Trump - 4 more years of this at least...

[TheDemonLord]

Sorry, I'm losing track here. So C19 wasn't real, it was just a lie from the gummermint, actually all gummermints in the world, so they must all be lefties. Interesting. And the media in cahoots. Got it.

And this benefited them. . . how?

I know this will be brilliant and I'll slap my forehead for not seeing it.

I mean, what benefit could it be for power-hungry communists to confine everyone to their homes and restrict everyones freedoms.

Not like there's a wealth of historical precedent there.

What benefit could it be for Media Companies when all the normal sources of Entertainment have been restricted as people are forced to stay at home and consume the Media they produce.

I wonder...

This is not to say the C19 wasn't 'real' - only that it was a massive over-reaction, for which we are now paying the price.

[MD]

I wonder...

This is not to say the C19 wasn't 'real' - only that it was a massive over-reaction, for which we are now paying the price.

According to tonights news 7 million people have so far died from Covid globally. Maybe you should tell those 7 million people and their families that "it was a massive over-reaction". I'm sure they will hug you and say thank you for putting them straight and how silly they were crying over the loss of loved ones amongst only 7 million others.

[pritch]

I'm waiting for some turkey in NZ to claim his First, Fourth, or Fifth Amendment rights are being violated, having watched too many YouTube 'auditor' clips. Amendments to the United States Constitution that is.

There is a guy tried that in Ireland. The cops were amazingly patient but eventually impounded his mum's car.

[Grumph]

I'm waiting for some turkey in NZ to claim his First, Fourth, or Fifth Amendment rights are being violated, having watched too many YouTube 'auditor' clips. Amendments to the United States Constitution that is.

There is a guy tried that in Ireland. The cops were amazingly patient but eventually impounded his mum's car.

Back when the firearms restrictions and the destruction of illegal guns began i noticed demonstrators claiming their "right to bear arms" was being infringed.

I personally told several that it was a privilege, not a right. And it should be earned.

[TheDemonLord]

According to tonights news 7 million people have so far died from Covid globally. Maybe you should tell those 7 million people and their families that "it was a massive over-reaction". I'm sure they will hug you and say thank you for putting them straight and how silly they were crying over the loss of loved ones amongst only 7 million others.

It was.

This is not going to be a popular opinion, but the fact of the matter is that the overwhelming majority of people who died from Covid were:

1: Over 65
2: Had pre-existing co-morbidities.

Is it nice that Granddad died a bit earlier than he otherwise would have? No.

However, let's not cloud reality with Emotion - what has been the effectives of Covid Policy?

- Massive Inflation
- Erosion of Rights (don't worry, eventually it will happen to you too)
- 'Emergency powers' that are curiously retained after the Emergency ends
- Social Division (turns out having your natural rights infringed makes people angry)
- Distrust of Government
- A Generation of children with reading, writing and speaking impaired due to missing school.

And before you rebut this - I want you to answer this question honestly:

"Was New Zealand better before Covid or after Covid?"

[TheDemonLord]

Back when the firearms restrictions and the destruction of illegal guns began i noticed demonstrators claiming their "right to bear arms" was being infringed.

I personally told several that it was a privilege, not a right. And it should be earned.

That depends on whether you consider the Right to Self Defence to be a Natural right that supercedes what is or is not written in law.

And considering at best less than 30% were handed in (more like 10-15%) - it seems to indicate what the majority believe

[F5 Dave]

Just pondering. What is the greatest force?

Stupidity
Entitlement or
Ignorance?

[pritch]

Just pondering. What is the greatest force?

Stupidity
Entitlement or
Ignorance?

Or wilful ignorance?

[TheDemonLord]

Just pondering. What is the greatest force?

Stupidity
Entitlement or
Ignorance?

Or wilful ignorance?

I'm assuming you mean destructive force - in which case, Pritch is closest but how about this:

"A Genuine, but misplaced belief that you are doing good"

All Evil is permissible if you are doing it 'For the greater good'.

[F5 Dave]

Or wilful ignorance?

Good point. Indeed. It is still a subset rather than sum total , but you likely have to touch all the bases.


Whatever, I blame centrist politics. (They don't seem to get the rap as often as the imagined binary theological divisions some people are so keen on).

[TheDemonLord]

Whatever, I blame centrist politics. (They don't seem to get the rap as often as the imagined binary theological divisions some people are so keen on).

And it seems we agree.

Centrist Politics are, in reality, just Left-Wing politics doing the speed limit.

[neels]

Centrist Politics are, in reality, just Left-Wing politics doing the speed limit.

Probably more correctly, both left wing and right wing politics doing the speed limit. There is not enough support at either of the extremes for any sort of political influence.

What is kinda funny is that the people who hold the extreme political beliefs seem to think they will be the ones who will most benefit in whatever political system they propose.

In reality they are probably the fringe people who would be unproductive, argumentative, and generally annoying, and therefore the first to be removed or excluded from any society that formed so the rest can get on with living sensibly with each other.

[sugilite:Me]

I find it curious - For the last few pages people have been saying that Fox and Tucker 'knew' that the Election Fraud claim was false - and yet...

