Announcement on ACC funded $2m scheme

[scracha]

There has been transparency ever since the levies went up....there has been no closed doors and no secrets...its all public knowledge.
As well as the NUMEROUS times we have posted updates and information on Kiwibiker....
But then again I suppose us who have been sharing the information are all just too keen to feed at the trough......... after all thats what the average KBer seems to think of us despite the ammout of very public information on the whole process being right there to read on ACCs website

Prior to the "bikeoi" wot BRONZ allegedly arranged, there was fuck all mention of how BRONZ and numerous other "bikers interest" groups would roll over and take it from "the man" Nick Smith.

You (Stoney), Les and all the other motherfuckers at BRONZ can go and take a royal fuck to yourselves for selling us out.

[rustic101]

Wonder if all the red you'll get will be recanted when history proves you right.

Outa green.

I haven't received as much of a spanking for being honest (yet).

One thing is for sure though - The Govt have fragmented the motorcycle community...

[Katman]

The Govt have fragmented the motorcycle community...

Yeah, we were such a harmonious bunch of sportsbike, cruiser, jappa, harley, scooter riders before they got involved.

[riffer]

Prior to the "bikeoi" wot BRONZ allegedly arranged, there was fuck all mention of how BRONZ and numerous other "bikers interest" groups would roll over and take it from "the man" Nick Smith.

You (Stoney), Les and all the other motherfuckers at BRONZ can go and take a royal fuck to yourselves for selling us out.

All right then, how exactly did we sell you out? The levies were going to go up by $500+. Some of us protested, and gave up a HUGE amount of personal time and income to argue the case.

Yes the levies went up. But they were always going to. Even if motorcyclists started closing down cities around the country they still would have gone up. Despite the protestations of the cynics, I believe we had a part to play in reducing the amount they went up. For sure, all the people who came to the bikoi played a huge part, something those of us at BRONZ and other organisations will be eternally grateful for.

And we managed to get a certain amount of the increase split off from ACC and DEDICATED TO IMPROVING MOTORCYCLE SAFETY. And it is being run BY MOTORCYCLISTS FOR MOTORCYCLISTS.

If you think that continuing to protest after the government had passed that into law would have made a damn bit of different I suggest you are seriously politically naive.

Actually I'll make one correction. A huge amount of protest may have made a difference - the government may have decided to scrap the MSL and throw that $30 straight into the ACC coffers - and then do you know how much influence motorcyclists would have had over how ACC money is spent?

Absolutely fuck all.

You are certainly free to continue to protest. And BRONZ haven't given up on anything. We still want to see a reduction in the ACC levies, which we don't believe are justified. But the government are digging their heels in. They've said that unless we reduce the amount of money that ACC has to spend on motorcycle injuries those levies aren't moving.

You will observe that the levies aren't going up in the next financial year. Do you think that's because the government decided to be nice? Like hell.

So before you start calling my colleagues and I motherfuckers and accusing us of selling out have a little think about how much work we've put in, and how much we are continuing to put in. How much work are you doing to make an impact on the levies and motorcycling safety? And go back and have a read of the bikoi threads to find out what really happened. I'm getting a little over listening to people with no memories trying to rewrite history.

And as for fucking myself, I don't need to. I have a lovely wife to help me with that. In fact I think I'll go to bed now. I'll leave you to your hand.

[Squiggles]

Further to this licenced and registered riders are not the 'guilty culprits', a very large % of deaths are the direct result of unregistered, unlicensed riders, over powered for class of licences, or individuals on stolen bikes. Again the issue has been squarely label on the 90%ish of us that are law abiding.

Head in the sand or have you got a source to back up those claims?
Land Transport's 2010 Factsheet is here and it looks like the majority are average joes...

[StoneY]

You (Stoney), Les and all the other motherfuckers at BRONZ can go and take a royal fuck to yourselves for selling us out.

I made a promise to myself and a few close friends to not let this sort of personal insult on KB get to me anymore but you calling me and my hard working executive panel Motherfuckers is pathetic.

I and the people in BRONZ Wellington, as well as those who formed the Federation, have worked TIRELESSLY to ensure the MSL was not just absorbed into ACC's general accounts, and that AA never had a chance to manage it.
Not alone there either, WIMA, Ulysses, MNZ, HOG, Scootz NZ...all were involved and COMITTED to working on behalf of persons like you.

Work you're obviously too ignorant and lazy to take on for yourself.

Morons like you do NOTHING but bleat from the safety of thier computer desk and call other people who DO make a difference names, just because we couldnt gain 100% victory over the govt?
How much do you think it would have been without BIKEOI?

No wonder Les Mason stopped coming on KB...he must have put up with dickheads like YOU for years now... in all honesty I dont blame the man for leaving this place behind

You know who really sold US out Scratcha? Lazy pricks like YOU who just bleat and bitch about the 'unfair levies' while you do NOTHING at all to make a difference

You are simply pathetic
If your so concerned we let you down, go ride a motorcycle in the UK, or Germany, or Victoria...see how much THEY pay to use a motorcycle

[Kiwi675]

A simple statistic that should be looked at: Total motorcycle deaths 2009 - 48, 2010 -50. Farm bike deaths (included in the above figures) 2009 - 9, 2010 - 17. So, total deaths on road, 2009 - 39, 2010 - 33. Maybe means nothing, but worth thinking about where one of the major issues lie (especially given the huge increase in registered motorcycles in NZ.

