The firearm thread

[ManDownUnder]

Unless there's more to it than that...

ok - so from your post (below) I now see there was more to it... Not having a go - just fully qualifying my position.


You're prepared to shout at numerous assembled members of the Mongrel Mob intent on trouble, and singlehandedly attempt to kick them in their collective gonads. I'm sure the Army could use talent like that. You'd be a certainty to get decorated. Posthumously of course... :whistle:

Umm - do you know me at all? Me...? Tough guy? :killingme...

... no!

[chrisso]

Go Dog!!................................

[Wolf]

Go Dog!!................................
Proof - as though it were needed - that when you're down there's always someone trying to screw ya!

[Mr Merde]

Talking to a collegue at the place of my new employment.

Mentioned that I was very interseted in old rifles.

This elderly woman then asked me if I would be interested in a 1878 Snider Carbine with the side bar on it.

She and her husband found it many years ago bricked into the space between the fireplace and the wall of a house.

Kept dry so there is no rust. Woodwork is in good condition.

Apparently the old man that lived there all his life was unaware of it and he was 70 years old when he went to a nursing home.

Offerred to me for a very reasonable price.

She is going to talk to me later when we have more time.


For anyone who needs to know what I am talking about here are a couple of pictures of a Snider I found on the interweb

Apprently this elderly ladies father took the rifle apart and greased all the mechanism and wrapped it in protective cloth where it has remained for the last 20 years.

[ManDownUnder]

Talking to a collegue at the place of my new employment.

Mentioned that I was very interseted in old rifles.

Fooken brilliant mate! There's a lot of worse hands it could have fallen into (and I'm excluding nefarious ones from that statement too).

Classic!

[Indiana_Jones]

Sweet as Chris.

Sometimes you find all sorts of stuff like that through work mates etc.

Post pics if/when you get her :D

-Indy

[Wolf]

Talking to a collegue at the place of my new employment.

Mentioned that I was very interseted in old rifles.

This elderly woman then asked me if I would be interested in a 1878 Snider Carbine with the side bar on it.

She and her husband found it many years ago bricked into the space between the fireplace and the wall of a house.

Kept dry so there is no rust. Woodwork is in good condition.

Apparently the old man that lived there all his life was unaware of it and he was 70 years old when he went to a nursing home.

Offerred to me for a very reasonable price.

She is going to talk to me later when we have more time.


For anyone who needs to know what I am talking about here are a couple of pictures of a Snider I found on the interweb

Apprently this elderly ladies father took the rifle apart and greased all the mechanism and wrapped it in protective cloth where it has remained for the last 20 years.
I'm going down to file a Prospecting Licence... for the tin deposits in your arse - there's bound to be a fortune's worth in there!

Edit: BTW, congrats.

[Indiana_Jones]

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Guns = $$$

:wari:

-Indy

[Wolf]

Was drooling over some pics of Brown Bess rifles and carbines on-line last night. Saw one that went for $700 on Tardme - though I'm pretty sure it was a firing replica - it had "Made in Italy" and "BLACK POWDER ONLY" on the receiver (and I doubt they felt the need to warn people to only use black powder back when it was the standard propellant, smacks of modern post nitro-propellant manufacture.)

Wound up having a wicked dream that a bunch of us from this thread were all ogling over some really rare and unusual firearm - dunno what most of you look like but you were in the dream.

Would seriously love to get into firing old flinters. Found a thing on youtube that looked good:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SJMbxZ1k9NQ&feature=related

Love the last shot! Advert for firearms safety.

[jrandom]

Brown Bess rifles and carbines

Rifles and carbines?

:blink:

[Wolf]

Rifles and carbines?

:blink:
:Oops: :doh:

So used to calling the longer firearms "rifles".

Musket, smooth bore. "Long Land Pattern Musket" aka "Brown Bess". Satisfied, fart smella? :D

[Mr Merde]

Was drooling over some pics of Brown Bess rifles and carbines on-line last night. Saw one that went for $700 on Tardme - though I'm pretty sure it was a firing replica - it had "Made in Italy" and "BLACK POWDER ONLY" on the receiver (and I doubt they felt the need to warn people to only use black powder back when it was the standard propellant, smacks of modern post nitro-propellant manufacture.)

Wound up having a wicked dream that a bunch of us from this thread were all ogling over some really rare and unusual firearm - dunno what most of you look like but you were in the dream.

Would seriously love to get into firing old flinters. Found a thing on youtube that looked good:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SJMbxZ1k9NQ&feature=related

Love the last shot! Advert for firearms safety.

Let me know when you want a "Brown Bess".

I have a mate with one of those replicas. It has been altered a bit to get rid of these markings you speak of.

He is thinking of selling it.

.75 caliber round ball from a smoothbore.

I have shot this particular shoulder arm and it is very nice.

This friend also has a custom built Jaeger Rifle (flintlock) with all the whistles and bells. He is thinking of selling this also but it will command a premium price.


Chris

[Wolf]

Let me know when you want a "Brown Bess".
"Oh," he said airily, "only about 28 years ago..."

It's the "when I can afford one" bit that bugs me.

What sort of "premium price"?