"He was pushing voting fraud stuff. I have no doubt there was fraud." - It seems there's a bit of discrepancy between what has been claimed and what was actually said.

Now, given who is publishing these Texts and the fact I'm not seeing the full conversation, only isolated lines (no doubt cherry picked) - I'm a touch skeptical.

But here's the thing - Tucker is welcome to his opinion, I'm not a Tucker fan as I don't watch Fox - suffice to say I disagree on some of the points made if they are what they pro-port to be - That's the beauty of the adversarial court system, I'm sure there's going to be additional information come to light that will frame these out-of-context snippets.

Then, with a much fuller picture, we can read and assess what is going on.

Carlsons messaging was very clear, but hold onto your Trump fantasies - while you still can
One way or another, he will finally finish off the GOP. I hope your waiting chair for the Dems comeuppance is very comfortable, you will likely be in it for quite some time.
To recap:
Trump wins nomination - swing voters will deny him the presidency once again.
Trump loses nomination, he takes maga supporters with him to start a 3rd party. I'm sure you understand trump for trump will over rule any sort of party loyalty.

[TheDemonLord]

Probably more correctly, both left wing and right wing politics doing the speed limit. There is not enough support at either of the extremes for any sort of political influence.

Disagree.

When was the last time you saw in NZ National repeal a major Labour Policy (like the RMA for instance) or implement a proper, bottom-up conservative policy?

The typical National talking points of today wouldn't look out of place in Helen Clark's Government.

This is essentially Robert Conquests' Law.

What is kinda funny is that the people who hold the extreme political beliefs seem to think they will be the ones who will most benefit in whatever political system they propose.

I mean whilst that definitely describes every Communist (and so I laughed) - let me apply that same rational to myself for a moment, see how much you agree/disagree:

I want the Government to stop trying to artificially engineer the 'perfect' society and reign itself in.
I want to see a Government where every law that is on the books has a basis in Natural Rights (The right to Speak, the Right to Bodily Autonomy, The right to own the fruits of your labour, The right to defend yourself and the Right to move freely without hinderance) - any law that isn't tangentially linked to those is repealed (with some minor exceptions).
I want a Government that does not see race, colour, sex, gender or any other characteristic as a reason to treat people differently.
I want a Government whose primary focus for my Tax Dollars is Infrastructure, Education, Defence, Law and Order, Healthcare and not a whole lot else.

In short, I want the Government to leave me alone to live my life as I see fit and by that same token, I want a Government that leaves you alone to likewise live your life as you best see fit

Will I be better or worse off? I don't know. But I do know that thrive or fail, it will be on my own merits.

In reality they are probably the fringe people who would be unproductive, argumentative, and generally annoying, and therefore the first to be removed or excluded from any society that formed so the rest can get on with living sensibly with each other.

So, University communist activists then...

[TheDemonLord]

Carlsons messaging was very clear, but hold onto your Trump fantasies - while you still can

You miss the point - Again, for the Umpteenth time - I'm not a particular fan of Tucker, I don't watch his show regularly, nor do I cite him as any form of authority.

He can have his views on Trump - my point was, in this thread, much had been made of 'Fox pushing false election fraud claims that they didn't believe themselves' - yet the quote you posted seems to run counter to that narrative.

Since we have two seemingly irreconcilable opinions - either one of them is false or there is some additional context missing. Either way, I'm skeptical of the Narrative because of that inconsistency (and I know that the media are always lying through their teeth).

One way or another, he will finally finish off the GOP. I hope your waiting chair for the Dems comeuppance is very comfortable, you will likely be in it for quite some time.

To recap:
Trump wins nomination - swing voters will deny him the presidency once again.
Trump loses nomination, he takes maga supporters with him to start a 3rd party. I'm sure you understand trump for trump will over rule any sort of party loyalty.

Okay - serious question:

Do you think the average Swing voter is going to forgive the Democrats for what has happened under Biden?

Putting aside all personal issues with Biden for a moment - there is one key issue that cannot be overcome: Life was better under Trump. Then you've got the issues like the massive increase in illegal border crossings (I believe an 8 fold increase from when Biden took office), the Afghanistan collapse, Inflation, Government Debt, The Ukraine war etc.

There's only so long you can lie to people before they start to get suspicious - for example - where did Covid come from? Was it a Lab Leak or is that just some crackpot conspiracy theory that will get you banned from the internet?

If Trump wins the Nomination - his campaign should simply be 'It was so good, it was great, it was beautiful - and the Democrats destroyed it all' - where's the lie in that?

If Trump loses - now, that's a more interesting scenario - there's potential of splitting the vote, however the realistic option is if he leaves, it would be Ron DeSantis who would dethrone him. Most Conservatives would be wary of splitting the vote and so I think they would vote for Ron out of pragmatism (plus Ron is pretty awesome)

In addition, if Ron does get the nomination - all the people that have TDS (but otherwise agree with all his policies...) don't have the same hangup, so I think we'd see a swing vote shift.

I'm still hoping for a Trump second term - mainly because since he can't get re-elected, he would have the possibility (and perhaps even the Will) to do some serious 'Fuck you' push backs. Disbanding or seriously curtailing the FBI would be a good start.