We are losing the battle to ACC

**taff1954** · 13th November 2009, 20:29

Originally Posted by Hanne

Personally I reckon it is encounters like that that will really have most effect on getting public onside. This is the personal interaction stuff, the stuff people remember becasue it puts a face to things, not just 'big bad bikers'. Sometimes you don't quite realise how much progress you have made, but the most effective things take time for the quiet groundswell to get noticed. Far better take this approach now that just a flash - in -the - pan huge angry knee jerk etc reaction that is forgotton in a week.

So talk to people, might not seem like much but if everyone talks then word of mouth can go a long way.

Hanne is right. One on one contact works. Since this news broke a month ago, every conversation I've got into over the subject, bar one - a little old lady who thinks that nice Mr Smith would never lie to us - has been in our favour. And as time has moved on, so more and more are either asking the who's next question, or questioning the ulterior motive. I've had a local dairy owner ask if he can do anything to help - he can see the writing's on the wall for our no-fault compensation scheme. Since my name got splattered over the front page of the local paper last week following the ride in New Plymouth, I've been asked almost every day at work, how's the protest going, can you win? Slowly but surely, there is indeed a groundswell of public support coming from middle NZ.

**taff1954** · 13th November 2009, 20:31

Originally Posted by idleidolidyll

we're not in Britain

when did you last see a cop pull over ANYTHING for this

besides, it would be vvveeerrryyy eeeaaasssyy ttooo ssslllooowwwlllyyy pppaasss eeeaaaccchhh oootthheeerrr.........aagggaaiinnn annnddd aaggaaaaiiinn

About 6 months ago, SH3 just south of Hawera. He reckoned I was holding up traffic in the truck I was driving. And I was, not deliberately, I just couldn't see anywhere safe to pull over.

**NighthawkNZ:Me** · 13th November 2009, 20:36

Originally Posted by BMWST?

thats illegall.Keep left unless passing....

If there is enough on the slow ride that is easy to counter act... left lane goes a 60kph, right lane at 70kph

As the faster lane gets to the front you change lanes to the left lane and back to 60kph. when you are last bike on the left you slowly pull out to over take at 70kph

then no law is broken. For it to work though every one needs to play the part and would work better if there are a few hundred bikes doing it

**Sis** · 13th November 2009, 20:57

In all my years of riding bikes, I have found us as a be very independant opiniated bunch of New Zealanders.
And here we are all pulling together to fight these injustices! Bloody Brilliant!

This has got ACC and National worried. Otherwise why had the ACC put the quarter page advert in the New Zealand Herald recently?

We need to keep up the pressure and have several steps of action lined up in advance.

At the moment, we have a lot of other road users on our side. Let's not destroy this. Perhaps some of our actions should involve those who want to protest with us but do not ride bikes? Some of us could go in disguise as car drivers, truck drivers etc. Then the government will have more trouble actually trying to single out motorbikes. Do you see where I am coming from?

**NighthawkNZ:Me** · 13th November 2009, 20:59

Originally Posted by Sis

We need to keep up the pressure and have several steps of action lined up in advance.

At the moment, we have a lot of other road users on our side. Let's not destroy this. Perhaps some of our actions should involve those who want to protest with us but do not ride bikes? Some of us could go in disguise as car drivers, truck drivers etc. Then the government will have more trouble actually trying to single out motorbikes. Do you see where I am coming from?

agreed

**idleidolidyll** · 13th November 2009, 20:59

Originally Posted by taff1954

About 6 months ago, SH3 just south of Hawera. He reckoned I was holding up traffic in the truck I was driving. And I was, not deliberately, I just couldn't see anywhere safe to pull over.

touche!

i was pulled over by plod when i was 16 for holding up traffic in henderson: strange thing was i was at the back of a row of tin tops and i was going their speed

i think it was about 1975 and that's funnily about the time i realised that plod and his masters didn't like bikers

**idleidolidyll** · 13th November 2009, 21:01

Originally Posted by Sis

In all my years of riding bikes, I have found us as a be very independant opiniated bunch of New Zealanders.
And here we are all pulling together to fight these injustices! Bloody Brilliant!

This has got ACC and National worried. Otherwise why had the ACC put the quarter page advert in the New Zealand Herald recently?