Let's raise the level of the thread:


"Brown Bess"

In the days of lace-ruffles, perukes and brocade
Brown Bess was a partner whom none could despise--
An out-spoken, flinty-lipped, brazen-faced jade,
With a habit of looking men straight in the eyes--
At Blenheim and Ramillies fops would confess
They were pierced to the heart by the charms of Brown Bess.

Though her sight was not long and her weight was not small,
Yet her actions were winning, her language was clear;
And everyone bowed as she opened the ball
On the arm of some high-gaitered, grim grenadier.
Half Europe admitted the striking success
Of the dances and routs that were given by Brown Bess.

When ruffles were turned into stiff leather stocks,
And people wore pigtails instead of perukes,
Brown Bess never altered her iron-grey locks.
She knew she was valued for more than her looks.
"Oh, powder and patches was always my dress,
And I think am killing enough," said Brown Bess.

So she followed her red-coats, whatever they did,
From the heights of Quebec to the plains of Assaye,
From Gibraltar to Acre, Cape Town and Madrid,
And nothing about her was changed on the way;
(But most of the Empire which now we possess
Was won through those years by old-fashioned Brown Bess.)

In stubborn retreat or in stately advance,
From the Portugal coast to the cork-woods of Spain,
She had puzzled some excellent Marshals of France
Till none of them wanted to meet her again:
But later, near Brussels, Napoleon--no less--
Arranged for a Waterloo ball with Brown Bess.

She had danced till the dawn of that terrible day--
She danced till the dusk of more terrible night,
And before her linked squares his battalions gave way,
And her long fierce quadrilles put his lancers to flight:
And when his gilt carriage drove off in the press,
"I have danced my last dance for the world!" said Brown Bess.

If you go to Museums--there's one in Whitehall--
Where old weapons are shown with their names writ beneath,
You will find her, upstanding, her back to the wall,
As stiff as a ramrod, the flint in her teeth.
And if ever we English had reason to bless
Any arm save our mothers', that arm is Brown Bess!

Rudyard Kipling

[hospitalfood]

ok, listed my Saiga on trade me, its a nice one, want to look at trade options on a dirt bike to.

http://www.trademe.co.nz/Browse/Listing.aspx?id=187311779

[jrandom]

Musket, smooth bore. "Long Land Pattern Musket" aka "Brown Bess". Satisfied, fart smella? :D

Thank you.

Sorry, I've been reading Bernard Cornwell again, you know how it is...

[sAsLEX]

ok, listed my Saiga on trade me, its a nice one, want to look at trade options on a dirt bike to.

http://www.trademe.co.nz/Browse/Listing.aspx?id=187311779

I have a 84 Xr 250 that hasn't run in 3 years you could swap for the rifle.....

[Indiana_Jones]

Nice looking weapon there

Love Russian guns lol

-Indy

[Wolf]

Love Russian guns lol
Yep. Loved the old Nagant, love the SKS (real Russian one, not the Norinco) would love a Dragunov - the old model, not the sports version that's come out ?recently?
Have much higher priorities than a Dragunov, though.

[Wolf]

Sorry, I've been reading Bernard Cornwell again, you know how it is...
Rien du tout, ol' bean - I've never read him.

[Hitcher]

Rien du tout

Wasn't he the Springbok halfback in the 1956 tour?

[jrandom]

I've never read him.

The Sharpe novels? Never? Oh, you don't know what you're missing.

Back-to-back the series with some Hornblower, and you'll be waking up every morning bellowing for kippers and death to the French in no time.

:D

[Wolf]

you'll be waking up every morning bellowing for kippers and death to the French in no time.
But I already do that! (Sorry, 007XX :dodge: )

[Mr Merde]

As mentioned. I have a friend with one of these for sale.

It is a Pedersoli replica.

It comes with all the acroutrements, ie mould, flint, etc and a large number of cast ball.

He is after $800 for the lot.

PM me if anyone is interested.

I have seen and fired this flinter. It is in excellent condition.


Chris

[hospitalfood]

sAsLEX.....

mmm, it would have to be running.
can get similar bike, that age, road legal, for $ 1200.00

[Indiana_Jones]

http://www.hayesandassociates.co.nz/

This site has nice replica 19th century rifles like Sharps etc.

Might be your cup of tea Chris.

Also, where can one buy "rifle kits" as in you buy the rifle in pieces and you build it.

-Indy

[Shiny side up]

Sorry it has taken soooo long to get back to ya...... Thanks for the space to throw some lead...... Great fun..... Loved the black power lever action.... that was sweet.

Alex had a half moon welt for a few hours from the 30-06 scope but his mum was not worried..... He always seems to get bruies when he is out with me.

Stoked to now be confident witht he accuracy of the husky. But the Turkey should know that it is supposed to lie down after having a 30-06 round pass through it..... I'm going to have to put those rounds in the lathe and bore a small hole in the tip.

Any way thanks heaps and we must do it again some time.


A good afternoon spent with Wolf and Sunny Side Up and the kids.

Enjoyed the shooting.

Loved watching the excitement in the kids.

Sunny Side Up, that Husky is the best bargin I have heard of.

