are worried about holding people up, pull over and let them pass - 1st place doesn't look as good with torn-up fairings
RELAX and take it easy, loosely packed gravel is normally quite short and hard-packed gravel is allot easier than it looks

After gravel patches I always wait for a clear and straight portion of road where I can carefully scrub the tires of dust/mud by counter-steering inside my lane. I've almost backed a bike through a corner because of left-over mud on the rear from a gravel patch that was wet...

**vifferman** · 13th October 2009, 10:55

Hmmmm....
Hhmmmmmmmmmmmmmm....

Yes, yess... it all looks relatively good, but I've found that my bike at least works better on gravel with some speed up, as it lightens the front, and you actually get a little more control at speed. As for braking, I've got DCBS, so I found that I can just brake with the rear pedal, and get pretty good retardation (helps that I'm a retard).

**george formby** · 13th October 2009, 11:04

My mate has to ride his fireblade on 2k's of thick gravel just to get to tarmac everyday. the road is windy with tight, blind corners & the clear tyre tracks disappear into thick gravel drifts. He reckons he sits at about 20kmh and the biggest thing is slowing early for corners & keeping a steady throttle on the loose stuff. Staying relaxed & letting the bike move is vital.
I popped round to see him on my TDM t'other day & loved the gravel even though the bike is well over 200kg's. It was comfortable at over 60kmh in places & drifted really well on the throttle. I was very suprised at how hard I could brake on the loose stuff, I tried it on the straights just to see how much if any grip I had & with the bike straight it took a fair handful to lock the front wheel. The rear locked up at the slightest touch. I avoided braking in the corners though....
I would say my bike is 90% road byassed, road tyres ( 18" BT021 front) softly sprung & feels ok when I stand up. It feels bloody big & heavy to begin with though.
Good post.

**Transalper** · 13th October 2009, 11:19

If you've learned how to apply the brakes correctly then gravel isn't much different to wet seal as far as stopping goes.
The application is similar as are the results, of course a wee bit more finesse may be required.
The front brake is still much more effective at slowing/stopping you on gravel than the back one.
BUT if you haven't learnt how to apply them properly you will most likely lock the front and drop the beast, in which case it's time to book in and get some professional advanced lessons as you apparently don't realise how much you actually don't know. (when I say 'you' I'm speaking generally to anyone in need)

I used to travel near highway speeds on straight gravel roads with my CBR1000f and other road bikes when I had them. Of course I did and do slow more for the shingle bends.

**Shadowjack** · 13th October 2009, 11:24

Oohh, gravel...dry, dusty, gravel. Love the stuff! Fishing rods and camping gear. Motu River Valley, Waikaremoana, any of the South Island high country lakes.
Trail-bikes, pah! - the fun comes trying to make a big-ish roadie do it. TDM's are all-roaders - well, mine is...
The answer is in the tyres - I am running an E07 rear and soon-to-be a Sirac T65 on the front and it's all good. Folks occasionally question the sanity of such behaviour, though.

**mister.koz** · 13th October 2009, 11:26

Thanks guys

I have some mates who take their sports bikes through loose gravel roads at 2 or even 3 times the speed I would, it really does come down to your experience!

**oldrider** · 13th October 2009, 11:47

You will generally encounter (at least) some road works somewhere in your travels!

Learn to handle the vagaries of broken (less than perfect) surfaces.

It shouldn't matter about whatever style or type of bike you are riding!

Make these conditions your friend, rather than your enemy.

Don't let other riders influence you, ride to survive and arrive alive, it's much more fun that way!

**mister.koz** · 13th October 2009, 11:51

Originally Posted by oldrider

You will generally encounter (at least) some road works somewhere in your travels!

Learn to handle the vagaries of broken (less than perfect) surfaces.

It shouldn't matter about whatever style or type of bike you are riding!

Make these conditions your friend, rather than your enemy.

Don't let other riders influence you, ride to survive and arrive alive, it's much more fun that way!

Couldn't have said it better, i only add:

If you aren't having fun then you shouldn't be doing it.

**george formby** · 13th October 2009, 11:57

Originally Posted by leadon

Oohh, gravel...dry, dusty, gravel. Love the stuff! Fishing rods and camping gear. Motu River Valley, Waikaremoana, any of the South Island high country lakes.
Trail-bikes, pah! - the fun comes trying to make a big-ish roadie do it. TDM's are all-roaders - well, mine is...
The answer is in the tyres - I am running an E07 rear and soon-to-be a Sirac T65 on the front and it's all good. Folks occasionally question the sanity of such behaviour, though.

Do you post on Carpe-TDM too?

**Shadowjack** · 13th October 2009, 16:20

Originally Posted by george formby

Do you post on Carpe-TDM too?

I do contribute on the odd occasion on Carpe-TDM - under a different tag - I may have to rationalise.

**Zuki lover** · 13th October 2009, 16:29

Interesting reading material, but you sound like p'dath (sorry mate)

When riding on shingle, all you gotta remember is that wherever the front goes, the back will follow and if you lose

control, then give a bit of power

and she'll come right.

Nothing to be scared about - shingle is all fun. the more you do on it, quite clearly, the better you get

**cheshirecat** · 13th October 2009, 16:50

I hit some really interesting gravel exiting the Homer Tunnel last year. Dark into bright light and nobody told me nobblies and a dirty great search light are needed for that tunnel. Transit NZ had just resealed and covered with that ball bearing stuff we all appreciate. A car ahead rolled so even the cagers became cautious. Dropped into second and kept the speed down to 20/30k. I used slight presure on the rear brake enough to kill the wheels inertia and tried to work the brake against the engine slightly so the engine was doing the real braking. This was really important. The kind transit NZ workers waved me into the opposite lane which was slightly better but didn't do much for the oncoming traffic who were obivously unaware of the aforementioned instructions.
They should put how to deal with Transit NZ's roading attempts into the bike test instead of how to ride over that piece of wood nonsense.

**FJRider** · 13th October 2009, 16:58

Originally Posted by cheshirecat

I hit some really interesting gravel exiting the Homer Tunnel last year. Dark into bright light and nobody told me nobblies and a dirty great search light are needed for that tunnel.

And .... don't forget the rain in there too ....

Many a biker has ridden into that tunnel with the sunnies still on ...

**mister.koz** · 13th October 2009, 17:00

Originally Posted by Zuki lover

Interesting reading material, but you sound like p'dath (sorry mate)

When riding on shingle, all you gotta remember is that wherever the front goes, the back will follow and if you lose

control, then give a bit of power

and she'll come right.

Nothing to be scared about - shingle is all fun. the more you do on it, quite clearly, the better you get

d'path?

Gravel doesn't worry me too much, just thought i would put all i learned in one place. Perhaps it will help someone

**BMWST?** · 13th October 2009, 17:23

gravel...a lot is in the mind.
Was going to pick a up a tag one cold dark night and went up a road unknown to me....was a narrow road so was keeping left and or straightlining as required.I thought...hmm i think i have a front wheel puncture..then realised the raod in my headlight was grey/brown i was on a gravel road going my normal road speed!