We need to keep up the pressure and have several steps of action lined up in advance.

At the moment, we have a lot of other road users on our side. Let's not destroy this. Perhaps some of our actions should involve those who want to protest with us but do not ride bikes? Some of us could go in disguise as car drivers, truck drivers etc. Then the government will have more trouble actually trying to single out motorbikes. Do you see where I am coming from?

nice ideas; like many, i also drive a tin top

some support in the form of cars and vans would provide bigger surfaces to stick banners on

this thread is coming along very well indeed

**idleidolidyll** · 13th November 2009, 21:04

Originally Posted by NighthawkNZ

If there is enough on the slow ride that is easy to counter act... left lane goes a 60kph, right lane at 70kph

As the faster lane gets to the front you change lanes to the left lane and back to 60kph. when you are last bike on the left you slowly pull out to over take at 70kph

then no law is broken. For it to work though every one needs to play the part and would work better if there are a few hundred bikes doing it

aye, that'd probably work

**FastBikeGear** · 13th November 2009, 21:09

Any protest that is designed to hinder or annoy Joe Public will destroy the very suport form tehm that we need.

If a time comes when we need to up the anti there are legal things that we can do that will hit ACC and not annoy the public.

And the time is not even ready for these kinds of actions yet!

**idleidolidyll** · 13th November 2009, 21:10

it aint about the ACC; it's about the politicians behind the ACC changes

**Ixion** · 13th November 2009, 21:14

Someone mentioned to me recently that the government doesn't really care much if ordinary people are inconvenienced, or their lives disrupted.

They do care very much if the operations of corporations, especially big multinational ones are disrupted.

And Joe Q doesn't really care all that much about corporations being disrupted.

And, if Joe Q's domestic harmoney is disrupted by someone, his reaction is to get pissed off and call on the government to "pass a law against it" - the boi-racers being a good example.

Whereas if corporations are disrupted, they look at the effect on their profits. If the cost of giving the disrupters what they want (especially if the cost is borne by the government) is less than the cost of disruption they will say "give them what they want". They are more pragmatic than Joe Q.

I do not condone that sort of thinking . It is quite wrong. Moreover it would , fortunately, probably be impossible to think of actions that would disrupt the activities of corporations (especially government owned ones)

**retro asian** · 13th November 2009, 21:53

Help fight the ACC advertising campaign: forward the "ACC Lies to NZ" viral video (link in my signature) to everyone you know. Post it/share it on your Facebook/BeBo/Twitter/Myspace pages.... do whatever it takes to spread it around!

**candor** · 14th November 2009, 13:08

Idea.

Switch the main theme of protest. Do not make it about bike charge hikes.

Make it about the broader issue of ACC becoming risk related as allowed for in the ACC amendment bill - a necessity to be passed current form before they can raise your charges, as I understand it. No wonder they're sitting under urgency with the biker blow torch under them.

Kiwis love the no fault thingy so make the ride against that bill. That is the headline - bikers fight shift to risk based premiums - a possible end to rugby and use of jap crap..., after all you all drive cars and trucks as well so you can be motorists representing us all, who just happen to be the first hit test case of motorcyclists.

**Ixion** · 14th November 2009, 21:56

Originally Posted by candor

Idea.

Switch the main theme of protest. Do not make it about bike charge hikes.

Make it about the broader issue of ACC becoming risk related as allowed for in the ACC amendment bill - a necessity to be passed current form before they can raise your charges, as I understand it. No wonder they're sitting under urgency with the biker blow torch under them.

Nope. Amendment bill doesn't deal with levies. Theya re set entirely by Ministerial discretion (Well, cabinet also has to agree I think). But def no legislative changes needed.

We are morphing in the other changes a bit, and pushing the "Who's next" message.

(EDIT: There is an indirect connection though. The best avenue for levies containment (and Ministerial face saving) is the extension fo the funding of the tail from 2014 to 2019. That is part of the Bill.

So until the bill passes the Nickster can't really finalise the levies - he doesn't want to set them at the present high rate - I'm talking all levies here not just ours - and to set them at a lower rate based on the assumption that the extension will pass would be a risky thing.

But, he HAS to confirm the levies (all, not just motorcehicle) by March
)