A turkey at 200 yards with an unfamiliar rifle. Good shooting.

Wolf, after all the years talking to you it has been a real treat finally meeting you.

Welcome anytime,


Chris.

[Wolf]

As mentioned. I have a friend with one of these for sale.

It is a Pedersoli replica.

It comes with all the acroutrements, ie mould, flint, etc and a large number of cast ball.

He is after $800 for the lot.

PM me if anyone is interested.

I have seen and fired this flinter. It is in excellent condition.


Chris
Sounds like a sweet deal. Sadly, it'd take me at least 32 weeks to save up the dosh - assuming 32 weeks with no emergencies that cut into the supply of ready funds.

Definitely a good price.

[doc]

http://www.hayesandassociates.co.nz/

This site has nice replica 19th century rifles like Sharps etc.

Might be your cup of tea Chris.

Also, where can one buy "rifle kits" as in you buy the rifle in pieces and you build it.

-Indy

PM me I've got just the book you need about building your own. Dunlop use to sell them here 20 years ago, mostly the Hawken type replica.

[Mr Merde]

http://www.hayesandassociates.co.nz/

This site has nice replica 19th century rifles like Sharps etc.

Might be your cup of tea Chris.

Also, where can one buy "rifle kits" as in you buy the rifle in pieces and you build it.

-Indy

I know this site intimately.

Neil hayes is a really nice man and very approachable.

He has one of the largest stands at the gunshow in Henderson every 6 months.

He also hosts the "End of trail" cowboy action shoot every March in Carterton. Well worth the trip if yoiu get interested in the old guns (ie 19th century stuff).

As to where you can get the kitset percussion and flintlock rifles.

Strange you ask that, talk to Eric from Seriuous Shooters in Penrose. Serious dont stock these guns but Eric has a business importing everything Black powder. I've been to his place and drooled over .32 flinters and .54 hawken rifles. Also I cant stress too much that he is a font of information for everything to do with shooting. His knowledge puts me to shame.

Chris

[Mr Merde]

Sounds like a sweet deal. Sadly, it'd take me at least 32 weeks to save up the dosh - assuming 32 weeks with no emergencies that cut into the supply of ready funds.

Definitely a good price.


I understand your dilema.

just a thought.

How would you boys like it if I organise a Black Powder day down here one weekend?

front stuffers and cartridge rifle but only loaded with the genuine powder not that modern propellant.

In the words of that well known US gun writer and shooter, Mike Venterino.

"Modern powder is just a passing fad"

I'm sure I could lay my hands on some front stuffers.

I would need you to get some black stuff as it is used by volume not by weight.

Let me know what you think.

Chris

[Wolf]

I understand your dilema.

just a thought.

How would you boys like it if I organise a Black Powder day down here one weekend?

front stuffers and cartridge rifle but only loaded with the genuine powder not that modern propellant.

In the words of that well known US gun writer and shooter, Mike Venterino.

"Modern powder is just a passing fad"

I'm sure I could lay my hands on some front stuffers.

I would need you to get some black stuff as it is used by volume not by weight.

Let me know what you think.

Chris
Definitely interested in that!

Which gun stores sell the black stuff in/around Hamilscum?

[Mr Merde]

Definitely interested in that!

Which gun stores sell the black stuff in/around Hamilscum?

There is a man down that way by the name of Martin Van Deems (I think thats right). He has a firewoirks and pyrotechnics company. he pretty much supplies the whole of NZ with the black stuff.

He also sells it cheaper than the shops.

If you are looking then what you need is FFG and FFFg

Chris

[pritch]

In the words of that well known US gun writer and shooter, Mike Venterino.
"Modern powder is just a passing fad"


I always thought that it was "Cartridges are just a passing fad."

But Hey! I've burned my share of the black stuff and can sypathise with that sentiment anyway.

[Mr Merde]

I always thought that it was "Cartridges are just a passing fad."

But Hey! I've burned my share of the black stuff and can sypathise with that sentiment anyway.


A fellow "Darksider"

I must watch what I write a little more carefully now.

If I make any blatent errors please feel free to correct me.


HAve you ever tried using Fg?

Thinking of loading 45-70 with it and 3 gns of FFg at the primer.

Should give a slower push.

Chris

[Shiny side up]

How would you boys like it if I organise a Black Powder day down here one weekend?

front stuffers and cartridge rifle but only loaded with the genuine powder not that modern propellant.
Let me know what you think.

Chris

My arm could be twisted ...... like play doh.

[Indiana_Jones]

New toy for Indy :D

1901 BSA Enfield

-Indy

[Indiana_Jones]

More pics

-Indy

[Wolf]

New toy for Indy :D

1901 BSA Enfield

-Indy
A true enthusiast! You're gonna sleep with it!.

Absolutely beautiful, mate.

I see it has the old classic "303" cleaner. I grew up with the smell of that.

Does anyone know if you can still get it?

[Indiana_Jones]

A true enthusiast! You're gonna sleep with it!.

Absolutely beautiful, mate.

I see it has the old classic "303" cleaner. I grew up with the smell of that.

Does anyone know if you can still get it?

