Haldanes is closed

[Madness]

Phew...no wonder my missus appreciates my adult size

Yeah, she mentioned that you're a tad self-conscious about that. Chin up, "big guy"

[Madness]

Some of the massive variations in price are driven by what mass (auto) production has done for production costs and the change in marketing models. Couple of decades ago there was a direct link between the cost of production and the market price, that's not true anymore. Partly because of natural barriers to entering the manufacuting game, and partly due to the advanced protectionist practices of the big players in modern markets.

That plug you're taliking about probably cost less than 20c to make, certainly less than a dollar. Add multiple distribution and tax costs and it should be available to you for $2. That's a reality only if you can access the manufacturer or his immediate distribution network, otherwise the price is driven solely by what you're prepared to pay. If you want a "fair market price" you've first got to know what shit costs to make, then you might want to start dismantling the monopolies that siphon off massive profits while doing nothing to contribute to the product's value.

I've been associated with manufacturing all my adult life, it's an absolute bitch knowing roughly what everything you buy cost to make while peeling off ten times that from your wallet. I've given up hope we'll ever get to call the big distributor's bluff.

You're absolutely correct.

As an aside, I worked for a multi-national tobacco company for a number of years. A pack of 20 cigarettes that retails for NZ $18.00 today costs around $0.35 to produce at the factory door. Quite un-related to the topic at hand but a startling situation, none the less.

[skippa1]

Good luck

They were pretty bare yesterday

They were closed but I talked with the landlord. He tells me that someone involved with Triumph NZ is taking over the shop and it will be open for business later this week. I note that all the Victories are gone except for one clients bike and all the Victory clothing has gone too. It was a shock to staff and the landlord by the sounds....hope it gets up and running again this week.....I need oil and havent investigated any alternatives yet.....

[PrincessBandit]

That's a real shame - got my bandit from them, also Balu's first Burgman. Unfortunately once Ramon left, we went to Colemans for our bike servicing.

I really liked the guys in Haldanes but I guess it's a sorry sign of the times. I wish them all well in whatever they do next.

[Big Dave]

Bummer. My dealings with the guys there were always pleasant. It's a storied name in racing and sponsorship too.
Stressful times for them and their customers.

I can't believe the difference over this side of the ditch. Went looking for a spare part for my Helmet this morning and the bike shops and the whole Moss St precinct was humming - people and motorcycles everywhere. Some manufacturers having record - like 'best ever' - months.

Strange that it is so different. Other day-to-day doesn't seem so.

[wysper]

You're absolutely correct.

As an aside, I worked for a multi-national tobacco company for a number of years. A pack of 20 cigarettes that retails for NZ $18.00 today costs around $0.35 to produce at the factory door. Quite un-related to the topic at hand but a startling situation, none the less.

I can see your point here. But on the other had, on that products journey to a much higher price (and I am not talking just ciggies here) it keeps many people in jobs.

Couriers, shipping compaines, advertising people, shop staff, importers, exporters and the list goes on.
So I would say it is a massive double edged sword. Chop out the myriad of middle men and sure the price is much cheaper but then the vast majority of your target market is unemployed and can't afford your widget. You have no back up if something happens to your widget. etc.

Just playing devils advocate here.

[Crasherfromwayback]

I can't believe the difference over this side of the ditch. Went looking for a spare part for my Helmet this morning and the bike shops and the whole Moss St precinct was humming - people and motorcycles everywhere. Some manufacturers having record - like 'best ever' - months.

Strange that it is so different. Other day-to-day doesn't seem so.

Yeah we can only hope it eventually flows on over here. I enjoyed my time working in that area when I was over there.

[Madness]

I can see your point here.

Yes, you can by the sounds of it. In this economic climate I'm quite happy to reasonably pay more locally than I could if I was to privately import because it's keeping the local market ticking over. Quite often buying locally also comes with additional benefits, including being covered by the Consumers Guarantee Act, being able to try items on/out before purchasing and having access to convenient exchange/swap should the need arise.

Again, for those who haven't read this thread in it's entirety, I'm not suggesting that this would have made a difference to Haldanes closing. It's simply an area we as consumers should be taking into consideration when buying bits for our bikes, etc. It's the thin end of the wedge but if we don't start supporting these businesses more they will soon all disappear.

I'm amazed at some of the responses in this thread to be honest. The general feeling out there suggests to me that retailers in this country are in for a tough ride ahead still and we're going to see a lot more closures & job losses this year. And some have the stupidity to label that progress.

[sugilite:Me]

The only thing that's simple here is people like you & your narrow-minded "all about me" mentality.

Time to stop denying it just so you feel better about having saved $100 on a pair of thermal underwear or summat at the expense of a New Zealanders job.

Matey.

I recently replaced all my old riding gear, my gloves and boots had holes in them, a flogged out helmet, my 25 year old back protector had cloth that looked like pantyhose holding it together and leathers that were very very tired. I'm going racing again (on the cheap in posties class) and needed new gear. I got very high quality gear, in some cases (gloves/back chest protector) the very best and it was not $100 that I saved, it was well over $1500. So when I'm on a tight budget, my personal safety is most definitely all about me. I'll be buggered if I will compromise on safety so I can possibly lie in a hospital bed with a shredded body because all I could afford at NZ bike shops is the lowest quality safety kit. I make no apologies by making it all about me in this regard. I understand why your upset, this importation mentality (for everything) is a world wide phenomenon that will only change from a Worldwide catastrophic event, not from me or other individuals compromising on their safety in a vain attempt to keep shops with out dated business models afloat.

