The firearm thread

[Drunken Monkey]

Sounds like you guys had fun, sorry I couldn't make it.

[Mr Merde]

This thread has been a little quiet lately so I thought I would start you all off again.

Since the other weekend I have been very quiet on the firearms side of my life.

Just taken possession of anothe 13 shoulder arms.

2x .303 rifles
1 Mossberg pump shotgun
1 Baikel UO shotgun
3 x SXS shotguns
1 .22 Mag rifle
5 x .22 rifles

Plus a safe that looks like an old fashioned foot locker but on its own weighs in at about 200+kg's

Along with all that came 2000rounds of .22 ammo
100 rnds of .22 mag
250 rnds .303 factory
200 12 gauge shells

So now there is approximately 30 rifles\shotguns and 5 handguns stoered away here in the house.

Anyone wish to start a war? I'm your man.

At the moment I am bidding on a reloading tool from 1894 for the Marlin. Ebay is so much better than TM for firearms related stuff.

Found some extras for the Springfield there. ie baynet and scabbard, campaign belt with loops for 45-70, combination tool etc. I've put them on the watchlist and will bid on them when the auctions are closer to finishing.

So in the scheme of things i suppose I have been a little busy.

Still need to burn some powder.

BTW if anyone is looking for a good UO 12 gauge shotgun then the Baikel is for sale. Very nice looking shottie. PM me if intereseted.

Chris

[jono035]

Bloody hell. Instant firearm collection, as if you needed it :p

I'll have to take a pass on that shotgun unfortunately, too many other toys that I'm looking at while simultaneously having no money!

Edit: And yeah, I'm feeling the need to make some smoke and noise again, this whole thing at the CSI range has put me right off.

[slofox]

I got to shoot my boom-stick on Saturday after seven years without use. Felt just like it always did - missed just as many targets as always! Oh, and managed to hit a duck or two as well....

[Mr Merde]

I got to shoot my boom-stick on Saturday after seven years without use. Felt just like it always did - missed just as many targets as always! Oh, and managed to hit a duck or two as well....


Welcome back

[ManDownUnder]

My little girl's new toy... (http://www.trademe.co.nz/a.asp?id=286589585)

... I wonder what Mum will say... :)

[jono035]

My little girl's new toy... (http://www.trademe.co.nz/a.asp?id=286589585)

... I wonder what Mum will say... :)

That's a nice looking little rifle, I'm sure she'll be thrilled!

Edit: You'll have to bring her along to this .22 shooting challenge that happens eventually, I'm sure she'll make a few of us look like fools :p

[Mr Merde]

My little girl's new toy... (http://www.trademe.co.nz/a.asp?id=286589585)

... I wonder what Mum will say... :)

I'm more interested in what your little girl will say. Its her new toy. Looks great. Someone has put some thought into this. Good on you mate.

[ManDownUnder]

That's a nice looking little rifle, I'm sure she'll be thrilled!

Edit: You'll have to bring her along to this .22 shooting challenge that happens eventually, I'm sure she'll make a few of us look like fools :p


I'm more interested in what your little girl will say. Its her new toy. Looks great. Someone has put some thought into this. Good on you mate.

Cheers guys - I'm STOKED! I'll be getting it and throwing a bipod on it ASAP so she can get the feel of it. I hope the trigger's not too heavy but one thing at a time...

[Indiana_Jones]

Nice looking rifle, I'm sure she'll love it :D

And agreed Jono, another gun for the shoot off!

-Indy

[Mr Merde]

Nice looking rifle, I'm sure she'll love it :D

And agreed Jono, another gun for the shoot off!

-Indy

I have about 7 x .22 rifles at home now. Can I come

[jono035]

I have about 7 x .22 rifles at home now. Can I come

Actually, at this rate I may be having to sell the target rifle and my other .22 is slightly broken so I may not even be there :|

[Indiana_Jones]

Actually, at this rate I may be having to sell the target rifle and my other .22 is slightly broken so I may not even be there :|


<img src="http://media.comicvine.com/uploads/0/3133/118800-157462-stewie-griffin_super.jpg">

Victory is mine!

-Indy

[ManDownUnder]

Actually, at this rate I may be having to sell the target rifle and my other .22 is slightly broken so I may not even be there :|

Get your arse there.. we'll find you some hardware to play with in the meantime. I've got a Marlin .22 that seems to have too many .22 friends in the gun safe so you're weclome to borrow and practice with that for a while. heavy trigger though

[The Pastor]

Actually, at this rate I may be having to sell the target rifle and my other .22 is slightly broken so I may not even be there :|

already trying to back out of it, norinco pwns the 10/22

<img src='http://i44.tinypic.com/9hks37.jpg'>

[jono035]

already trying to back out of it, norinco pwns the 10/22

Other things taking my attention and I haven't shot the 10/22 since christmas/new year. If I sell it before this, I'm sure Alex will be happy to demonstrate a properly accurate .22.

[jono035]

Get your arse there.. we'll find you some hardware to play with in the meantime. I've got a Marlin .22 that seems to have too many .22 friends in the gun safe so you're weclome to borrow and practice with that for a while. heavy trigger though

Cheers for the offer, much appreciated. Hopefully the Stirling will be fixed soon, the tab that broke off from the action is epoxied back on now and looking pretty solid. Ideally I'd like to mill out an entire replacement lower receiver, but the rifle really isn't worth the work.

[Drunken Monkey]

... the 10/22 since christmas/new year. If I sell it before this, ...

MSG me before you sell it Jono.

Cheers.

[carver]

SOLD

lol that was quick.

I sold my 3030 Marlin too!

As for the 10/22, they are good, but if you want it really good, i would get either a target barrel or a fully suppressed barrel.

the problem with semi's is that the action always makes a bit of noise, and you lose accuracy.

I have a TOZ 78 in the shop at the moment being kitted out with a decent scope and silencer.

I used to shoot alot with the 10/22, but i prefer my norinco 22 magnum for accuracy and punch

"Poaching"

if your shooting possum, i use a 10/22 with red dot sights.
Rabbits, I use the toz
The norinco is good at both, but you cant do it quietly, so for a bit more punch, it is either that or the 12g remmington

had to laugh at the toz, crooked sights, a owners manual typewritten on 50 y/o paper..

russian, rugged, and pretty well made!

[The Pastor]

i prefer my norinco 22 for accuracy and punch

Score 1 to norinco!

[carver]

i prefer my norinco 22 for accuracy and punch

Score 1 to norinco!

stirling is one abve norinco..bolt action only, you got a JW14?

[The Pastor]

jw15 .

[ManDownUnder]

The rifle (http://www.trademe.co.nz/Browse/Listing.aspx?id=286589585) is home - and what a sweet little thing it is too! Trigger's a bit heavy but for a 10 year old I'm happy to err on the side of safety rather than enjoy the excitement of an accidental discharge.

...only 4 more slots available in the gun cabinet...

[Mr Merde]

The rifle (http://www.trademe.co.nz/Browse/Listing.aspx?id=286589585) is home - and what a sweet little thing it is too! Trigger's a bit heavy but for a 10 year old I'm happy to err on the side of safety rather than enjoy the excitement of an accidental discharge.

...only 4 more slots available in the gun cabinet...

Nice little MP-27N sitting at my home waiting for a loving owner

BTW Last night I purchased another rifle. Another old one.

Whitworth rifle .451 2 band volunteer, needs work but looks good to nshoot. Hexagonal barrel, missing rear sight (ALREADY FOUND AN ORIFGINAL REPLACEMENT)

1854 muzzle loader in my collection.

[Indiana_Jones]

As always gentlemen..........Pictures please

-Indy

[Mr Merde]

As always gentlemen..........Pictures please

-Indy

The whole rifle

http://images.trademe.co.nz/photoserver/61/127100961_full.jpg (http://www.trademe.co.nz/Sports/Hunting-shooting/Rifles/auction-289033702.htm)

The lockwork, note the name "Whitworth"
http://images.trademe.co.nz/photoserver/95/127100995_full.jpg (http://www.trademe.co.nz/Sports/Hunting-shooting/Rifles/auction-289033702.htm)


The hexagonal bore for the hexagonal bullet
http://images.trademe.co.nz/photoserver/80/127101080_full.jpg (http://www.trademe.co.nz/Sports/Hunting-shooting/Rifles/auction-289033702.htm)

The bullet it fires
http://www.lrml.org/historical/whitworth/images/gunsandsteel2b.gif

[Drunken Monkey]

Should have put this up for sale here first: http://www.trademe.co.nz/Browse/Listing.aspx?id=289436012

It is the Remington 597 in .22 magnum you may have seen me use in the past. If you're one of the regulars at Merde's and you're interested in this, let me know I can pull the ad.

[Rogue Rider]

Guns and bikes, they go hand in hand.

[Indiana_Jones]

Looking nice Chris! Will have to come down to see it in person when it comes

And I'll have to pass DM, good luck with the sale :)

-Indy

[Mr Merde]

Since you lot are my mates and I have to tell someone I will make this announcement in this thread.

My youngest son, Jonathan, has just broken up with his girlfriend of 2 years, and like all 20 year olds he is devastated.

He has been talking to his Aunties and cousins on facebook and finally he has spoken to me ( his old man).

The decision has been made. He is comming over to live with me in NZ. Applying for his NZ citizenship and passport etc. I an guesstimating that he will be here in mid July once he has finished his college course.

He will be all alone except for his massive NZ family so I want you lot to meet the liuttle fella (6'1").

I'm not going to be able to support him all by myserlf so he will need to go for a job. He is jusdt finishing a computer course in the UK so I told him to bring all his references and certificates. While at college he has held down 2 bar jobs in Cardiff sio he is not adverse to wortking.

I havent seen him in 5 years. It is strange and exciting at the same time.

He will need friends.


Chris

[jono035]

Since you lot are my mates and I have to tell someone I will make this announcement in this thread.

My youngest son, Jonathan, has just broken up with his girlfriend of 2 years, and like all 20 year olds he is devastated.

He has been talking to his Aunties and cousins on facebook and finally he has spoken to me ( his old man).

The decision has been made. He is comming over to live with me in NZ. Applying for his NZ citizenship and passport etc. I an guesstimating that he will be here in mid July once he has finished his college course.

He will be all alone except for his massive NZ family so I want you lot to meet the liuttle fella (6'1").

I'm not going to be able to support him all by myserlf so he will need to go for a job. He is jusdt finishing a computer course in the UK so I told him to bring all his references and certificates. While at college he has held down 2 bar jobs in Cardiff sio he is not adverse to wortking.

I havent seen him in 5 years. It is strange and exciting at the same time.

He will need friends.


Chris

I'll keep my ears open for any IT related jobs, but not really my field. If he's a shooter or biker then he'll be fine around here, if not then are you sure he's really yours? :P

Edit: Actually, he's coming in from the UK which means he's probably neither, but I'm sure we can change that...