I just love how smooth the action is, 107 years old and still mint.

NZ army issue, used in ww1, soldier took it home with him and turn it into a target rifle & added on the Parker aperture sight. Also had a new barrel added onto it some stage, current owner isn't sure when, looks like from the 30's i guess, though I'm far from a expert lol.

Donno about the cleaner availability though, guy just chucked in a pile of crap and ammo with the gun, getting rid of the lot sort of thing.

Was getting some funny looks from people taking it home on the bike this afternoon lol

-Indy

[Mr Merde]

I just love how smooththe action is, 107 years old and still mint.

NZ army issue, used in ww1, soldier took it home with him and turn it into a target rifle & added on the Parker aperture sight. Also had a new barrel added onto it some stage, current owner isn't sure when, looks like from the 30's i guess, though I'm far from a expert lol.

Donno about the cleaner availability though, guy just chucked in a pile of crap and ammo with the gun, getting rid of the lot sort of thing.

Was getting some funny looks from people taking it home on the bike this afternoon lol

-Indy

Very sweet. So when are you going to bring it down?

Not home this weekend. Going to Albany this Saturday to pick up some guinea Fowl (may release some chicks one day).

Sunday off to Big Boys Toys.

Chris

[Indiana_Jones]

Very sweet. So when are you going to bring it down?

Not home this weekend. Going to Albany this Saturday to pick up some guinea Fowl (may release some chicks one day).

Sunday off to Big Boys Toys.

Chris

I dare say I'll pop in for a shoot sometime next month.

We'll see :2guns:

Cheers Chris!

Now to find a SMLE No. 4....

-Indy

[Indiana_Jones]

Oh yea, that thing on the end of the barrel is a protector the original owner, or the one after him made, pretty nifty

-Indy

[Mr Merde]

I dare say I'll pop in for a shoot sometime next month.

We'll see :2guns:

Cheers Chris!

Now to find a SMLE No. 4....

-Indy

How about a #5 Jungle Carbine. Bloody vicious to fire but I loved doing so. Suppose I am a sucker for recoil.

You should be looking for a #4 sniper version. Cost you a couple of months pay but wouldnt it look great in your collection.

The other rifle you should look for is a Springfield 1903. I know you want a Mauser 98.

Chris

[Indiana_Jones]

yea, nice K98 would rock, better start saving!

Also keep looking at 1896 Swedish Mausers :D

-Indy

[pritch]

HAve you ever tried using Fg?


Don't you need a looooong barrel to use FG?
It'll look great at night though :whistle:

I did shoot a rifle and some 12g. Mostly though only had about seven inches in which to burn the stuff so used 3F....

[Mr Merde]

Don't you need a looooong barrel to use FG?
It'll look great at night though :whistle:

I did shoot a rifle and some 12g. Mostly though only had about seven inches in which to burn the stuff so used 3F....

Rifle I will be shooting this with has a 34 inch barrel.

BP metalic shiloette shooters are using this with goof effect in the US. Not as sharp in the recoil dept compared to finer grades of powder.

From all I have learnt and read about BP it seems that if the caliber is over .40 then FFG is good. For .36 then FFFg. For little calibers such as .31 and smaller then FFFFg is good.

Fg is usual for cannon but with 3 grns of FFFG in the case first and a magun primer it should give a very good burn.

7" , you were shooting a revolver. standard barrel length for most handguns of the 19th century. military ones anyway.

Chris

[Indiana_Jones]

That's a sawn off! lol

From skinny land

-Indy

[scumdog]

That's a sawn off! lol

From skinny land

-Indy

My Gevarm is 764mm from loud-end to butt.

It only LOOKS like a sawn-off.

[doc]

There is a man down that way by the name of Martin Van Deems (I think thats right). He has a firewoirks and pyrotechnics company. he pretty much supplies the whole of NZ with the black stuff.

He also sells it cheaper than the shops.

If you are looking then what you need is FFG and FFFg

Chris

Got this stuff off Mokokomiko (think thats the way it's spelt) Powder company think he still sells the stuff at meets and Rendovous.


. Going to Albany this Saturday to pick up some guinea Fowl (may release some chicks one day).
Chris

We with the help of the Acclimatisation tried them and Partridges for a few years 15 - 20 years ago on our penninsular and never saw them again after we released them. Just prior everyone was into either Kiwifruit or "Fitches" I think the Green party turned up a bit late for that one.

[Swoop]

That's a sawn off!
The bottom right appears to be a "carved-off"...
I hate to think what purpose the tower bolt, on the side, is for.:shit:

[Indiana_Jones]

Guns go bang!

-Indy

[Magua]

Nah, they go bang.. ting!

[Mr Merde]

52 today. Feeling every second. Off subject but hell you lot are the only ones on this board I talk to nowadays.

[The Pastor]

Crikey, you didnt look a day past 51 last time i saw you!

congratualtions soon you'll be able to get the discount when you go for a ride on the bus!

[Mr Merde]

Crikey, you didnt look a day past 51 last time i saw you!

congratualtions soon you'll be able to get the discount when you go for a ride on the bus!


You young wippersnapper, I remember when it was expected for youngsters to respect the elderly (only laugh when they were not within hearing range).

