Elections are coming up. What are we thinking?

[Mr Revhead]

Woah someones angry...

Hope you don't have a firearms licence....

It's kiwibiker forum, I thought only angry posts were allowed?

Aside from that, so far there seems to be very little hard facts in Hagars book. It's mostly based around emails between Slater and other bloggers/activists not actually part of the National party. So typical Hagar trying to expand that into some huge scandal that doesn't actually exist.


It does piss me off, because a large portion of this country is actually pretty thick and only reads sensational headlines before forming an "opinion"
Which is also why I said I'd like people to vote for the long term good of NZ rather than their own personal back pocket.

[MisterD]

He has not been disproved yet & yet to lose in court.

Yeah, Don Brash heard there was a book coming out and was gearing up for court action...then he heard it was by Hager and once he'd stoppped laughing, decided not to bother.

Seriously though, what's with all this "investigative journalist" nonsense? A real investigative journalist armed with a bunch of emails would, you know, investigate further. Maybe ask Rodney Hide for confirmation of that blackmail allegation, maybe look into Labour and Union staffers blogging under pseudonyms at the Stranded.

Nicky, presented with heaps of stolen emails, looks to see what conspiracy theories he can build and what he can make look worse by making some shit up completely out of fresh air. I'd bet plenty of actual $$ that the "evidence" he presents is doctored and some alleged emails completely fabricated by him, it's what he did with Hollow Men.

Leftwing activist and conspiracy theorist. Meh, it's probably worth a few votes *for* national and it's going to send Whaleoil's page views through the roof.

[Ocean1]

I dont think being unemployed would be a good option in China?

The general public in China don't get to be unemployed, it's simply not an option.

we live off the sweat of other peoples brow, it's going to catch up with us sooner or later

It "caught up" with us decades ago. Why do you think there are no manufacturing jobs left in NZ? How is it that your TV cost a tenth of what a locally made one would?

[Voltaire]

It's kiwibiker forum, I thought only angry posts were allowed?

Aside from that, so far there seems to be very little hard facts in Hagars book. It's mostly based around emails between Slater and other bloggers/activists not actually part of the National party. So typical Hagar trying to expand that into some huge scandal that doesn't actually exist.


It does piss me off, because a large portion of this country is actually pretty thick and only reads sensational headlines before forming an "opinion"
Which is also why I said I'd like people to vote for the long term good of NZ rather than their own personal back pocket.

Is that why National are keeping a low election profile hoping for the other to make an error and the " Gotcha" style of media will swing it for them?
I'd say so far its a good strategy, who looks the least stupid on the news wins

[pritch]

Aside from that, so far there seems to be very little hard facts in Hagars book. It's mostly based around emails between Slater and other bloggers/activists not actually part of the National party. So typical Hagar trying to expand that into some huge scandal that doesn't actually exist.

So you have raead the book already?

[mada]

Yeah, Don Brash heard there was a book coming out and was gearing up for court action...then he heard it was by Hager and once he'd stoppped laughing, decided not to bother.

Seriously though, what's with all this "investigative journalist" nonsense? A real investigative journalist armed with a bunch of emails would, you know, investigate further. Maybe ask Rodney Hide for confirmation of that blackmail allegation, maybe look into Labour and Union staffers blogging under pseudonyms at the Stranded.

Nicky, presented with heaps of stolen emails, looks to see what conspiracy theories he can build and what he can make look worse by making some shit up completely out of fresh air. I'd bet plenty of actual $$ that the "evidence" he presents is doctored and some alleged emails completely fabricated by him, it's what he did with Hollow Men.

Leftwing activist and conspiracy theorist. Meh, it's probably worth a few votes *for* national and it's going to send Whaleoil's page views through the roof.

Yeh doesn't look like very serious stuff at all:

http://dimpost.wordpress.com/2014/08...itics-summary/

His evidence for all of this consists of a huge quantity of Slater’s Facebook messages many of which are to and from Jason Ede, the longest-serving press officer in the Prime Minister’s office. The primary allegations regarding Ede are:

• He was involved in accessing the Labour Party’s computers in the lead-up to the 2011 election
• He tips Slater off when an OIA is about to be released to an opposition party or media outlet, telling Slater to request the OIA, which he is then provided with before the original requestor. Slater then publishes the information on his blog with a pro-National spin
• He is implicated in advising Slater to request classified SIS documents, which were then declassified and quickly released to Slater to embarrass Labour leader Phil Goff
• Ede advised Slater on the wording of OIA requests to conduct a smear campaign against MFAT staff protesting Murray McCully’s restructuring of their department.

The book also documents the close friendship between Slater and Justice Minister Judith Collins, alleging:

• Collins is the source of much of the material for Slater’s ‘tipline’, attacking Labour MPs and her enemies within the National Party.
• When she was Minister of Corrections Collins appears to have had a prisoner transferred at Slater’s request, because a friend of Slater’s didn’t want her daughter visiting her imprisoned ex-partner and Slater arranged to have the man transferred to a more remote prison. The prisoner later attempted suicide.
• Collins discusses the illegal leaking of police evidence with Slater and publication of the evidence on Slater’s blog (at the time she was Minister of Police)

One of Slater’s primary collaborators is the political strategist Simon Lusk. Allegations:

• Lusk and Slater charge aspiring National politicians to help them win candidate selection in National safe-seats by running attack campaigns against their opponents. The book documents an extensive smear campaign in the Rodney electorate in 2011, in which Lusk and Slater successfully elected their client Mark Mitchell, who is now the MP for Rodney.
• Lusk and Slater, and Jordan Williams routinely game the iPredict site, spending small amounts of money to move the prices around and then blogging about the movements.
• Lusk was hired by Brash to help replace Rodney Hide as leader of the ACT Party. Lusk – evidently without Brash’s knowledge – found out from Jordan Williams that Rodney Hide had been sending ‘dodgy texts’ to a young woman. Slater published hints about this on his blog and Lusk proposed that they approach Hide quietly and ‘tell Hide that someone had the texts and will release them if he doesn’t resign by Friday’. Hide resigned.