[Mr Merde]

He wants to do both. Need to get him on 2 wheels and on 4 as well as working.

Only problem is that he is a Liverpool supporter.

I'vve been on the DIA site getting all the forms ready to claim his citizenship.

Spoken to his Aunties and they are gioing to organise the family over here to chip in for his airfare.

[jono035]

Only problem is that he is a Liverpool supporter.

Oh, those are the people that run around on the grass aimlessly after a round thing then occaisionally get close to each other, trip over and then start crying and screaming at the guy in the stripy shirt that someone was bullying them, right?

[Mr Merde]

Thats the game.

Jon actually got banned from the Liverpool website for taking the piss out of the other supporters

Just like his old man

[jono035]

Lol, that sounds like a sport that I could thoroughly enjoy...

[Drunken Monkey]

I thought the sign above the door said "No Scousers"...ohshit I was wrong, it said "No fucking scouse wankers"...

;P

Nah, just kidding, I'm sure he'll be alright. Got plenty of I.T. contacts, and people are starting to hire again (feck, someone just hired me finally, so it must be getting better).

PS - Jono, my 597 has some bids on it now, so it will probably be gone by the start of next week. Don't lose that Ruger!

[Swoop]

Not quite "firearms", but I thought the numbers discovered each year was interesting.

In Germany, several pigs foraging for food, dug up a World War II era anti-tank rocket. This was the single shot Panzerfaust, a cheap weapon that Russians later modified into the multi-shot RPG series of rocket launchers. Over six million Panzerfausts were manufactured by 1945, and thousands are still buried throughout Germany, Russia, Italy and France. Many have been removed from collapsed buildings in cities that were fought over during World War II, and then rebuilt. The Panzerfaust was an ideal weapon for knocking out tanks in urban areas.
The bomb squad was called to carefully remove the Panzerfaust, because the explosives still have some bang left in them. European bomb squads still get lots of practice doing this sort of thing. The most dangerous jobs involve larger munitions.

Two years ago, three unexploded World War II allied bombs were found outside the German town of Kaiserslautern. Here, during World War II, 60 percent of the buildings in the area were destroyed by allied bombs. Many of those bombs did not go off, and were buried in the rubble. Since then, every few years, more are uncovered. The recent find was a hundred meters from a rail line, and 300 from a residential neighborhood. Everything in the area was shut down for half a day, as bomb disposal teams came in to disarm the weapons and haul them away.

World War II era munitions continue to show up throughout Europe. Although most of the millions of land mines were removed from Europe within a few years of the war ending in 1945, there are still a huge number of unexploded of grenades, shells, rockets and bombs buried all over the place. At least the mine fields were easy to find, although dangerous to clear. But the remaining munitions were left behind, in unrecorded locations, for some pretty simple reasons. First of all, many bombs, artillery and mortar shells (over ten percent, for some manufacturers) do not explode when they are supposed to, but just buried themselves into the ground. These shells are still full of explosives, and often have a fuze that, while defective, is often still capable of going off if disturbed. Other munitions were left in bunkers, or elsewhere on the battlefield, and got buried and lost. Most of these lost munitions eventually get found by farmers, or anyone digging up the ground for construction. London and Berlin, two of the most heavily bombed cities during World War II, still suffer from construction crews unearthing unexploded bombs.

The problem goes back farther than World War II. Unexploded munitions from the World War I, which ended in 1918, and the American Civil War, which ended in 1865, are still showing up, and some of them are still deadly. Currently, over a thousand World War II munitions are discovered each year in Europe.

[Indiana_Jones]

AKA 'The Iron Harvest' (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iron_harvest)

-Indy

[jono035]

AKA 'The Iron Harvest' (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iron_harvest)

-Indy

From Swoop:
"World War II era munitions continue to show up throughout Europe." etc.

From Wikipedia:Iron Harvest
"The harvest generally applies to the material from The Great War of 1914 - 1918 which is still found in large quantities across the former Western Front."

Reading comprehension fail?

Edit: "By extension, the term is sometimes used to describe the unexploded ordnance left behind after any major battle or war."

Perhaps I should have read past the first paragraph, fail-accusation fail?

[Indiana_Jones]

From Swoop:
"World War II era munitions continue to show up throughout Europe." etc.

From Wikipedia:Iron Harvest
"The harvest generally applies to the material from The Great War of 1914 - 1918 which is still found in large quantities across the former Western Front."

Reading comprehension fail?

Edit: "By extension, the term is sometimes used to describe the unexploded ordnance left behind after any major battle or war."

Perhaps I should have read past the first paragraph, fail-accusation fail?

lol

-Indy

[ManDownUnder]

Since you lot are my mates and I have to tell someone I will make this announcement in this thread.

Chris

Yell out mate - anything I can do... just say the word.

[The Pastor]

Since you lot are my mates and I have to tell someone I will make this announcement in this thread.

My youngest son, Jonathan, has just broken up with his girlfriend of 2 years, and like all 20 year olds he is devastated.

He has been talking to his Aunties and cousins on facebook and finally he has spoken to me ( his old man).

The decision has been made. He is comming over to live with me in NZ. Applying for his NZ citizenship and passport etc. I an guesstimating that he will be here in mid July once he has finished his college course.

He will be all alone except for his massive NZ family so I want you lot to meet the liuttle fella (6'1").

I'm not going to be able to support him all by myserlf so he will need to go for a job. He is jusdt finishing a computer course in the UK so I told him to bring all his references and certificates. While at college he has held down 2 bar jobs in Cardiff sio he is not adverse to wortking.

I havent seen him in 5 years. It is strange and exciting at the same time.

He will need friends.


Chris

my bike needs a wash. thats $10 right there.

[Indiana_Jones]

my bike needs a wash. thats $10 right there.

Another $10 if he does the Wolseley

-Indy

[The Pastor]

Another $10 if he does the Wolseley

-Indy

how can it get dirty if u never use it?

[ManDownUnder]

how can it get dirty if u never use it?

His mind soils it... filthy little bugger....

[Mr Merde]

His mind soils it... filthy little bugger....

Unclean !! Unclean!!

Anyone got a bell he can ring to warn us he is approaching?

[jono035]

Unclean !! Unclean!!

Anyone got a bell he can ring to warn us he is approaching?

Could just stick one around his neck?

[Indiana_Jones]

how can it get dirty if u never use it?

Some useless cunts decided to reseal the road.....

-Indy

[Mr Merde]

You've been on a road with it?

[Indiana_Jones]

You've been on a road with it?

That's where it lives lol

-Indy

[jono035]

That's where it lives lol

-Indy

That'll be good for its already stellar reliability!

[Indiana_Jones]

That'll be good for its already stellar reliability!

That's the job for the new battery lol

-Indy

[jono035]

That's the job for the new battery lol

-Indy

That's an impressive amount of faith in the restorative power of a new battery!

On the other hand, for the 2nd time in 2 weeks I found myself wishing the VFR had a kick-start earlier today...

[Indiana_Jones]

That's an impressive amount of faith in the restorative power of a new battery!

On the other hand, for the 2nd time in 2 weeks I found myself wishing the VFR had a kick-start earlier today...

Well it does start 1st turn now lol

And I wished I had one on my old CBR250 on a cold winters morning....

-Indy

[The Pastor]

thats funny i wish my bike had an electric start.....

[jono035]

thats funny i wish my bike had an electric start.....

Don't get me wrong, I wouldn't trade one for the other, just wouldn't mind the option of both. Bump starting the VFR is a bit of a bastard.

Although I guess I could always just fork out for a new battery.

[Indiana_Jones]

Don't get me wrong, I wouldn't trade one for the other, just wouldn't mind the option of both. Bump starting the VFR is a bit of a bastard.

Although I guess I could always just fork out for a new battery.

Yea, was the best part of the FXR150.

-Indy

[jono035]

Yea, was the best part of the FXR150.

-Indy

Well, that and they're cheap on tires, brakes and fuel. I had one follow me around the coro loop and I was pretty impressed. Was a perfect illustration of the rider being more important than the bike.

Edit: Pity they sound like a sewing machine, though.

[Indiana_Jones]

Well, that and they're cheap on tires, brakes and fuel. I had one follow me around the coro loop and I was pretty impressed. Was a perfect illustration of the rider being more important than the bike.

Edit: Pity they sound like a sewing machine, though.

Don't forget the super bad ass LCD display, reading well over the actual speed lol

-Indy

[The Pastor]

and the fxrs are unbeatable in buckets. TOO MUCH BIKE TALK

[jono035]

and the fxrs are unbeatable in buckets. TOO MUCH BIKE TALK

I know, right? Although I think out of everyone here, I've only ever seen you, Wolf and Indy actually ON a bike...

[Mr Merde]

I know, right? Although I think out of everyone here, I've only ever seen you, Wolf and Indy actually ON a bike...

I have been approaching those who have money to lend, today. Looking for a new bike. Since I cleared all my bad debts I have become solvent again.

Had a personal loan from the bank a few years ago and they have asked me if I would like to extend it now that it is almost paid off.

Checked out the repayment rate and its well within my means.

So if they say yes, and I dont really have my hopes up on that, I will be looking to fullfil a dream I've had for a few years now. A replacemnt for my ZZR1100.

Cant go retro so I'll have to upgrade. ZX12R should be comfortable enough.

The Suzuki can go into the garage for a rebuild and tidy up. She deserves it.

[The Pastor]

try the kawasaki z1000, they are awesome bikes

[jono035]

Good job Chris, was meaning to ask what had happened to the bike plans in the move and associated kerfuffle.

[Indiana_Jones]

TOO MUCH BIKE TALK

Can't win on KB can you?

Too little bike talk, too much bike talk

-Indy

[ManDownUnder]

Today's lessons
* Mynahs bully sparrows and eat all their bread
* Mynahs stand nice and still while eat the sparrows bread
* Mynahs don't like .17 HMR

[Indiana_Jones]

Are there pictures to go with the theory? :D

-Indy

[ManDownUnder]

Are there pictures to go with the theory? :D

-Indy

Sorry - I didn't invest in an eel cam. But can testify that's where the mynah went.

[Mr Merde]

Sorry - I didn't invest in an eel cam. But can testify that's where the mynah went.

Or to put it more exactly

What was left of the Mynah after being hit by a .17

[ManDownUnder]

Or to put it more exactly

What was left of the Mynah after being hit by a .17

Good point. It stopped the little bugger pdq... and to their credit - the only ones going near the bread for the rest of the day were sparrows...

[Wolf]

I know, right? Although I think out of everyone here, I've only ever seen you, Wolf and Indy actually ON a bike...