Thanks RM for bringing a smile to me this morning.

Chris

[irishlad]

Happy birthday Mr Merde. Always enjoy your insight into firearms. Have a few & relax.

[Mr Merde]

Happy birthday Mr Merde. Always enjoy your insight into firearms. Have a few & relax.

Had a few too many last night...

Dinner, a video and then a few drinks with "she who must be obeyed" and a friend.

2am this morning my mate staggered off to bed and the drinking finished.

Needless to say I am feeling decidedly seedy.

For breakfast this morning I had two lightly boiled paracetamol followed by a shot of alker skeltzer.

It has been a long time since I have felt this bad after a session.

Chris

[scumdog]

Had a few too many last night...

Dinner, a video and then a few drinks with "she who must be obeyed" and a friend.

2am this morning my mate staggered off to bed and the drinking finished.

Needless to say I am feeling decidedly seedy.

For breakfast this morning I had two lightly boiled paracetamol followed by a shot of alker skeltzer.

It has been a long time since I have felt this bad after a session.

Chris

Ah well, enjoy it while you can - you won't be able to when you're dead!!

[Mr Merde]

Its been really quiet on this thread lately.

I thought I would once again throw my 2c in/

I have been on TM lately and have the following due to arrive this week.

Harris Bipod for my .223

15-40x50 spotting scope. (getting tired of trying to see .223 holes at 100 metres with binociulars, scope and low power spoting scope)

100 projectiles for my M1 carbine. About time I shot it again.

Projectiles for my .223

Targets.

Various other reloading supplies.

I feel the need to load and burn powder.

Chris

[sAsLEX]

Picking up my Winchester on Sat, you home Sunday might pop in on the way back up.

[Mr Merde]

Picking up my Winchester on Sat, you home Sunday might pop in on the way back up.


Yes, home on Sunday.

This is the original you posted up here?

[Indiana_Jones]

Save some M1 ammo.

Must try that thing! :D

-Indy

[Mr Merde]

Save some M1 ammo.

Must try that thing! :D

-Indy

Its only a little carbine.
Looking at 100-200 yard shooting.
Apparently they can be very accurate once you have found a good load for them.

Designed originally as a replacement for the 1911 as standard issue to officers.

You can definitely see where Bill Ruger got his inspiration for the Mini 14 from though.

I have 100 projectiles coming (FMJ) and I may have a lead on a lubrisisor so I can properly size the 1000 projectiles I have cast.

As they come from the mould they are just a little too large to chamber properly.

Once resized i will load up the 800 empty cases I have for it and then have some fun.

Should be good for bunnies and turkeys with the lead projectiles.

Absolutely sod all recoil even though the carbine only weighs in at a featherweight 6 lbs.

I would love to get my hands on a Taurus revolver chambered for this cartridge as it is supposed to be very fierce in a handgun.


Chris

[Indiana_Jones]

Yea, if the gun is anything like the version they have in the game "Day of defeat" it'll rock!

:Punk:

-Indy

[pritch]

Its only a little carbine.
Looking at 100-200 yard shooting.


The .30 carbine is definitely no powerhouse. Some naughty people were firing them over the head of a group I was once with. Very unimpressive hiss as the bullets passed overhead. I thought to myself if I have to be shot with something, my choice will be an M1 carbine...

Don't want to appear too picky but...:sherlock: The word "projectile" is a ballistic term usually referring to a moving object. Until you fire it (or throw it?) it's more correctly called a bullet. (Which is probably what's written on the box.)

[Mr Merde]

...
Don't want to appear too picky but...:sherlock: The word "projectile" is a ballistic term usually referring to a moving object. Until you fire it (or throw it?) it's more correctly called a bullet. (Which is probably what's written on the box.)

I know but too many years in the UK where the very mention of a "bullet" sends shivers down their collective spines.

After I left the UK my ex cleaned out the garage. She had a skip and she dumped my 5000 .45 acp cases my thousands of .357 and similar ammounts of 38spl and .44 spl into it.

Someone called the police and they went through the skip and found 5 rounds that I had screwed in reloading and hadnt gotten around to pulling. The cops put out a warrant for my arrest for "unlawful posession of ammunition" punishable with up to 5 years and\or a 5000 pound fine.

The ex warned me about this as I was due back to see the kids around then.

[Indiana_Jones]

Fucking UK gun laws :p

-Indy

[pritch]

The cops put out a warrant for my arrest for "unlawful posession of ammunition" punishable with up to 5 years and\or a 5000 pound fine.


Shit oh dear!

One of my memories of firearms in the UK involved a trip to Bisley with a bunch of people readily identifiable as Kiwis. The UK smallbore championships were in progress at the time and there were lots of people living at the range.

Suddenly all the cartridge collectors in our group made a rush at a rubbish skip. This skip certainly had a lot of empty cartridge boxes, but it also had a sweltering great heap of kitchen scraps.

I'm told I embarrass easily but my colleagues diving into a stinky dumpster in view of anyone who cared to look (and quite a few did) certainly did the trick.

