Trail braking?

[McDuck]

Yo. I have seen a few times the term 'trail braking' used. What is it? Any info would be good.
Thanks

[xwhatsit]

There's two senses of the phrase, but the one I use (and practise a lot) is where you drag the rear brake through the corner. Seems to steady things a bit and tighten up the line where needed. I mostly only carry it to the apex, then start winding on the throttle.

Others with the sprotsbikes talk about front brakes and compressing the forks. Dunno what that's all about -- suppose it's a modern thing wot depends on forks that actually... fork.

[Ixion]

Trail braking as I have always used the term (and it is an old one) refers to the practice of lightly applying the rear brake through a corner, until the acceleration out of the apex.

It was a very common practice in the old days when bikes had hinged frames . The application of the brake tended to steady the bike, reduce the frame movement and help the bike turn in . Or at any rate things didn't seem quite so scarey.

I've never heard it used to apply to the use of the front brake to compress the forks. However, I do do that on the XT. Because it has a 21" front wheel it is not keen to turn in. The firm use of the front brake whilst initating the turn compresses the forks, reducing trail etc and making the bike more tender. So I suppose that practice is analogous to the classic trail braking.

Today, with more sophisticated suspension , the practice is probably obsolete.

[McDuck]

Could be worth a go me thinks.

[Motu]

Judging by the state of my rear brake I do it a lot....and don't really know why,I've never analyzed it,just done it.I guess it goes back to gravel roads and old drum brakes - engine braking and trail braking together would reduce rear wheel chatter....keeping that rear wheel loaded all the time so it doesn't get a mind of it's own.

[GSVR]

Trailing the front brake into a corner..

When riders talk about trail braking on the track its about braking after your've turned into the the corner and remaining on the brakes (not hard) to continue to scrub off speed and also to keep the front suspension slightly loaded to prevent the bike pitching as much up to the point when your on the gas again.

It takes a good feel for whats the fronts up to and squeezing the brakes too hard while leaned over will result in the front end letting go...

Never thought of it applying to the rear brake as I only seem to use the rear on gravel or in the wet but I can't see why the same definition can't apply to the rear as well ie. Trailing the rear into a corner. This sounds like an even more dangerous practice but if you get good at it its probably called backing it in. (Jay Lawrence)

[Usarka]

i agree with wikipedia on this one so will quote rather than typing my own gibberish..

Trail braking is a motorcycle riding and driving technique where the brakes are used beyond the entrance to a turn and are gradually released up to the point of apex.

In applying this technique, motorcycle riders approach turns applying both front and rear brakes to reduce speed. As they enter the turn, they partially release the brakes, as to keep only partial brakes throughout the turn. This will give more traction as the front tire is forced into the pavement.

This technique is commonly used when racing, but can enhance control and add more evasive options for street riders making it very worthwhile to learn or at least understand.

Be aware though that excessive trail braking can result in a loss of grip as the tire's adhesion is split between braking and cornering forces. It will also noticeably affect the motorcycle behaviour (as in handling). Should the surface traction be unexpectedly impaired, possibly by oil or fuel spills, a crash is utterly unavoidable.

[GSVR]

i agree with wikipedia on this one so will quote rather than typing my own gibberish..

"Should the surface traction be unexpectedly impaired, possibly by oil or fuel spills, a crash is utterly unavoidable."

Well I certainly don't agree with wikipedia here... When you slip on some unexpected shit and save the slide your've just avoided "a crash" that according to wikipedia is "unavoidable".

[F5 Dave]

Just to throw a bit of goo around. Most learners (most riders?) tend to be over-anxious on the brakes. Braking too late into the corner & the like is unsettling to the bike.

To corner safely you need to have a stable platform so it is better that all the braking is done before you apex. Many riders will hold onto the brakes too long (makes them feel safe) thus forcing the tyre to cope with braking force as well as cornering force.

Racing can tend to smear the line a little where you are pushing the envelope in a controlled surface you have ridden that same corner every 2 min for several laps. Quite different from the road.

I'd suggest first getting used to getting the brake done with before the corner so the bike has time to settle (let it off smoothly though) else you will have an excuse to always hold onto the safety blanket of the brake. Only then (can take years) should one start to delve further.

[Ixion]

Reading this, I think the definition has morphed over the years.

Back in the day, most everybody did it. Not to get through the corner quicker (as now seems to be the rationale), but because it helped reduce the 'orrible' things that happened mid corner, with the suspensions of the day (interestingly I don't recall anyone, including me, doing it on rigid frames ?). It was light braking , just enough to keep the drive line loaded up and (hopefully) encourage the various frame elements into some sort of vague alignment.

Now the meaning has morphed to what we used to call deep braking - holding the braking well into the corner.

Gravel roads are another matter again.

[vifferman]

S'funny (or perhaps not...)
When I was communtering this morning, I was braking quite hardly in a couple of corners (to avoid slower vehicles), and thought, "Hmmmm... I'm braking quite hardly here... wunner what them X-spurts at KiwiBiker would have to say about it?"
Of course, it was a very bad thing to do, and I crashed and died, the bike exploded into flames, and I died all over again.
Man, I *hate* it when that happens!

[roogazza]

I'm old , so trail braking means dragging the rear and I do heaps of it. In fact I use a much stronger spring on the rear brake to counter this and keep me aware of it.
Yes I know some talk of trail braking the front but it isn't a big issue for me.
It all seems to depend on the style (if you can put it that way ?) and method you use when riding. Gaz.

[vifferman]

It all seems to depend on the style and method you use when riding. Gaz.

And your brakes.
On the VTR, I used to brake with the rear going into the corner (to settle the bike / transfer the weight), then transfer braking entirely to the front, then no brakes once I'd apexed. I also used the rear brake as a rudder when doing slow-speed manouevres. The back brake was useless for anything else, so engine-braking was more betterer.
I had to relearn all that when I got the VFR, with DCBS. For a start, there's less brake-induced weight transfer / attitude shifting. Also, now I can use the back brake hard in situations where doing the same on another bike would have you on your ear. However, the back brake's not so good as a rudder.
Engine braking's still good though, so I can use throttle control instead of the brakes a lot more.

[Swoop]

It is not this.

[vifferman]

It is not this.

Oh, I dunno. That's obviously the road-going version of the sea anchor, so why not? :spudwhat:
Seems an eminently sensible form of trail-braking to me.
Plus it would give you a bit of breathing space if anyone was following too close.