My bike's out of action at the mo' - we've narrowed things down to the CDI unit. The only wheels I have at the moment is a borrowed Chinese moped - it gets me to work, the shops and back... eventually...

Really missing being able to get out on the open road and really missing being able to bang off a few rounds of ammo ( <-- blatant attempt to bring post back on topic)

Chris, look forward to meeting your little 'un at some stage, for all he's a Liverpool supporter. I understand that the best of families have their black sheep...

[ManDownUnder]

Good point. It stopped the little bugger pdq... and to their credit - the only ones going near the bread for the rest of the day were sparrows...

They learn GOOOOD!

The only ones going near the bread today were sparrows...!

[jono035]

They learn GOOOOD!

The only ones going near the bread today were sparrows...!

Yeah, that's the problem. When we tried to do something about them up north, they just learnt too damn fast. Couldn't do anything to reliably get them.

Wolf: Gutted about the bike. I've gotta pull the heads on the VFR this weekend in theory, so I might be taking the bus (or a borrowed scooter) for a week.

[ManDownUnder]

Yeah, that's the problem. When we tried to do something about them up north, they just learnt too damn fast. Couldn't do anything to reliably get them.

Wolf: Gutted about the bike. I've gotta pull the heads on the VFR this weekend in theory, so I might be taking the bus (or a borrowed scooter) for a week.

Get the Mynah distress call tape... I have one here somewhere... and a 12g full of #7...

[jono035]

Get the Mynah distress call tape... I have one here somewhere... and a 12g full of #7...

So that actually works pretty well?

We had some pretty huge flocks of mynahs up north, would take a pretty serious effort to make a dent in them...

[ManDownUnder]

So that actually works pretty well?

We had some pretty huge flocks of mynahs up north, would take a pretty serious effort to make a dent in them...

Yeah I hear ya - depends what you're after I guess - I'm pretty realistic about population control - I'm not going to change anything... I just wanted to keeop 'em away from the sparrow's bread (I'm a softie for sparrows... guess I have the guilts for all the ones I shot as a kid.)

50x worth of ammo and the Mynahs stay away for days... seems like a good result to me.

A cloud of 'em vs a semi auto might be an interesting proposition though.....

[Wolf]

Cheers, Jono. All the best with the viffer.

Mynahs are bloody bright and learn quickly, that's for sure. We had a large number of cats out on the farm when I was a kid and there was usually a litter of kittens around the place.
The mynahs started mimicking the cries of young kittens needing attention and it didn't take long for them to notice that the cats would react to the sound, frantically searching for strayed/lost/hungry kittens. So the mynahs would sit up on the guttering and make the cries, watching the cats. Then the mynahs would move somewhere else and do it again. They had the cats running all over the place - and you can't convince me they weren't deriving some kind of "enjoyment" out of it. They were doing it for no other reason than to make the cats react - as evidenced by the fact that they would start watching the cats and then start making the sound. I know this, because we started watching the mynahs once we realised the cats were reacting to their false kitten sounds.

They seemed smarter than the cats who always fell for it - even when there wasn't a litter of kittens around.

That, their ability to expertly judge the speed of an approaching vehicle and casually hop out of the way at the last instant - rather than hastily taking flight the moment it's detected like most other birds I've observed - and MDU and Jono's observations about how quickly they learn to modify their behaviour against a perceived threat, all lead me to believe that mynahs are one of the most intelligent bird species - which probably accounts for their success.

An intelligent creature that's capable of flight, learns faster than the average computer user and can faultlessly mimic any sound they hear often enough and put it to use - just be thankful they have no desire to dominate our realm...

[jono035]

An intelligent creature that's capable of flight, learns faster than the average computer user and can faultlessly mimic any sound they hear often enough and put it to use - just be thankful they have no desire to dominate our realm...

Yeah, the fact that they learn quicker than your average human is the kinda depressing part.

[Wolf]

Yeah, the fact that they learn quicker than your average human is the kinda depressing part.

Yep - compare the road toll with the number of mynahs MDU shot and you can instantly see which species is better equipped to "learn from the mistakes of others"...

And humans are still driving carelessly and/or recklessly

[Mr Merde]

E-mail yesterday afternoon.

The 1854 .451 Whitworth is on its way.

My mate in the UK is so excited he phoned me at work to talk about it.

Apparently he is the envy of the British Muzzle Loading team.

Two of them came around to his house on Saturday and drooled over tyhe photos.

Its a rare rifle as it has only two bands where most had 3.

This is how the Confederate states ordered their 300 rifles during the ACW. Apparently only about 200 were delivered to the Confederacy and the remaining 100 came to Aussie and NZ.

Mark has bought a mould to cast the hexagonal twisted projectile. It is a 6 part mould and cost half as much as the rifle did. Specially made by an engineer in Switzerland.

There are now a number of UK shooters pouring over our Trade Me. All looking at firearms they cant get in the UK but are availasble here. All of them unable to bid as you need a NZ address to join TM. I expect a few of them to get in contact via my mate, hoping to have me bid for them.

Chris

[jono035]

E-mail yesterday afternoon.

The 1854 .451 Whitworth is on its way.

My mate in the UK is so excited he phoned me at work to talk about it.

Apparently he is the envy of the British Muzzle Loading team.

Two of them came around to his house on Saturday and drooled over tyhe photos.

Its a rare rifle as it has only two bands where most had 3.

This is how the Confederate states ordered their 300 rifles during the ACW. Apparently only about 200 were delivered to the Confederacy and the remaining 100 came to Aussie and NZ.

Mark has bought a mould to cast the hexagonal twisted projectile. It is a 6 part mould and cost half as much as the rifle did. Specially made by an engineer in Switzerland.

There are now a number of UK shooters pouring over our Trade Me. All looking at firearms they cant get in the UK but are availasble here. All of them unable to bid as you need a NZ address to join TM. I expect a few of them to get in contact via my mate, hoping to have me bid for them.

Chris

Charge a em 10% per rifle bought and you could have a nice little side earner...

[Mr Merde]

Charge a em 10% per rifle bought and you could have a nice little side earner...

mark talked about doiung reciprocal deals.

Gunstuff from UK to NZ and the reverse

[jono035]

mark talked about doiung reciprocal deals.

Gunstuff from UK to NZ and the reverse

Oh, for a mate sure. For his mates, charge em!

Also how much of a pain would it be to do the reverse?

[Swoop]

This letter is going around at the moment.



To whom it may concern

During 2009 Police undertook an awareness programme to let the firearms community know that we had changed our understanding of what constituted a military style semi-automatic firearm (MSSA). The change was around interpretation of the phrase "military pattern free-standing pistol grip".

The 2009 interpretation meant that some semi-automatic firearms previously considered to be in sporting configuration would instead be classed as MSSAs by virtue of their grip. People wishing to lawfully own such an MSSA had to ensure they complied with the legal requirements applicable to MSSAs. .

A High Court judgment from March this year found that the Police interpretation of "military pattern free-standing pistol grip" was inconsistent with the Arms Act 1983.

The judgment held that:
• a pistol grip that is integrated with the stock is not "free-standing"; and
• "military pattern" means conforms with military specifications.

In order to mitigate any confusion that may have arisen due to the High Court judgment I would like to make the following points.

1. Police are once again treating dragunov-style stocks as integrated, and therefore not containing a "free standing" pistol grip. A semi-automatic rifle with a dragunov-style stock and no other MSSA features is therefore an A Category firearm.

2. The 2009 Police communication is still correct in that a non-integrated addition that connects a pistol grip to the stock or butt in an attempt to make it no longer free standing (such as adding a metal or plastic rod) will not stop the grip from being "free standing". Any semi-automatic with that feature will be an MSSA.

3. People who have already been issued an E endorsement as a result of the July 2009 communication may choose to retain an endorsement for an MSSA, or may choose to surrender the endorsement and (where necessary) return their MSSA to sporting configuration.

4. Where a person has applied (solely as a result of the Police July 2009 interpretation of "military pattern free-standing pistol grip") for an E endorsement prior to the 1 March 2010 High Court judgment and has the proper security in place, Arms Officers are being told that the endorsement may be issued and permit to procure issued for the semi automatic they wish to possess as an MSSA.

5. Those people who consider that they have been financially disadvantaged in having to purchase a higher level of security than they now need as a result of the July 2009 communication can write to the Manager Licensing and Vetting, PO Box 3017, Wellington. Any consideration for compensation would require the surrendering of the E endorsement, a return of the semi-automatic to sporting configuration or disposal of the firearm, provision of receipts for security, and surrender of the security to Police.

Yours faithfully

Inspector Joe Green
National manager Licensing and Vetting
Police National Headquarters

[Mr Merde]

Round 1 to the gun owners

rest of the bout to go

[scumdog]

Had my hands on a really original 1939 Luger today - a shame it wasn't mine!

And glad to see the above MSSA info being posted.

Just because somebody has an arbitary 'opinion' does not make it law...

[SMOKEU]

What do the cops do with all the guns they confiscate? I'm keen to get hold of a 12g shotgun on the cheap ay.

[jono035]

I don't really know that that is an entire win... They have basically made it sound like we have gone back to the status quo, which misses out entirely on a large part of what Justice Mallon's decision meant.

Not they say 'integrated stocks' are once again A cat, additional bars or whatever to alter a military pattern free standing pistol grip are still considered E cat and the rest is cleanup/housekeeping on the A-E transition stuff.

Both of these points are easily agreed upon and are the original status quo.

However, what about those stocks that are not military pattern as determined by Justice Mallon as being hardware that is actually in use by a military force somewhere in the world? What about things like a standard M4 style stock but made by Hogue or some other company that doesn't actually supply the military?

[cruza]

Had my hands on a really original 1939 Luger today - a shame it wasn't mine!

And glad to see the above MSSA info being posted.

Just because somebody has an arbitary 'opinion' does not make it law...

Really showed me that the gun lobby groups I thought would make a stand didn't, Glad police aren't going to reverse the free endorsements . Bet there were a bunch of cheap sks hand ins moved ova..............

[jono035]

What do the cops do with all the guns they confiscate? I'm keen to get hold of a 12g shotgun on the cheap ay.

Guillotine. I'm not kidding.

If you want a cheap shotgun, just check trademe. I've seen a few go for $50-100ish for a single or side by side double barrel for lead only shotguns, little bit more for ones that are OK for steel.

[Wolf]

Really showed me that the gun lobby groups I thought would make a stand didn't, Glad police aren't going to reverse the free endorsements . Bet there were a bunch of cheap sks hand ins moved ova..............

Yep, it sorted the wheat from the chaff and the men from the boys. Certainly showed how little credibility some of our so-called gun groups really have.