[Wolf]

52 today. Feeling every second. Off subject but hell you lot are the only ones on this board I talk to nowadays.
Happy bellated birthday. Hope it went off with a bang - lots of bangs, plenty of smoke and various targets going foom!

[Wolf]

Back on topic

Cleaning up the garage I found a 3-9 varipower wide-view scope I'd forgotten I still had.

That'll save me a few hundred - I don't have to buy a scope for the Brno, now.

[sAsLEX]

Right got the 92 in my warm live hands, and only have 40 odd rounds for the bugger.

Will the 210 dollar kit on the site below suit to load both the 38-40 and my 308 with different attachements?
http://www.outdoorsupplies.co.nz/leereload3.htm#reload

[Monsterbishi]

Right got the 92 in my warm live hands, and only have 40 odd rounds for the bugger.

Will the 210 dollar kit on the site below suit to load both the 38-40 and my 308 with different attachements?
http://www.outdoorsupplies.co.nz/leereload3.htm#reload

Yep, all you need is dies and extra shellholders to suit, and you're away laughing. It should come with some quickchange collars for the dies too - to speed changeover up without the need to re-set the heights each time.

I have a near identical kit, the Lee challenger, appears identical actually.

Depending on how patient you are, you may find yourself upgrading the scales, they take a while to settle since they're a beam type - very sensitive to vibration, breath, etc.

[Wolf]

Back on topic

Cleaning up the garage I found a 3-9 varipower wide-view scope I'd forgotten I still had.

That'll save me a few hundred - I don't have to buy a scope for the Brno, now.
But I do need mounting rings.

I have managed to locate a solitary mounting ring - a medium-height Weaver - but it is too wide for the scope rail on the Brno and also too low - the scope is huge and impacts on the rear sight (no desire to remove the iron sights)

Any suggestions for make, model and where to get them from?

[Outlaw_Torn]

Have an old mauser that has been rebuilt in 7mm08...

Smokes the deer over beautifully :)

[Mr Merde]

Saslex stopped by yesterday to show me the inheritance.

An original 1892 carbine in 38-40.

What a beauty. Crisp action, very clean bore.

[The Pastor]

I shot a possum with my 308, it was fun :)

stupid bugga got its guts blown out then ran up the branch.

[Mr Merde]

Saslex

Check this out

http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.exe/showproduct?saleitemid=498351

http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.exe/showproduct?saleitemid=672858

http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.exe/showproduct?saleitemid=323434

http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.exe/showproduct?saleitemid=618362


http://www.midwayusa.com/Search/#38-40__685__-_1-2-4_

[emaN]

Gotta re-new myself soon, which will means I'll continue being licensed to "throw bullets" :shifty: for a few more years.

I need to go through the interviewing/inspection process again too, which means re-looking at my gun cabinet.

At the moment I'm using a cabinet I made up; rather feeble, but it's locked & fixed. I'd like to build/get something a little more solid.

What do you guys use for gun safes?

[Monsterbishi]

What do you guys use for gun safes?

Welded 1/2" Tube, with 6mm mesh welded to the outside.

[Indiana_Jones]

What do you guys use for gun safes?

one of these

http://www.baysteelcraft.co.nz/shop/index.php?_a=viewProd&productId=7

-Indy

[scumdog]

Gotta re-new myself soon, which will means I'll continue being licensed to "throw bullets" :shifty: for a few more years.

I need to go through the interviewing/inspection process again too, which means re-looking at my gun cabinet.

At the moment I'm using a cabinet I made up; rather feeble, but it's locked & fixed. I'd like to build/get something a little more solid.

What do you guys use for gun safes?

Don't forget that a traditional gun-rack with a meaty chain and padlock is pretty damn good - and you can see at a glance if any of your muskets is a.w.a.l.

[Swoop]

a.w.a.l.
Absent With Ammo Loaded???

[emaN]

Cheers.
I'd looked at gun racks, but on one 'advertisement' I read that they weren't "approved" in the BOP... You wot?!

How can a tiny place like NZ have varying rules for gun racks?
(Gonna get in touch with local plod office to check on that one).

I'm liking the gun rack option best; got a wardrobe which would suit it perfek'!

[Mr Merde]

All my rifles and shotguns are locked in a wardrobe that only I have the key for. It has a very secure lock on it.

The ammo is kept seperately in another cupboard in another room.

Pistols are kept in a safe, that conforms to regs, somewhere else.

Check out the police site for standards for safe keeping of firearms.

They are a national criteria and if they differ in your area then surely you have a reason to make complaint.

I dont think that the police are allowed to make up their own rules and regulations. They must abide by those agreed upon by our elected officials and the police department.

For one area to have totally different rules for the safe keepint of firearms to the rest of the country would be like an area deciding that although the national max speed limit was 100kph that in their area it would be 95kph.

Not allowed. They have to make justification for the changes. Question them. It is your right to do so.

My 2 Cents worth.

[Mr Merde]

On a change of subject.

I was a little bored this weekend so I sat down and loaded 200 .30 Carbine rounds.

Took the M1 out and sighted it in withthe new loads. Lovely group of 2" at 100 metres.

Enogh to get a "coke can" at that distance.