Much of the material published by Slater under his name is actually written by Carrick Graham, a lobbyist for the tobacco industry. Allegations:

• Graham also comments extensively on WhaleOil, using pseudonyms, often under his own posts. His pseudo-anonymous comments are incredibly racist and misogynistic.
• Graham pays Slater about $6500 a month for publishing pro tobacco, pro alcohol PR, written by Graham but published under Slater’s byline.
• Many of the posts are vicious attacks against academics that publish scientific research that upsets Graham’s clients.
• Other noteworthy allegations:

Slater has a friend who is a former-prostitute, who asks around brothels to find out if his political enemies have been to them. Len Brown, John Boscowan, Labour MPs, the Herald’s editors and Duncan Garner are all named as people Slater has attempted to ‘dig dirt’ on in this manner to ‘apply pressure’.
Jordan Williams edits the Wikipedia pages of Labour MPs and writes smears about their sex lives
Content on David Farrar’s Kiwiblog is written by National’s communications staffers

That’s not even close to an exhaustive list. Just the things that jumped out at me.

[MisterD]

Yeh doesn't look like very serious stuff at all

The point I was making is that this:

Slater published hints about this on his blog and Lusk proposed that they approach Hide quietly and ‘tell Hide that someone had the texts and will release them if he doesn’t resign by Friday’. Hide resigned.

Isn't investgative journalism, it's low-rent "correlation = causation" spin. A real investigative journalist would have rung Rodney Hide to confirm. Maybe Hager did, and got told "Don Brash spoke to me, and I could see the writing was on the wall and didn't want to damage the party further by making a fight of it" but he left it out because it didn't suit his angle.

[mashman]

Yeh doesn't look like very serious stuff at all:

According to t media Hager received an awful lot of evidence.

"Some weeks later, out of the blue, I received a package: an 8-gigabyte USB digital storage device, the contents of which appeared to have originated from the attack on Slater's computer," Hager says in the book.

[yokel]

The general public in China don't get to be unemployed, it's simply not an option.



It "caught up" with us decades ago. Why do you think there are no manufacturing jobs left in NZ? How is it that your TV cost a tenth of what a locally made one would?

Because of consumerism and no not caught up with us yet.
Tell my why you think the welfare system was created?

[Hinny]

So you have raead the book already?

Bwaaahahaha.

[MisterD]

"Some weeks later, out of the blue, I received a package: an 8-gigabyte USB digital storage device, the contents of which appeared to have originated from the attack on Slater's computer," Hager says in the book.

This bit confuses me, maybe one of the techy geeky types can explain - how does a DNS attack and hack on the servers that host his blog, give access to his computer / emails / facebook account?

Smells like week-old fish to me.

It's be awfully amusing to see Kim Dotcom back in prison here on hacking charges while he waits for his orange onesie and ticket to LA.

[mada]

The point I was making is that this:



Isn't investgative journalism, it's low-rent "correlation = causation" spin. A real investigative journalist would have rung Rodney Hide to confirm. Maybe Hager did, and got told "Don Brash spoke to me, and I could see the writing was on the wall and didn't want to damage the party further by making a fight of it" but he left it out because it didn't suit his angle.

Maybe he did, maybe he didn't. No one else in the media has been asking questions of the closeness between govt. and blogs and the lawfulness or morals of disclosing information. If he was to do what you suggested for all the points in the book it probably wouldn't be published for another 3 or 6 years which would suit the government.

Again, you shoot the messenger of the points without targeting the points.

The NZSIS and OIA stuff is the most damning. If I had leaked or directed others to Official Information under the OIA while having access to public information and employed by the taxpayers/working for govt. as a civil servant I would be serving time. But let me guess, because Helen and her govt. may have done it in the past its all good to continue with undermining transparency, democracy, and the separation of the powers of the state (legislative/executive)???????

[mada]

This bit confuses me, maybe one of the techy geeky types can explain - how does a DNS attack and hack on the servers that host his blog, give access to his computer / emails / facebook account?

Smells like week-old fish to me.

It's be awfully amusing to see Kim Dotcom back in prison here on hacking charges while he waits for his orange onesie and ticket to LA.

I would be happy for Krim and Key to share a cell.

Maybe start up a charity for it? I would donate $100.

[mashman]

This bit confuses me, maybe one of the techy geeky types can explain - how does a DNS attack and hack on the servers that host his blog, give access to his computer / emails / facebook account?

Smells like week-old fish to me.

It's be awfully amusing to see Kim Dotcom back in prison here on hacking charges while he waits for his orange onesie and ticket to LA.

Who knows what miracles hackers can perform. If they can hack the NSA/FBI/CIA then don't you think hacking someone's home PC is gonna be pretty easy? Why bother to question it? Unless of course you're trying to deny that what Hager has is evidence?

[Katman]

Don't forget that the green taliban would like to do away with our motorcycles!

I'm intrigued.

Got anything to back up that statement?