[Expert]

anybody got any experience of using 'ringed' shells in their shotguns. i was talking to a guy about it the other day cause i wanted to know if solid slugs were better than buckshot for deer. this guy told me he used to cut around the shell just above the brass cap nearly all the way around, just leaving enough so it would hold together. then when you shot it the whole lot would shoot out, casing, wadding, shot everything. said it would go through a steel plate at close range, similar to a deer slug.
any idea if this would stress the chamber more than a deer slug? seemed like a useful dodge if you didn't have any deer slugs.

[cruza]

anybody got any experience of using 'ringed' shells in their shotguns. i was talking to a guy about it the other day cause i wanted to know if solid slugs were better than buckshot for deer. this guy told me he used to cut around the shell just above the brass cap nearly all the way around, just leaving enough so it would hold together. then when you shot it the whole lot would shoot out, casing, wadding, shot everything. said it would go through a steel plate at close range, similar to a deer slug.
any idea if this would stress the chamber more than a deer slug? seemed like a useful dodge if you didn't have any deer slugs.

Sound pretty dangerous , as casing could stop in the barrel.
A safer way is to pour some hot wax into the shot , sets to a semi solid and fires as normal.

[jono035]

Sound pretty dangerous , as casing could stop in the barrel.
A safer way is to pour some hot wax into the shot , sets to a semi solid and fires as normal.

I doubt it would be dangerous because shotguns work at lower pressure and if it shed the casing it wouldn't seal to raise pressures. Also, depending on the overbore of the shotgun, the casing may actually end up loose in the bore.

[Mr Merde]

I thought that using shotguns for hunting other than on private land or for birds, was not allowed in NZ.

[Drunken Monkey]

No, that is not entirely correct. You may not use shotguns (or rimfire) for hunting on DOC land unless authorized by DOC. Unmanaged state forest has no such restrictions, although trying to identify and/or get access to unmanaged forest can be difficult.

[scumdog]

Sound pretty dangerous , as casing could stop in the barrel.
A safer way is to pour some hot wax into the shot , sets to a semi solid and fires as normal.

Tip the shot out of the shell into a saucer, warm it up, ( too hot to touch warm) pour it back into the shell then pour the wax in.

I dunno if I would do this with steel shot though...

[cruza]

Tip the shot out of the shell into a saucer, warm it up, ( too hot to touch warm) pour it back into the shell then pour the wax in.

I dunno if I would do this with steel shot though...

We used to carry some waxed rounds for a fixed choke shottie when spotlighting, as shotshell reloading was more common back then , it was easy to do and we could crimp and close the shell case afterwards.
Have to be careful if you don't recrimp as , flake propellent needs to be compressed for proper ignition.

Yeah I'd be a bit iffy bout steel as well, most factory loads have higher MV and steel has no "give"

[NOWOOL]

Anyone know of where I can get a muzzle break for a M14? I've exhausted web searches trying to locate a dealer that will ship to NZ. Other parts are available to NZ from www.marstar.ca if there's any other NZ m14 owners interested in stocks, mags, etc.

[jono035]

Anyone know of where I can get a muzzle break for a M14? I've exhausted web searches trying to locate a dealer that will ship to NZ. Other parts are available to NZ from www.marstar.ca if there's any other NZ m14 owners interested in stocks, mags, etc.

Muzzle brakes should be pretty generic. I've seen quite a few that will go onto the end of a threaded barrel so that could be an option. Apparently gunworks suppressors have an internal muzzle brake too, but I don't know how well they work.

[cruza]

Anyone know of where I can get a muzzle break for a M14? I've exhausted web searches trying to locate a dealer that will ship to NZ. Other parts are available to NZ from www.marstar.ca if there's any other NZ m14 owners interested in stocks, mags, etc.

Should not be a problem getting one made up. Rod woods(chch) used to make some nice directionable adjustable ones for l1a1, fnfal ,ak's etc and I've seen a gunsmith advertising in the north island too.
I've get one from rob woods and have set it angled one side , too offset ejection . sights stay on target for next shot alot better . tis abit harder on the ears thru

[ManDownUnder]

Had another Mynah icindent this morning... nothing new to report.

Bang, fell over, eel food, happy unmolested sparrows....

[jono035]

I really need to move somewhere that has a deck that I can shoot things from :p

[sAsLEX]

Just back from a couple of months at sea, not enough gunnery though!

Seen in a Hong Kong back alley - 7.62 mini gun for sale

[jono035]

Just back from a couple of months at sea, not enough gunnery though!

Seen in a Hong Kong back alley - 7.62 mini gun for sale

Nice, lemme know when it arrives and I'll whip around with a few hundred rounds to try it out... Can probably only afford about 1/4 of a second burst fire though!

[Wolf]

Had another Mynah icindent this morning... nothing new to report.

Bang, fell over, eel food, happy unmolested sparrows....

That's a little over a week - they're testing your resolve. "Wonder if that bugger's forgotten about us...." BANG! "Guess not, lets try a two-week wait..."

[Expert]

I don't know how to do that quote thing, i'm replying to the guy about the shotgun ringed shells sub-thread.

Oops, i was under the impression shotguns were ok if you were using deer slugs or buckshot. is it down to the shot size or are shotguns a no no alltogether?

[jono035]

I don't know how to do that quote thing, i'm replying to the guy about the shotgun ringed shells sub-thread.

Oops, i was under the impression shotguns were ok if you were using deer slugs or buckshot. is it down to the shot size or are shotguns a no no alltogether?

There is a button under the post you are replying to that says 'Reply with Quote'. Just hit that and start typing and it ends up exactly like this post here.

I think it all depends very much on who you talk to at DOC and which area you are in. I've gotten hunting permits for a couple of places north of Auckland and it has always been absolutely no rimfires or shotguns but with the Waikato office it seemed to be a lot more dependent on where you went. Best thing to do is ring and check, the DOC guys are pretty straight up, all the guys I talked to were hunters as well.

[carver]

There is a button under the post you are replying to that says 'Reply with Quote'. Just hit that and start typing and it ends up exactly like this post here.

I think it all depends very much on who you talk to at DOC and which area you are in. I've gotten hunting permits for a couple of places north of Auckland and it has always been absolutely no rimfires or shotguns but with the Waikato office it seemed to be a lot more dependent on where you went. Best thing to do is ring and check, the DOC guys are pretty straight up, all the guys I talked to were hunters as well.

WTF is up with no rimfires?
I just dont use permits

how can i get more knockdown out of my 22?

[Drunken Monkey]

No rimfires because it's the favoured tool of choice for Wood Pigeon poachers. And yes, I also think this is a weak excuse. The old "what you can't bring in a .22 or shotty to snot Possums, but it's ok for DOC to 1080 bomb the crap out of them?"
As previously, it's not outright banned, but "not without express permission", which can be nigh on impossible around here, but in Otago I believe it's very easy to get a rimfire permit on DOc land if the intent is rabbit control.

[carver]

No rimfires because it's the favoured tool of choice for Wood Pigeon poachers. And yes, I also think this is a weak excuse. The old "what you can't bring in a .22 or shotty to snot Possums, but it's ok for DOC to 1080 bomb the crap out of them?"
As previously, it's not outright banned, but "not without express permission", which can be nigh on impossible around here, but in Otago I believe it's very easy to get a rimfire permit on DOc land if the intent is rabbit control.

interesting, i have 2 .22 LR's and 1x .22 magnum (norinco, and bloody good) and 2x shotgun (12ga and 410)

[jono035]

Yeah, that exactly mirrors my experience so far DM. One of the things mentioned is that in some places the locals have been asked to ring DOC any time they hear shooting that sounds like a shotgun or whatever, so it would seem to be more hassle than it's worth. I mentioned spotlighting some possums because a friend was keen to try it (apparently shooting possums seems more acceptable than bunnies) and they said that it would be fine providing I let them know and was there at night with spotlighting gear etc. but only on the one particular place, nothing for the other locations where they actually had wood pigeon populations...

Edit: Also an interesting difference between Waikato and Auckland/North permits was that the Waikato permit was for anywhere for about a month whereas the Auckland/North permit was for a specific location for a week or 2 but you were sole permit holder so you were the only person allowed onto that area for hunting during that time. Interesting that the 2 are so different.

[Drunken Monkey]

Private land is soooo much better, but unfortunately I don't have access to 2 places I was using previously although a new one *might* be coming up.
Sometimes I think of buying some big arse, worthless, hilly 80 hectare block in the far North just for somewhere to hunt. Then often reality hits, I don't like hunting *that* much (excluding the fact that I don't have that kind of money any more).

[Winston001]

Interesting http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/afghanistan/article7135496.ece

[Drunken Monkey]

I'd have to agree with a lot of those comments, it was a pretty poorly researched article.

[sAsLEX]

I'd have to agree with a lot of those comments, it was a pretty poorly researched article.

There is vast amounts of research going in to the calibre debate, see a lot in the Janes magazines I get at work.

Of note the new long range kill has been taken by a .338 showing size is not everything.

For those of you that have not yet heard, there is a published report about a new ‘longest kill’ record (at least for unclassified operations) performed by a British sniper Craig Harrison in November 2009. Actually it was two kills on Taliban machine gunners in Afghanistan. The distance was a GPS measured 2706 yards (2475 meters) or 1.56 miles away. Perhaps the more interesting thing about these kills is that they were performed using the L115A3 which is the Accuracy International Super Magnum chambered in 338 Lapua. Most of the 2000+ meter kills, including the previous record set by Rob Furlong, of Princess Patricia’s Canadian Light Infantry, were done using .50 BMG rifles. This does show the long range potential of the 338 Lapua cartridge, especially with the specially developed high power load that the UK uses, though Craig Harrison did admit it was perfect conditions with no wind.

[Drunken Monkey]

Granted .338 lapua isn't small fry either, and it's long flat trajectory is well known.

Someone was selling a Remington 700 in .300 win mag the other day, that would be fun too. We really need to set up a 600m - 1200m range somewhere and have some real (gun nerd) fun. Bah, I waste too much money on guns I don't use enough as it is.

Speaking of which, Mr Merde must be able to give us an update on the new range's progress by now...

(PS - I'm just jealous of the AWP whore)

[jono035]

I had a look around at family/friends farms in northland a couple of years back on google maps to try find one with some space to do some real long range shooting, it was actually a bloody difficult ask to find that even had that kind of space on them, never mind one usable as a shooting range!

The couple that were even big enough with clear open spaces ended up with houses that were in or near the firing line.

[Drunken Monkey]

There's only one thing for it, we have to organise a group trip to the Otago high country. We can spend a week out there target shooting, hunting and talking crap.

[jono035]

There's only one thing for it, we have to organise a group trip to the Otago high country. We can spend a week out there target shooting, hunting and talking crap.

Sounds good, would need a couple of months to knock out this bastard of a thesis and then a couple more months to get some cash together to get an appropriate rifle...