Still bored so I loaded 100, 12 guage shells. 20 gns of AS30 under Winchester white wads and 1 1/8 oz of #7 shot.

Nice kick to it and at close range a devastating wallop.

I need to pattern these to see how the pellets are thrown. Next payday off to the warehouse to get some really cheap, white sheets with which to make holes in.

Still bored so I picked up the M1, 50 rounds of .30 carbine, a water bottle and a pack of ciggies.

Walked the length of my valeey along the rivers edge.

Took me 3 hours to travel most of the valley and back.

No game to take (I was hoping for a hare or such).There were turkeys but they arent good to eat this time of year so I didnt harvest them.

I did notice that the riiver along the valley is full of carp. Big buggers.

It was a hot day and they were only millimeters from being out of the water. Their dorsal fin was proud of the surface.

Coulnt resist it.

Where there was no dander of a shot richoceting I had a go at one with the M1.

MERDE the Great.
Fish Shooter Extraordinaire.

I popped a large carp

[Wolf]

Cheers.
I'd looked at gun racks, but on one 'advertisement' I read that they weren't "approved" in the BOP... You wot?!

How can a tiny place like NZ have varying rules for gun racks?
(Gonna get in touch with local plod office to check on that one).
That does not sound kosher.

[Swoop]

I need to pattern these to see how the pellets are thrown. Next payday off to the warehouse to get some really cheap, white sheets with which to make holes in.
I can obtain part-rolls of thin cardboard that could be suitable? Tape a couple together and you will have 2.4m high and as long as you need.

Was the fishy-fish still in an edible state?

[Mr Merde]

I can obtain part-rolls of thin cardboard that could be suitable? Tape a couple together and you will have 2.4m high and as long as you need.

Was the fishy-fish still in an edible state?

Sounds good.

No the fishy wasnt edible. A .30 carbine round hitting water first then through a rather soft skinned animal milliseconds later made a bigish hole and one hell of a splash. The body of said fishy floated off down the river. I wasnt going to climb down 15 feet of bank, cross a 10 foot wide pice of water and hope to catch the remains of a large carp.

I dont even think that they are edible without lots of work flushing them in clean running water whilst alive.


Merde (Killer of fishies)

[Wolf]

Merde (Killer of fishies)
My nephew is an avid hunter/fisher (how avid? His mum bought some tiny exotic aquarium fish and Brandon - aged about 6 at the time - asked in all seriousness "can you eat them?")

When he was still fairly young we went down to the stream to do some eeling and I took along the air rifle to have some fun (fishing's not my bag, baby). I spotted an eel, just beneath the surface and said "there's an eel". Brandon says "Where?"

I raised the air rifle, fired a shot which obviously connected as the eel bunched up suddenly and went into a roll like a fat brown spring and vanished under water. "There!" said I.

Brandon still talks about the day his Uncle Jon shot an eel with the air rifle.

OK, the air rifle lacks the penetrating power of a .30 so we didn't wind up with a trophy.

And later, when a water rat broke cover and ran along the bank, I unfortunately had the action open and no pellet in the breech so I missed out on hitting that.

Sorry, can offer no advice on the preparation of carp. I have heard a first hand account of tickling trout, though...

[The Pastor]

Shotguns are the best for fishing

[Wolf]

Shotguns are the best for fishing
Piss off! Nothing beats a 1/4-stick of powergel!

[The Pastor]

How about 1/2 a stick of powergel?

[Wolf]

How about 1/2 a stick of powergel?
Only if you're intending on having the fish skinned, filleted and placed in the back of your ute with no further action on your part...

[The Pastor]

Its the same reason i take the 308 possum shooting

[Mr Merde]

Its the same reason i take the 308 possum shooting

There is absolutely nothing wrong with having more firepower than is needed.

You never know when things could escalate.

RM may be faced with a number of those rabid australian immigrants all foaming at the mouth and after his blood.

In which case a .308 is perfectly acceptable at keeping such at a respectable 100 metre distance.

All says Merde (killer of fishies)

[Mr Merde]

Someone here has been converted to the "Dark Side"

Someone may possibly be awakened to the flame and the thunder.

Welcome to the brotherhood of SOOT.

[Swoop]

I have learnt the real meaning of "Iwi"!!

Choice! (http://www.israel-weapon.com/default.asp?catid=%7B3E31AB82-2BB0-11D7-92D3-0080AD76B634%7D)

The Tavor appears to be a fine toy. Developed by and especially for Israel, however India is a large user as well. The Micro Tavor, being used by SF troops, has a good reputation by all accounts.

[emaN]

Cheers guys.

Managed to (eventually) get hold of the local firearms peeps; when I mentioned I'd seen a gun rack advertised as "not approved in BOP" they immediately knew the advert & the company, Gun City.

ITHO it doesn't meet the grade, is all.
Other gun racks are accepted & approved.

So looks like I'll be in touch with those BaySteel characters.

Happy Hols to yas!

[Indiana_Jones]

Cheers guys.

Managed to (eventually) get hold of the local firearms peeps; when I mentioned I'd seen a gun rack advertised as "not approved in BOP" they immediately knew the advert & the company, Gun City.