[StoneY]

A simple statistic that should be looked at: Total motorcycle deaths 2009 - 48, 2010 -50. Farm bike deaths (included in the above figures) 2009 - 9, 2010 - 17. So, total deaths on road, 2009 - 39, 2010 - 33. Maybe means nothing, but worth thinking about where one of the major issues lie (especially given the huge increase in registered motorcycles in NZ.

One thing we must also remember (devils advocate and something we as a community need to assess properly) is the number of multiple motorcycle owners out there

I own 3 registered motorcycles
I am the ONLY rider of all 3
The motorcycle fleet HAS Trippled in size....has the number of RIDERS though????

I know at least 6 people with 3 or more bikes

And before I get called a sellout again folks, please DIGEST this information before screaming at me...
I am getting a little sensitive over the name slinging considering how much of my life this shit takes up

[Kiwi675]

So what has the change in registered "owners" been over the last ten year period?? Up. down, stagnant..............??

[bogan]

A simple statistic that should be looked at: Total motorcycle deaths 2009 - 48, 2010 -50. Farm bike deaths (included in the above figures) 2009 - 9, 2010 - 17. So, total deaths on road, 2009 - 39, 2010 - 33. Maybe means nothing, but worth thinking about where one of the major issues lie (especially given the huge increase in registered motorcycles in NZ.

how do you know farm bike deaths are in there? Our research has shown some farm bike injuries have ogt in with road bikes, but this is due to poor data gathered at the scene, and incomplete forms, the policy is to keep them separate. I would guess that for deaths they are even less prevalent as the more serious the accident, the better the data gathered at the scene should be, but that is just my guess.

One thing we must also remember (devils advocate and something we as a community need to assess properly) is the number of multiple motorcycle owners out there

I own 3 registered motorcycles
I am the ONLY rider of all 3
The motorcycle fleet HAS Trippled in size....has the number of RIDERS though????

I know at least 6 people with 3 or more bikes

True, one could counterargue that people lend out thier bikes (not me though!), or don't register em at all (no comment ).

I still doubt the root of this whole debacle is safety though, consider how many other people pass before their time, and whats being done about those various groups. And if it was safety, they wouldn't need to use shonky stats, surely?

[Kiwi675]

[QUOTE=bogan;1129967745]how do you know farm bike deaths are in there? Our research has shown some farm bike injuries have ogt in with road bikes, but this is due to poor data gathered at the scene, and incomplete forms, the policy is to keep them separate. I would guess that for deaths they are even less prevalent as the more serious the accident, the better the data gathered at the scene should be, but that is just my guess.

Fair point. I was under the impression that they were included but if the data collection is carried out correctly it should only be when a death occurs in a place with public access. However, two quad bike deaths in December were as a result of a farmer crashing through his fence and ending up on a road or rest area...............statistics............a wonderful thing!!

[Katman]

One thing we must also remember (devils advocate and something we as a community need to assess properly) is the number of multiple motorcycle owners out there

I own 3 registered motorcycles
I am the ONLY rider of all 3
The motorcycle fleet HAS Trippled in size....has the number of RIDERS though????

I know at least 6 people with 3 or more bikes

This thread here http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/sh...-currently-own shows there's a fair few of us with more than one.

[Kiwi675]

Number of new claims

July 2008 to June 2009

Public road – Motor Vehicle Account 4,479

Non-public road – Work Account 1,020

Non-public road – Earners’ and Non-Earners’ Accounts 4,699

All motorcycle-related claims 10,198


So over half all claims likely come from unregistered bikes. We all pay ACC levies on top of our Rego (whether Earner Levy or Work Account). The system remains inherently unfair and to claim it is the best available at the moment is just a cop-out.

[StoneY]

Morning Riffer,

Do you know, have you heard if individuals on the MSL group will be paid or receive any financial gain from the fund or Govt? If so how much, or is their involvement purely voluntarily out of love for the cause?

I only just caught this one Ken.
Late reply (but you could have called me to ask this one bro)

I do not get 'paid' for these meetings.
If the Government dept I am an employee of see's my time as valid use of taxpayer funds, I MAY get salary if I am lucky...somehow I doubt it will be the case.

All the Steering Group meetings I was paid a small fee for expenses, and got lunch.
The difference between my daily charge out then and my small fee for the meetings was $280.00 NZD

Now I am on salary back with a .govt.nz e-mail at work, I MIGHT get support from them in the form of getting salary pay.
Unlikely...totally different sector to ACC for me.

What councilors get:
We get our travel, and a feed.
I will lose about $210 per meeting day as it stands right now on my current earnings.

NO one is in this for the money.
NO ONE! We don't GET any

I cannot get BRONZ special treatment (in fact any BRONZ submission will be ultra scrutinized due to my role)
I cannot get a check made out to the local riding school, they too have to follow process.

[bogan]

Number of new claims

July 2008 to June 2009

Public road – Motor Vehicle Account 4,479

Non-public road – Work Account 1,020

Non-public road – Earners’ and Non-Earners’ Accounts 4,699

All motorcycle-related claims 10,198


So over half all claims likely come from unregistered bikes. We all pay ACC levies on top of our Rego (whether Earner Levy or Work Account). The system remains inherently unfair and to claim it is the best available at the moment is just a cop-out.

only the 4,479 are charged to the regos though, well thats their claim anyway, and I haven't seen anything that shows otherwise.