Edit: I sure with enough browbeating would could get Chris down there to actually prove some of his BP 'tall tales'!

[sAsLEX]

Granted .338 lapua isn't small fry either, and it's long flat trajectory is well known.


But it is like half the size for a complete round, that counts when you are humping it round.


of note this picture came up when I searched .338 vs .50
<img src=http://mi3.com.ua/uploads/photos/2008/03/18/10_albums_5_videos_3gp_lime_338_4_mirrors10.jpg>

[jono035]

That's some truly horrible wallpaper...

[Mr Merde]

That's some truly horrible wallpaper...

He is a sailor,let him get what ever he can after all those months at sea.

www.realgirls.com (http://www.realgirls.com) is probably a good place to start.

[Swoop]

That's some truly horrible wallpaper...
Russia does some really terrible "decor"... But only for the peasants of course. Go Communism!
The Moscow underground is something quite different though.

[Tank]

Well - first time Ive really come in and had a good look at this thread - tis pretty good.

Im just getting back into shooting since doing it with the old man back when I was a young 'un.

Got the licence the other day and picked up my son a nice wee Ruger 10 22 and threw on a redfield site. He gets to shoot it for the first time this weekend.

Me - Ive been pistol shooting at CSI and from this coming weekend at the Navy range out Whangaparoa.

On the rifle front - got nothing for myself as yet but have a friend with some nice bits. Have been having fun with some H+K 223's as well as some long distance with a .338

In July heading down to gunslingers for long distance shooting comp - and will be using a Barrett .50cal. That Im looking forward to.

Other than that will post some pics a little later. In the meantime - he is a quick vid of the boy having some fun out Southhead.

<object width="480" height="385"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/X3rPCdXNluw&hl=en_US&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/X3rPCdXNluw&hl=en_US&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="480" height="385"></embed></object>

Sorry about the quality - done on the phone - will try to get some better stuff later this weekend

[Mr Merde]

Welcome Tank.

We talk a lot of bull on this thread but occasionally there is some good stuff.

Nice vid of your young un. What i like to see is the next generation taking up my sport.

Chris

[Tank]

Welcome Tank.

We talk a lot of bull on this thread but occasionally there is some good stuff.

Nice vid of your young un. What i like to see is the next generation taking up my sport.

Chris

Yep - he hope to collect his first deer on Sunday - he is well and truly hooked.

Signed up on the nsa forums today also. Wanna pick up the E cat licence and interesting reading on there. currently reading up on the 1 for 1 policy (bastards)

[Wolf]

Welcome to the thread Tank. As a fellow father of impressionable kids with a healthy interest in firearms, I can well imagine how proud you must be of your boy.

[Mr Merde]

Yep - he hope to collect his first deer on Sunday - he is well and truly hooked.

Signed up on the nsa forums today also. Wanna pick up the E cat licence and interesting reading on there. currently reading up on the 1 for 1 policy (bastards)

I had feeling that new person signing on was your good self. The names were too similar.

So welcome to the NSA site also.

Chris

[Winston001]

I'd have to agree with a lot of those comments, it was a pretty poorly researched article.

I don't think its an article ie. something which was researched, but rather a piece of direct reporting. I'd have thought the coalition forces would know the Afghans have been sharpshooters for 150 years, and carried some M16s at least. I like this comment though because I've always been puzzled by sheer American firepower:


Solution : Teach all soldiers how to shoot accurately with semi-automatic weapons and issue the G3 with decent optics. Stop reliance on large volumes of full auto fire by all with a light round. You then have penetration / range / fire discipline and don't need to carry huge amounts of ammo. I have used both 7.62 and 5.56 and never used full-auto unless it was belt-fed area coverage.

[jono035]

I don't think its an article ie. something which was researched, but rather a piece of direct reporting. I'd have thought the coalition forces would know the Afghans have been sharpshooters for 150 years, and carried some M16s at least. I like this comment though because I've always been puzzled by sheer American firepower:

Always beware those proclaiming a simple answer to a complex situation, chances are they don't know what they're talking about.

[Drunken Monkey]

Direct reporting? Like the simple mistake of saying Russians used AK-47's in the Russo-Afghan war? (amongst other rubbish) - I don't think so. It was rubbish written by some knob end pretending to be a journalist, pure and simple.
The editor should be ashamed of themselves as well.

Maybe you want to clarify/elaborate your post Winston001?

[Swoop]

Direct reporting? Like the simple mistake of saying Russians used AK-47's in the Russo-Afghan war?
Easily mistaken for AK-74 pattern rifles though.

[pritch]

I have been lucky enough to shoot on some pretty cool ranges, and some pretty crap ones too I guess, but this'd take the cake...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nyq90LEZe4k

[jono035]

Wow, that's pretty impressive.

http://translate.google.co.nz/translate?js=y&prev=_t&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&layout=1&eotf=1&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.mszu.de%2F&sl=de&tl=en

That's a link to the google translation of the range's website...

They have 300m, 100m rifle ranges, all underground... Rated for up to 17kJ which is pretty much everything up to hot .50BMG loads...
25m pistol range rated up to 7kJ, which is a little less than twice what you get out of a .500 S&W Magnum...

[Swoop]

Chortle. No mention of the barrel underlugs shearing off...


The British Army, underfunded and lacking massive injections of new equipment for several years now, has managed to forge ahead in both Iraq and Afghanistan on its well-deserved reputation for professionalism and discipline. But the equipment and money crisis has affected weapons systems and equipment from aircraft, and now, all the way down to small arms.
The 9mm Browning Hi-Power automatic, designated the L9A1 in the British military, has been the Brits' standard issue sidearm since 1954, when it replaced the .38 Enfield revolver. Even this elderly pistol can still be found in service. Prince Harry famously sported one tucked into his body armor in a photo shot while he was serving in Afghanistan. But it was the British LRDG (Long Range Desert Groups) in World War II that had started the trend of using the 9mm Hi-Power, a decade before that pistol was adopted by the entire British Army.

The Hi-Power has long been considered a durable, accurate, reliable pistol that packs a lot of man-stopping power, making it perfect for urban or anti-terrorism warfighting. The SAS CRW (Special Air Service Counter Revolutionary Wing), who executed the famous 1980 hostage rescue at the Iranian Embassy made the Browning Hi-Power famous due to their groundbreaking development of close-quarter battle techniques using the pistol. The British have carried the Browning in conflicts ranging from the Falkland Islands mountains to the streets of Northern Ireland.

The Hi-Power is still produced, by Browning in the U.S. and Fabrique Nationale in Europe. Despite being over 50 years old, the handgun, like the 1911A1 .45, is far from being considered obsolete. The problem, for the British Army, however, is that the Brownings in circulation within the British Army are often older than the men who use them. Pistols are sometimes 20 or 30 years old. While the British have upgraded their standard issue assault rifle, the SA80, and their squad automatic weapon, the L86A2, and other infantry weapons over the course of the last 50 years, little to no attention has been paid to either finding a new sidearm or purchasing newer versions of the L9A1. Meanwhile, the companies that produce the L9A1 offer upgraded, more modern Hi-Power models. Thus, aside from a few special ops units, the majority of British officers are stuck using well-worn, beat-up 9mms that are not aging well. Reliable weapon though it may be, a 30 year-old pistol that has been issued to, and used by, dozens of officers, and spent a lot of time outdoors, is not going to be as reliable as a newer sidearm. Troops are often wary of using such equipment, knowing that a malfunction or a jam in an old handgun could very well cost them their lives in combat.

Serious attention to the handgun problem is only recently creeping into the British military. The Special Air Service recently transitioned away from the Hi-Power and adopted the Sig-Sauer P226 9mm as their standard sidearm, and a smaller compact pistol for undercover operations. Other units like the Special Reconnaissance Regiment likely have more latitude in their choice of, and access to, newer sidearms in better working condition.

Instead of gradually phasing out the Hi-Power or purchasing a newer model of the weapon, the British government, unsurprisingly, seems content to ignore the problem until it can no longer be ignored.

[Tank]

Awesome shooting day yesterday - thought I would share. (ok brag)

Started early morning Brekkie in Manly at the cafe under the Thai. (bloody awesome - well recommended) - then out to the Navy range at the end of Whangaparoa. Possibly the most scenic range anywhere.

Did some pistol shooting on active targets - two shooters to drop three targets then first to shoot the middle one wins - brilliant fun (and I won the majority of 'races' - sweeeeeeet).

Was using a glock 17 - nice standard pistol, and when my B cat finally comes thru - probably what I will end up with. I know there are nicer ones out there - but fuck the Glock just keeps on going and going.

Anyway - home for lunch and a quick snooze.

There out to Southhead for a quick Deer hunt. Son (13) bagged his first deer (@100m) and humped it out of the valley. Was one really proud dad !

Back at the hut - One of the blokes had some other venison prepped from another trip - so fired up a pan and had a good feed under the stars. Son sitting there - blood all down back from the Deer and a grin from ear to ear knocking back food from the pan - sounds 'girlish' but was a really awesome picture - something I dont think I will ever forget.

Not many places in the world that can one enjoy a day like that.

Appreciate what we have here in NZ and dont let the bastards take it away!

[Tank]

Are there any Auckland (Near Northshore pref) guys on here that reload ammo who would be happy to teach a total noob? Happy to pay in beer.

Have picked up a book, watched youtube - but actually doing some with someone will really help the learning process.

[jono035]

Are there any Auckland (Near Northshore pref) guys on here that reload ammo who would be happy to teach a total noob? Happy to pay in beer.

Have picked up a book, watched youtube - but actually doing some with someone will really help the learning process.

I'm in Mt Eden and I'd be happy to show you through the process and let you have a play with the gear. I currently reload for 9mm and .44 magnum on a single-stage press (Lee Breech Lock Challenger). Also have a very basic bullet casting setup courtesy of Mr Merde if that is of interest...

[The Pastor]

Are there any Auckland (Near Northshore pref) guys on here that reload ammo who would be happy to teach a total noob? Happy to pay in beer.

Have picked up a book, watched youtube - but actually doing some with someone will really help the learning process.

have you got a reloading kit?

[Indiana_Jones]

have you got a reloading kit?

What he said ^^^

-Indy

[The Pastor]

I think i got my kit from http://www.midsouthshooterssupply.com - i got the 50th anniverasry kit which is really good. It has the powder measure thing which saves A LOT of time. I think they have the kit there listed for $98 American. Which is way cheaper than what ever you're going to get quoted in NZ.

[jono035]

I think i got my kit from http://www.midsouthshooterssupply.com - i got the 50th anniverasry kit which is really good. It has the powder measure thing which saves A LOT of time. I think they have the kit there listed for $98 American. Which is way cheaper than what ever you're going to get quoted in NZ.

What did it cost you all up including shipping? Mine cost $250incl, shipped.