[Ocean1]

I can see your point here. But on the other had, on that products journey to a much higher price (and I am not talking just ciggies here) it keeps many people in jobs.

Couriers, shipping compaines, advertising people, shop staff, importers, exporters and the list goes on.
So I would say it is a massive double edged sword. Chop out the myriad of middle men and sure the price is much cheaper but then the vast majority of your target market is unemployed and can't afford your widget. You have no back up if something happens to your widget. etc.

Just playing devils advocate here.

Good thing you're not doing it professionally.

The massive difference there is they're not actually doing anything to add value to the product. They're parasites. At least on the dole we could point at them and say: Oh look, a dole bludger!

[Madness]

I recently replaced all my old riding gear... it was not $100 that I saved, it was well over $1500

And good on you for saving so much, honestly. You obviously did your research before buying and that kind of disparity makes buying from overseas to good to overlook. Did you end up paying duties & GST?

this importation mentality (for everything) is a world wide phenomenon that will only change from a Worldwide catastrophic event, not from me or other individuals compromising on their safety in a vain attempt to keep shops with out dated business models afloat.

I'm certainly not asking anyone to compromise their safety and it's not about outdated business models. If the bike shops in this country are operating out of an outdated business model perhaps they should all just close up shop on Monday & be done with it. That's in effect what you're saying.

My point is about the trend to buy offshore having a negative effect on the available choice and competition in the local market place. The global nature of this phenomenon will have a disproportionate effect on our own local markets due to our isolation and small size compared to the Americas, Europe, Asia & even Australia.

It doesn't have to black & white people.

[sugilite:Me]

Did you end up paying duties & GST?

I did do a lot of research 1st. No I did not pay any duty or GST. I worked out the flat rate shipping of approx $23 nzd was a lot cheaper than paying duty, so I made several orders 7 days apart. Worked a charm.

If the bike shops in this country are operating out of an outdated business model perhaps they should all just close up shop on Monday & be done with it. That's in effect what you're saying.

Yes, sadly that is what I'm saying. That is not what I would choose, it is just an unfortunate statement on the current state of how things are. Not every shop will close, as not everyone buys their stuff off the net, and a by product of it all will be bike prices and servicing prices may have to go up to compensate for the lost revenue on accessories. I don't profess to have the answer to it all. I run an online business and the irony is I cannot survive selling my product in NZ as they do not have the same appreciation for my line as what overseas people do. I totally depend on overseas sales. I too have had the problem where suddenly entire lines become cheaper elsewhere and I cannot compete. I do not blame my customers for not buying from me, I just take it on the chin and drop that line and move on, innovate and so on.

My point is about the trend to buy offshore having a negative effect on the available choice and competition in the local market place. The global nature of this phenomenon will have a disproportionate effect on our own local markets due to our isolation and small size compared to the Americas, Europe, Asia & even Australia.

I do not entirely agree here, buying online overseas in fact opened up entire ranges that have always been unavailable to me at NZ shops. Swings and round abouts and all that. The online world now enables me as a buyer to be on equal footing with American and European customers. That was just a dream 10 years ago.

On a human level, I so agree with near everything you have to say, this "disposable" way of living is not sustainable, but we as individuals have to live in this framework until something major happens. I recycle all I can, and support NZ business when it is not contrary to my safety, but that is just a small drop in a very large ocean.
btw, sorry bout the multi quote thing, but you made three very good points that I wanted to respond to in turn.

[Madness]

...buying online overseas in fact opened up entire ranges that have always been unavailable to me at NZ shops. Swings and round abouts and all that. The online world now enables me as a buyer to be on equal footing with American and European customers. That was just a dream 10 years ago.

Great, innit? Pity it's going to cost Kiwi jobs ultimately. Swings & roundabouts though, eh?

On a human level, I so agree with near everything you have to say...

Which is cool, particularly in light of your own personal interest in the subject, which to some could be seen as a conflict of interest, perhaps?

[sugilite:Me]

Great, innit? Pity it's going to cost Kiwi jobs ultimately. Swings & roundabouts eh?

Yes, it is inevitable kiwi jobs will be lost. Kiwis will have to find other ways to make money in this ever changing World. This sort of thing has been happening for eons. Kick and scream all you like, it will not change anything.

Which is cool, particularly in light of your own personal interest in the subject, which to some could be seen as a conflict of interest, perhaps?

I have absolutely no idea what you are referring too here.

[Madness]

I have absolutely no idea what you are referring too here.

You sell stuff online, presumably competing with rivals who operate under a more traditional out of date business model with staff, a shop that you can walk into IRL and the overheads that come with that. I'm not saying you're a bad man, just that you might not be so keen on people supporting traditional out of date local suppliers of the same product simply for the sake of preserving the health of our local economy. Again, I'm not suggesting a compromise on safety or spending what one cannot afford.

I know nothing of your business and the above is pure speculation. It is however a case of old Vs. new and some of us quite like the idea of bike shops being around in a year or two.