[The Pastor]

Yeah it was very close to that price, including dies etc

[jono035]

Yeah it was very close to that price, including dies etc

Including dies that's pretty damn good then. I paid an extra $120 for my dies...

[ManDownUnder]

I think i got my kit from http://www.midsouthshooterssupply.com - i got the 50th anniverasry kit which is really good. It has the powder measure thing which saves A LOT of time. I think they have the kit there listed for $98 American. Which is way cheaper than what ever you're going to get quoted in NZ.
That's an outstanding price...!

I got mine (same kit) for NZ$500 a while bacik - dies were extra $120/set

[Tank]

have you got a reloading kit?

Not as yet - in the process of researching what to get

[Tank]

I'm in Mt Eden and I'd be happy to show you through the process and let you have a play with the gear. I currently reload for 9mm and .44 magnum on a single-stage press (Lee Breech Lock Challenger). Also have a very basic bullet casting setup courtesy of Mr Merde if that is of interest...

Awesome - you have a PM coming.

[Indiana_Jones]

Not as yet - in the process of researching what to get

Well I'm sure RM & Jonno will be more the willing to show you how it works.

I would offer to show you, but my press isn't set up (at my folks place at the moment, haven't had the chance to get it sorted)

-Indy

[jono035]

Well I'm sure RM & Jonno will be more the willing to show you how it works.

I would offer to show you, but my press isn't set up (at my folks place at the moment, haven't had the chance to get it sorted)

-Indy

*facepalm*

Btw, stop stroking your Mosin when people are drinking at your flat, it scares the girls and gives the rest of us a bad name.

[Indiana_Jones]

*facepalm*

Btw, stop stroking your Mosin when people are drinking at your flat, it scares the girls and gives the rest of us a bad name.

wanna hug it out bro?

-Indy

[Drunken Monkey]

For most people, stroking the mosin would be a code phrase. Sadly for Indy, it is not.

[The Pastor]

wanna hug it out bro?

-Indy

you have got to stop your drunken "hugs" no means no!

[jono035]

For most people, stroking the mosin would be a code phrase. Sadly for Indy, it is not.

Pretty similar end result though...

[Swoop]

12 dead in England overnight.
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/world/news/article.cfm?c_id=2&objectid=10649387

It is interesting that the article states that there is virtually no gun crime there, and then states that around 100 die each year due to firearms.
So much for their fabulous banning of firearms.

[jono035]

12 dead in England overnight.
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/world/news/article.cfm?c_id=2&objectid=10649387

It is interesting that the article states that there is virtually no gun crime there, and then states that around 100 die each year due to firearms.
So much for their fabulous banning of firearms.

Hmmmm well 100 firearm MURDERS each year in a population that is 15x higher than ours means we should see 6-7 by that token...
That's .167 murders per 100k people per year...
Our firearm death rate is 2.6 according to wikipedia, but only 0.17 of that is homicides, the rest are suicides and a few accidental deaths mixed in... Similarly, the England/Wales shows up as 0.38 total firearm deaths per 100k per year but 0.15 is homicide, 0.2 suicide, 0.03 accidental...

So I guess they shouldn't be saying virtually no gun crime, they should be saying fuckall access to firearms means you have less people hunting so less accidental deaths, way less suicides by firearm (with the overall suicide rate being the same though, they just find other ways) and a homicide rate that is the same...

Oh, good? *sigh*

[Swoop]

they should be saying fuckall access to firearms...

I'm not sure about that. With fairly open borders into europe, access to eastern block firearms is straightforward.
An ex girlfriend lived in south London and went to sleep to the sweet sounds of gunfire a lot of the time.

[jono035]

I'm not sure about that. With fairly open borders into europe, access to eastern block firearms is straightforward.
An ex girlfriend lived in south London and went to sleep to the sweet sounds of gunfire a lot of the time.

My bad, I should have said fuckall legal access to firearms (and the corresponding increases in access to illegal firearms that this has no doubt brought around)...

[Mr Merde]

I'm not sure about that. With fairly open borders into europe, access to eastern block firearms is straightforward.
An ex girlfriend lived in south London and went to sleep to the sweet sounds of gunfire a lot of the time.

I lived in Cardiff for 23 years. In that time I was offered an M16 with 1/2 dozen 30 rnd clips of ammo, a Russian special forces pistol with silencer (5.4 mm), a .25 semi auto pistol, a Spanish copy of the 1911 about 1/2 sized in 7.65mm, numerous shotguns, a few rifles and a full operating machine gun (Vickers).

A lot of these were offered post 1996.

Cardiff is\was a major port in the UK.

Personally I bought a Ubertti copy of a Colt 1851 cap and ball revolver in France, where black powder fireartms need no licence to buy, and carried it back into the UK. It sat there for 15 years until I bought it to NEw Zealand.

I remeber about 15 years ago nthere was a raging gun battle down in the Cardiff docks. West Indian gangs (the Yardies) shooting at each other over the bonnet of their respective cars.

I had my life threatened by someone I banned from my pub for smoking dope at the bar. Turns out he had just spent 15 years inside for shooting a bookie with a 12 guage.

Britian has always been violent.

[jono035]

Yeah and with some of the social problems and so on that I keep hearing reports of from my relatives over there, if anything it is only going to get worse...

When I was there we drove up to Scotland for a week. On the way back we drove past a rest stop while listening to radio reports about how 2 feuding gypsy families had battled it out there a few hours earlier. Several people hospitalised and a couple killed from memory, weapons of choice being sledge hammers and machetes... Bit of an eye opener.

[sAsLEX]

Any limit on magazine size for bolt actions .22 like the 77/22 for example?

Got a Dad in the gunshops in the states where they are much cheaper than here....

[ManDownUnder]

Any limit on magazine size for bolt actions .22 like the 77/22 for example?

Got a Dad in the gunshops in the states where they are much cheaper than here....

Yup - 15 shots. Also... exporting ANYTHING gun related out of the US needs to be done with caution... people have found themselves in all sorts of bother because they didn't get the appropriate ECCN then export license etc etc etc. It's a risk... better to buy and post it but then I'm sure anything coming into NZ that's against the rules here could get exciting too...

[sAsLEX]

Yup - 15 shots. Also... exporting ANYTHING gun related out of the US needs to be done with caution... people have found themselves in all sorts of bother because they didn't get the appropriate ECCN then export license etc etc etc. It's a risk... better to buy and post it but then I'm sure anything coming into NZ that's against the rules here could get exciting too...

15 is for Semi - I was referring to the BOLT ACTION 77/22 ?

[The Pastor]

15 is for Semi - I was referring to the BOLT ACTION 77/22 ?

no limit on bolt action mag capaisty as far as i am aware.

[jono035]

No limit for bolt actions, but be very careful owning cross-compatible mags...

If you've got a 30 round mag and it'll fit a 10/22 then you're technically in violation...

[Mr Merde]

There is no limit on magazine size for bolt action.

The 15 round limit applies to semi auto rifles only

You could purchase a 50 or even a 100 round mag for the 77/22 and as long as you dont have a 10/22 you would be perfectly legal.

[ManDownUnder]

no limit on bolt action mag capaisty as far as i am aware.

No limit for bolt actions

There is no limit on magazine size for bolt action. The 15 round limit applies to semi auto rifles only

I just triple checked and stand very much corrected!

I maintain that exporting anything firearms related out of the US is a precarious process though... be careful and get it right.

[jono035]

I maintain that exporting anything firearms related out of the US is a precarious process though... be careful and get it right.

Yeah, that's for sure :|

Technically you're still legal to the letter of the law if you own a 10/22 and have a high capacity magazine for it, providing it is never fitted but I think there may be some common law there that shows the opposite.

Either way, I'd be vary careful and cagey when it comes to having a >15 round mag anywhere near a 10/22... It's not that it's illegal straight off, it's that if you end up with something going wrong, then it's just one more thing they can use as leverage against you...

[Drunken Monkey]

Case law is the term you're looking for Jono, not common law.

Had a link before to the article, can't find it at the moment, but NZ police successfully prosecuted a person.

[jono035]

Case law is the term you're looking for Jono, not common law.

Had a link before to the article, can't find it at the moment, but NZ police successfully prosecuted a person.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Common_law

A friend of mine who is a lawyer refers to it as common law, so I'm sticking with it :)

[Drunken Monkey]

I do believe you have not only proven yourself correct, but also managed to show that I was not incorrect at the same time :)

*hugs*

[jono035]

I do believe you have not only proven yourself correct, but also managed to show that I was not incorrect at the same time :)

*hugs*

Lol, I am the wikipedia ninja :p

[Mr Merde]

Lol, I am the wikipedia ninja :p

Does any one else on this forum find this strangely disturbing and sad?

[Mr Merde]

E-mail today.

The custom mould for my 32-40 has arrived.

BP mould throwing a 170 gn projectile with 1:20 lead tin mix.

Now I need to get loading dies. EBAY here I come.

Also now have 150 pieces of brass. Should keep me going for a long while.

[Indiana_Jones]

Does any one else on this forum find this strangely disturbing and sad?

Very sad...

Time to get him a tweed jacket and a Mosin to stroke....

-Indy

[Indiana_Jones]

<img src="http://www.grouchyoldcripple.com/archives/looting.JPG">

-Indy

[Mr Merde]

I like it.

Unfortunately here the AOS would be all over us shooting unarmed innocent civilians.

We cant take that risk for societies sake.

[jono035]

Very sad...

Time to get him a tweed jacket and a Mosin to stroke....

-Indy

Argh! Fate worse than death! Fate worse than death!

I'll reform, I promise...

[Mr Merde]

To reform you must promise to restrict yourself to no more that 2 hours a time at that evil page "Wikipaedia"

[Mr Merde]

nosler manfacturing plant suffered a major explosion that has left a part of the plant collapsed . no one was injured

<!-- m -->http://www.google.com/search?q=nosler+b ... CCMQsQQwAA (http://www.google.com/search?q=nosler+bullet+plant&hl=en&client=firefox-a&hs=8JN&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&prmd=n&source=univ&tbs=nws:1&tbo=u&ei=bWUITIf9K4qINNzpiLYE&sa=X&oi=news_group&ct=title&resnum=1&ved=0CCMQsQQwAA)<!-- m -->

<!-- m -->http://kohd.com/news/local/176470 (http://kohd.com/news/local/176470)<!-- m -->

if you use them better stock up fast

[Winston001]

Case law is the term you're looking for Jono, not common law.


Actually Jono is correct. The common law is law which has evolved over centuries of court cases. It is the quiet sister of statutory law which is made by parliament. For example you will not find a statute which specifically sets out the rules and limitations of suing someone who smashes your bike. That right comes from common law - an entitlement to claim damages from someone who has wronged you.

[Drunken Monkey]

Actually Jono is correct. The common law is law which has evolved over centuries of court cases. It is the quiet sister of statutory law which is made by parliament. For example you will not find a statute which specifically sets out the rules and limitations of suing someone who smashes your bike. That right comes from common law - an entitlement to claim damages from someone who has wronged you.

Snap! And the "I missed the rest of this conversation/slowest response" prize goes to...Winston001 !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[sAsLEX]

Crikey this rust stuff can strike fast! Over night fast in fact!

Was out wandering about with the rifle on the weekend and had some rust form on the outside of the barrel and on the bolt handle overnight! Never had it happen that fast, and especially not on this rifle before!

[jono035]

Crikey this rust stuff can strike fast! Over night fast in fact!

Was out wandering about with the rifle on the weekend and had some rust form on the outside of the barrel and on the bolt handle overnight! Never had it happen that fast, and especially not on this rifle before!

Which rifle? The bolt handle on the 10/22 had a couple of spots of rust on it after I cleaned it a little too vigorously once. A quick spray of WD40, leave i for a few hours and then buff it off with a rag normally works for me.

[sAsLEX]

The .308 with the "Durable satin black oxide metal finish "

[scumdog]

Which rifle? The bolt handle on the 10/22 had a couple of spots of rust on it after I cleaned it a little too vigorously once. A quick spray of WD40, leave i for a few hours and then buff it off with a rag normally works for me.

Norfeyeland acid rain I reckon....

[Winston001]

Snap! And the "I missed the rest of this conversation/slowest response" prize goes to...Winston001 !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

My bad. On dial-up at the moment and missed a complete page. Mea culpa. :D

[jono035]

Norfeyeland acid rain I reckon....

Must be!


My bad. On dial-up at the moment and missed a complete page. Mia culpa. :D

No worries, I always appreciate people agreeing with me, it happens far too seldom!

[carver]

dont store your gun in a gun bag, that is where it rusts worse cause it "sweats"

[ManDownUnder]

Don't know how true it is but I hear a gunbag made of clean but untreated sheepskin works well. The lanolin in the wool (wool side in) keeps the outside gun oiled all the time so when it gets wet it's less of/not an issue.

Can anyone here confirm/correct that?

[Tank]

You could purchase a 50 or even a 100 round mag for the 77/22 and as long as you dont have a 10/22 you would be perfectly legal.

If you did this - could you take them to the police (separate) and then request to have the 10 / 22 to be re-classified as a a e-cat ?

BTW - Mr Merde - how goes the battle on the 1 for 1 e-cat hand in?

[jono035]

If you did this - could you take them to the police (separate) and then request to have the 10 / 22 to be re-classified as a a e-cat ?

BTW - Mr Merde - how goes the battle on the 1 for 1 e-cat hand in?

Yeah, this is exactly the way that it works (assuming you have an E-endorsement, which requires vetting and an appropriate safe). A hand-in of another E-cat rifle would be required at the same time (I've even heard tell of the police requiring the hand-in rifle be similar).

Bear in mind that under current interpretation, only E-endorsement holders are allowed to be in control of a E-cat firearm, so technically you could be prosecuted for letting one of your kids or friends take a turn shooting it, even if it was in sporting configuration at the time (10-15 round mag for a 10/22) and you were standing by... At least, that's how I was told it works when I was considering getting my E endorsement at the same time as my B. I have no personal experience with it so someone else may want to correct me if I'm in the weeds!

I haven't seen anything further on the NSA website about the 1 for 1 E-cat handin, but there is a guy who is going through the process at the moment with NSA help and in theory should be hearing back quite soon as to how things are progressing.

I really recommend chipping in the pittance for an NSA membership, the forums are pretty active and we all have a good laugh over there too!

Edit: I really recommend! Was going to write 'can't recommend it enough' but forgot the enough part, making it sound like I didn't recommend it. I do recommend it, NSA is doing very good work and more support can only help!

[Swoop]

Russia is preparing a new standard assault rifle, the AK-200. This weapon is based on the 5.45mm AK-74, which replaced the 7.62mm AK-47/AKM series as the standard infantry weapon towards the end of the Cold War. The AK-74 entered service in the 1970s, and twenty years later a replacement was developed, the AN-94. This rifle used the 5.45mm round first seen in the AK-74, but was able to use larger (45-round and 60-round) magazines. The AN-94 also had burst fire (of two rounds, while Western rifles tend to use three rounds).
The AN-94 was supposed to replace all AK-74s in Russian service, but due to the dissolution of the Soviet Union in 1991, and sharp cuts in the defense budget, this did not happen. There were also concerns about the mechanical complexity and reliability of the AN-94. That's apparently why the AK-200 is not based on the AN-94. One AN-94 feature that was adopted for the AK-200 was a 60 round magazine.

Meanwhile, an improved AK-74M was introduced in 1991, and is still in service. This is a 3.4 kg (7.5 pound), 94.3 cm (37.1 inch) weapon with a 41.5 cm (16.3 inch barrel). It has rails for sights and such, and can use a 30 or 45 round magazine. Rate of fire is 650 RPM on full auto, and max effective range was 600 meters. The AK-74 looked like an AK-47, and used the same technology. Some five million AK-74s were built, most before the Cold War ended in 1991. North Korea manufactures a copy of the AK-74, called the Type 98. The AK-74M is the basis for the AK-200, and the two weapons are very similar, with the new rifle having more flexibility and capacity for accessories.

Meanwhile, several additional AK-74 variants have been developed and put on the market. The AK-101 fires the 5.56mm NATO round and has a 30-round clip. The AK-103 fires the 7.62x39mm round used in the original AK-47, for those who have concerns about the ability of the 5.45mm round to stop enemy troops. The AK-102, 104, and 105 are compact rifles designed for the export market in 5.56mm NATO, 7.62x39mm, and 5.45x39mm. All have 30-round magazines.

[The Pastor]

so i was at the pub and some guy was going on about only allowed 2 rounds of ammo? is this for a c cat?

[jono035]

so i was at the pub and some guy was going on about only allowed 2 rounds of ammo? is this for a c cat?

Unless it was some specific kind of ammo (explosive or something) that couldn't be held on an A-cat then I'm not sure what the hell he would have been on about.

I guess I could believe there being restrictions on having lots of rounds of a type of explosive ammo, 2 being enough to have as demonstration/show items. I'm also not sure how tracer ammo is handled, I know you can buy tracer bullets (SAI has a massive box of em, keep meaning to buy a handful as a curiosity) but I'm not sure about complete rounds...

[Mr Merde]

so i was at the pub and some guy was going on about only allowed 2 rounds of ammo? is this for a c cat?

Firstly,

What were you doing at a pub. Are you of age?

Secondly how can they restrict C cat ammo.
A working Bren Gun is C cat. It fires the .303 British round. Standard round for the SMLE.
Same for most machine and sub machine guns. They all fire a standard round for the particular country they are in use with.

Not sure about cannons and howitzers or mortars. Are you allowed to own live 105mm rounds?


Would I want to have live 6" rounds in my house. No

H&K MP5 uses the 9 x 21 mm round. Standard 9mm

Ma Deuce uses the standard .50BMG

I know of someone who has a 40mm Bofors gun. It wouldnt supprise me if he had live ammo. He also has 20mm Oilerkon and I guess he has live ammo for that also.

I think that person was just blowing smoke rings up your jacksee.

Maybe you misheard and what he really said was he only had two rounds and wanted to give them both to you . ;-0

[jono035]

Not sure about cannons and howitzers or mortars. Are you allowed to own live 105mm rounds?

Would I want to have live 6" rounds in my house. No

House? No. C-cat storage bunker out the back? HELL yes.

[Mr Merde]

House? No. C-cat storage bunker out the back? HELL yes.

Come the revolution evryone is to assemble ta Jono's residence where he will protect us with his hoard of munitions.

Remember the order is

Bubble, line, level, line, bubble.

[jono035]

Come the revolution evryone is to assemble ta Jono's residence where he will protect us with his hoard of munitions.

I'd love to have a hoard of munitions, my problem is I use them up too quickly!

[Mr Merde]

On another note.

My mate in the UK phoned me last night.

He is sending me 6 hexagonal cast bullets for the Whitworth rifle so that I can try it out.

He also informed me that he now has to go on a 2 day "Health and Safety" course so that he is able to fire black powder muzzle loading firearms.

He has been shooting them competitively for 30 years. He has even built his own rifles and cannons.

His father is captain of the British Muzzle Loading team.

Duh.

[jono035]

On another note.

My mate in the UK phoned me last night.

He is sending me 6 hexagonal cast bullets for the Whitworth rifle so that I can try it out.

He also informed me that he now has to go on a 2 day "Health and Safety" course so that he is able to fire black powder muzzle loading firearms.

He has been shooting them competitively for 30 years. He has even built his own rifles and cannons.

His father is captain of the British Muzzle Loading team.

Duh.

Hahaha, beauracracy at its finest.

Let me know when you plan to have a pop with the rifle, I'd be keen to come take a look.

[The Pastor]

Firstly,

What were you doing at a pub. Are you of age?

Secondly how can they restrict C cat ammo.
A working Bren Gun is C cat. It fires the .303 British round. Standard round for the SMLE.
Same for most machine and sub machine guns. They all fire a standard round for the particular country they are in use with.



I stole andrews ID.

A working bren gun is illigal, refer to section 32b of the arms act


Conditions of endorsements

*

(1) It is a condition of every endorsement made under section 30 that the holder of the firearms licence—
o

(a) observes, in respect of every pistol or restricted weapon or part of a restricted weapon in his possession, such security precautions as are required by regulations made under this Act; and
o

(b) ensures that every restricted weapon in his possession is both rendered inoperable by the removal of a vital part and maintained, by reason of the removal of a vital part, in an inoperable condition.


this guy was an american who said he read it somewhere, i never heard of it before, and can't find it anywhere so i think he was mis informed

[jono035]

I stole andrews ID.

A working bren gun is illigal, refer to section 32b of the arms act

this guy was an american who said he read it somewhere, i never heard of it before, and can't find it anywhere so i think he was mis informed

The guy is misinformed or talking shit.

And Chris is quite right, C-cat firearms are working firearms that must be deliberately rendered inoperable. Replace the part and away they would go. You can't just grab one out of the safe, stick a full mag in and blaze away, but they're working firearms and no mistake.

[Mr Merde]

this guy was an american ....


There is your problem in 5 words

[The Pastor]

I like americans, they like bikes, guns and beer! and useally all mixed together!

[jono035]

http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o235/OlSkool_photos/ShotGun/Image7.jpg

Mossberg 12G pump on the back...
Springfield 1911 on the pannier...

It's a little bit out there for my taste, though....

[sAsLEX]

Who else got a nice letter today from Mr W Olphert?


Seems the Independent Police Conduct Authority do listen..... well at least send back a letter, which goes in to the details of the case in PN and Justice Mallon held that the police interpretation was incorrect!

[Mr Merde]

Who else got a nice letter today from Mr W Olphert?


Seems the Independent Police Conduct Authority do listen..... well at least send back a letter, which goes in to the details of the case in PN and Justice Mallon held that the police interpretation was incorrect!

Tell me more please

[sAsLEX]

Tell me more please

I complained to the IPCA that the fact that my rifle had been reclassified as an MSSA, not in accordance with the law but with an interpretation of the police.

210111

[jono035]

They're definitely holding the 'return to status quo' line pretty strongly which is a little bit disingenuous. That kinda pisses me off, given that the decision of Justice Mallon invalidated their interpretation since the beginning of the implementation of the MSSA system.

[Wolf]

I complained to the IPCA that the fact that my rifle had been reclassified as an MSSA, not in accordance with the law but with an interpretation of the police.

210111
So, the letter's saying "thanks for complaining that you were unfairly treated by the incorrect interpretation enacted by the police, we are not going to do anything about it"?

[jono035]

So, the letter's saying "thanks for complaining that you were unfairly treated by the incorrect interpretation enacted by the police, we are not going to do anything about it"?

It's saying 'thanks for complaining, we're just going to forget the entire thing and pretend it didn't happen, carry on please', all the while hoping that you don't realise that Justice Mallon's decision actually renders a wide swathe of firearms that were E-cat before the reinterpretation debacle back to A-cat where they should be. I bet they won't be sending letters out to those people.

Just need someone to try it out...

[sAsLEX]

It's saying 'thanks for complaining, we're just going to forget the entire thing and pretend it didn't happen, carry on please', all the while hoping that you don't realise that Justice Mallon's decision actually renders a wide swathe of firearms that were E-cat before the reinterpretation debacle back to A-cat where they should be. I bet they won't be sending letters out to those people.

Just need someone to try it out...

Put a fake trademe auction up for a new "A" class rifle and see if they take it down.....

[jono035]

Put a fake trademe auction up for a new "A" class rifle and see if they take it down.....

Yeah, but that's just seeing what tardme thinks and arguing the finer points of Justice Mallon's decision with them seems like a pointless exercise. Needs someone to do it with a Hogue furnished AR pattern rifle or similar...

[PirateJafa]

A gun for someone without a firearms license:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H23HDHRVjpA

Pretty neat, but whenever I get to the end with that shit, I can never find that last fucking piece that I saw JUST A GODDAMN MINUTE AGO WHEN I DIDN'T NEED IT AUGH!

[sAsLEX]

Looking through some suppliers at work and thought this would be cool for your range Merde - http://baledefence.com/sniper_moving_target.htm

[jono035]

Looking through some suppliers at work and thought this would be cool for your range Merde - http://baledefence.com/sniper_moving_target.htm

I thought about making something like that a while back but simpler, just a basic line following wheeled robot with a car battery in it. Would be much easier to set up, just spraypaint a line on the ground and away it'd go.

[sAsLEX]

I thought about making something like that a while back but simpler, just a basic line following wheeled robot with a car battery in it. Would be much easier to set up, just spraypaint a line on the ground and away it'd go.

So optical tracking is simplier than a rail?

Engineer!

[jono035]

So optical tracking is simplier than a rail?

Engineer!

Lol, simpler from the point of view of taking it out and setting it up then taking it down again. Also simpler for me to make! I can't be having with no crazy rail contraptions...

[sAsLEX]

Lol, simpler from the point of view of taking it out and setting it up then taking it down again. Also simpler for me to make! I can't be having with no crazy rail contraptions...

To be honest an IPT wire acting as a guide would be cheaper to implement, and I think easier, than optical.......

[jono035]

To be honest an IPT wire acting as a guide would be cheaper to implement, and I think easier, than optical.......

Yeah, same system as used by some random disneyworld ride I think. I know just enough about implementing an IPT system to know that I want to stay the hell clear of it ;)

[sAsLEX]

Yeah, same system as used by some random disneyworld ride I think. I know just enough about implementing an IPT system to know that I want to stay the hell clear of it ;)

Using it as a reference for steering would be easy, what is needed to get efficient power transfer starts to get me into the eyes glazing level of miscomprehension!

[jono035]

Using it as a reference for steering would be easy, what is needed to get efficient power transfer starts to get me into the eyes glazing level of miscomprehension!

Yeah, hence why I was thinking of just stuffing a car battery on there, both to provide power and ballast...

[Mr Merde]

Looking through some suppliers at work and thought this would be cool for your range Merde - http://baledefence.com/sniper_moving_target.htm

Looks very good. Forwarded to the others.

It looks as though the last thing we need for the council is to superimpose our planned range onto the terain map.

Steve is sending me the drawings and I will get our GIS people to help me .

We have answered all their other concerns to their satisfaction.

18 months of work and planning. Not long to go now.

[Wolf]

18 months of work and planning. Not long to go now.
Great news. Looking forward to helping out how and when I can. Am I right in guessing that once you get the go-ahead there are going to be building days, working bees etc. I'm down for that on those weekends when I've got no other commitments.

[The Pastor]

It looks as though the last thing we need for the council is to superimpose our planned range onto the terain map.

Steve is sending me the drawings and I will get our GIS people to help me .



myself or andrew could also help with this

[jono035]

Great news. Looking forward to helping out how and when I can. Am I right in guessing that once you get the go-ahead there are going to be building days, working bees etc. I'm down for that on those weekends when I've got no other commitments.

I'd be keen to help out where possible, too.

[Indiana_Jones]

I'd be keen to help out where possible, too.

Same here

-Indy

[Drunken Monkey]

As am I......

[Mr Merde]

Sorry I havent been on this weekend. I have worked the whole time.

We have just changed over my whole network from a single IP scope to 3 IP scopes. At tthe same time we completely changed the IP address while we there.

Good thing is that not one of our essential applications fell over. Sure there have been minor glitches but on the whole it all worked sweetly.

SO after putting in 30 hours over the weekend and another 8 hours yesterday doing printer fixes I am relieved.

On the way home last night we saw some people on the motorway and one of them was stretched out flat.

Sharron and I pulled over and she renf=dered her nursing skills for 30 min whilst the others were on the phone to the ambulance.

An hour later the ambo's called it and the man was officially dead.

In all my 53 years this was the first non violent death I have seen.

Strangely humbling. So whoever you were, go in peace. We tried to help you but it was your time.

Chris

[sAsLEX]

<img src=http://www.combatstocks.com/images/CHOATE_RUGER_1022_FOLDER2.jpg>

Now wouldn't that make the .22 a neat little rifle to chuck in the pack to take out some possums and rabbits whilst tramping about......

Shame it makes it an E cat and rimfires aren't allowed in the bush :(

[carver]

<img src=http://www.combatstocks.com/images/CHOATE_RUGER_1022_FOLDER2.jpg>

Now wouldn't that make the .22 a neat little rifle to chuck in the pack to take out some possums and rabbits whilst tramping about......

Shame it makes it an E cat and rimfires aren't allowed in the bush :(

any of you guys know much about the street sweeper?

[scumdog]

any of you guys know much about the street sweeper?

Yeah, it drives past my place every Monday sometime between 6:30 and 7:00 in the morning...:shifty:

[carver]

Yeah, it drives past my place every Monday sometime between 6:30 and 7:00 in the morning...:shifty:

yeah?how about the banned 12g?

[scumdog]

yeah?how about the banned 12g?

Describe this gun so I know we're talking about the same thing

[carver]

Describe this gun so I know we're talking about the same thing

it was a drum mag 12 g shotty that got banned in the states, the name says why

[scumdog]

it was a drum mag 12 g shotty that got banned in the states, the name says why

Only banned to civilians, they're still around and used by military and Police.

[jono035]

Only banned to civilians, they're still around and used by military and Police.

and only in certain states, too. Some states ignore the destructive device BS.

[jono035]

Only banned to civilians, they're still around and used by military and Police.

and only in certain states, too. Some states ignore the destructive device BS.

[carver]

where can i get a few?


and only in certain states, too. Some states ignore the destructive device BS.

[Mr Merde]

Saiga make a 12 gauge semi auto shotgun.

It comes with a 5 round magazine but you can get a 12 round drum mag for it.

http://forum.saiga-12.com/style_images/1/Saiga.gif

http://www.saiga-12.com/images/AK_Saiga_Folding_Stock.gif

http://www.saiga-12.com/prodimages/ProMag_12-round_Drum_Smoke_01s.gif (http://www.saiga-12.com/proddetail.asp?prod=PMI003)

or even a 20 round mag
http://www.saiga-12.com/prodimages/Saiga-12_20-round_Drum_Promag_01s.jpg (http://www.saiga-12.com/proddetail.asp?prod=PMI004)

Go to this site to see extras for this shotgun

http://www.saiga-12.com/products.asp

[Wolf]

The "streetsweeper" is merely a US clone of the "Striker" shotgun.

http://www.nazarian.no/images/wep/479_untitled.JPG

Available in 12-round and 20-round variants. Slow to reload but who cares - if you can't get yourself out with 20 rounds of 00, you were in too deep, anyway...

[carver]

I want a saiga 410?
the semi auto shotty

[Wolf]

Why a .410 and not a 12ga, Carver?

[The Pastor]

Why a .410 and not a 12ga, Carver?

he has delicate shoulders and doesn't want a bruise as his boyfriend things bruises are ugly!

[jono035]

Well to be fair, a .410 semi-auto has a similar amount of shot in the entire mag as a double barrel 12 gauge has when loaded...

[Wolf]

Well to be fair, a .410 semi-auto has a similar amount of shot in the entire mag as a double barrel 12 gauge has when loaded...
And you get the fun of pulling the trigger more often when delivering said amount of shot downrange...

[Mr Merde]

And you get the fun of pulling the trigger more often when delivering said amount of shot downrange...

Since when has the size of the shot or bullet ever stopped any of us pulling the trigger as often as we can?

[jono035]

Since when has the size of the shot or bullet ever stopped any of us pulling the trigger as often as we can?

True, but I shoot probably 10x as much .22LR as I do 9mm, and 2x as much 9mm as I do .44 mag...

Well, not that I can shoot .44 mag any more :(

Bought some berry's projectiles so I can finally try out those .44 spl cases you gave me though!

[Wolf]

Since when has the size of the shot or bullet ever stopped any of us pulling the trigger as often as we can?

Since my shooting budget got seriously truncated. Definitely got to get into reloading.

BTW, have got a small amount of BP and some primers to go with the cartridges I got from you, all I need is shot and wads and I'll be ready to head out and take some lessons from you.