ITHO it doesn't meet the grade, is all.
Other gun racks are accepted & approved.

So looks like I'll be in touch with those BaySteel characters.

Happy Hols to yas!

I swear the ones they sell in gun city are baysteel, but I guess I'm wrong, looks just like it.

The Baysteel one I own is solid as. They also put on rubber on the parts that make contact with the gun so you don't fuck them up :)

Not gonna stop a thief who only wants the gun, but stops someone who just happens to be there at the time nicking ur ipod etc.

-Indy

[emaN]

I swear the ones they sell in gun city are baysteel, but I guess I'm wrong, looks just like it.

hmmm...in that case I might fire him an email, just to double check

[Indiana_Jones]

Indy got a new gun for Christmas from the mrs. :love:

4 shot semi auto

-Indy

[Wolf]

Indy got a new gun for Christmas from the mrs. :love:

4 shot semi auto

-Indy
Nice pics but what's the guts? Is it a MOA shooter, what's the effective range, does it fire the new Magnum rubber bands?

[Mr Merde]

Nice pics but what's the guts? Is it a MOA shooter, what's the effective range, does it fire the new Magnum rubber bands?

I notice there is no provision for a suppressor. I do hope that you decide to look after yourself and wear protective hearing aids whilst using this firearm.

[Wolf]

I'm now tempted to go out and get one and write a full Guns 'n' Ammo shooting report - perhaps comparison test it against a Nerf gun and a spud gun - accuracy with various loads and ammo types, range, reliability, concealability, rate of fire, combat-readiness, etc

Submit it to Guns 'n' Ammo and see if they'll print it just for a lark...

[doc]

We went for a walk last night trying to get over the miday meal.

[scumdog]

We went for a walk last night trying to get over the miday meal.

FRIKKIN SHOW-OFF!!!

Went out tonight with step-son, he with Chinese 22 semi with suppresor, me with 22 Sako.
Bugger all rabbits, the ones we did see were toey-as and grass was long, eventually got two - and one of them had just esacaped from a cat when I shot it.

Had a whack at the departing cat but missed. (and dont like the taste anyway).

Out after the hares in a night or two.

[doc]

FRIKKIN SHOW-OFF!!!

Its was pretty easy, freshly cut after haymaking. Went out again tonight. Only saw one and it was moving at a great rate of knots. Think they are on to us.

[Wolf]

Only saw one and it was moving at a great rate of knots. Think they are on to us.
Oh, yeah, ya reckon? There're probably posters of you buggers plastered on the walls of every warren in a 20km radius...

[pritch]

I don't believe in New Years resolutions. It'd be a good idea to resolve to lose some weight, but I know from years of trying to give up smoking that'd be a looser of an idea.

Don't get me wrong, I haven't smoked in 35 years...

So for 2009 I *will* make the resolution that I will be at the range a whole lot more than I was in 2008.

May all of you get to whatever range you wish, as often as you wish, and may the sun be shining...

[Mr Merde]

After 10 years I finally contacted the original person that turned me onto th e dark path.

Mark is the person who gave me my first taste of using black powder rather than the modern propellant. Shooting his original 1853 2 band Enfield. His father is one of the UK's top black powder rifle shooters and they had me stay at the MLAGB base in Bisley a few times. Watched Mark and his father shooting front stuffers at 1200 yards at Bisley and scoring bulls more often than not.

Lost track of him when he emigrated to Malta. Through another shooting board I managed to contact his father and then through him I got in contact with mark.

He phoned me on Xmas night at 2 am and again last Saturday at 11pm.

He will be comming over for a holiday in 2010.

He also has a couple of new ( old ) toys for me which he will send over.

A 10 guage SxS shotgun and a 16 guage SxS shotgun.

Not in perfect condition cosmetically but still very shootable.

The 10 Guage is for me and the 16 guage for her indoors (a 12 is too heavy for her to fire comfortable for any length of time.)

The 10 guage is for me to use in Cowboy Action Shooting. My 12 guage shotties make the targets ring. The 10 should pick them up and bowl them over. Also the added bonus that the 10 has another 20 yards reach on the 12 guage.

You can also still use lead when duck hunting. Restriction to steel only aplies to 12 guage.

So as soon as Mark can get these shotties over to me I will have some new shells to learn how to reload. BTW both are hammer guns proofed for nitro.

MArk is also going to keep an eye out for some good quality Martini Enfields for me. As well as any genuine Marlin lever actions from 1881 onwarde.

It is really good to be able to contact old mates and it is a bonus when they can assist you in your hobby because they share it also.

Chris

[ManDownUnder]

We went for a walk last night trying to get over the miday meal.

That a Tikka - with a Leupold? I see you have the same kind of rabbits they do here - the slow, sad leaky ones.

[Indiana_Jones]

MArk is also going to keep an eye out for some good quality Martini Enfields for me. As well as any genuine Marlin lever actions from 1881 onwarde.



Steal!

:D

-Indy

[doc]

After 10 years I finally contacted the original person that turned me onto the dark path.
Chris

Well this is the Flinchlock book I promised you, now just got to get it to you.

[Goblin]

My boy went out hunting early this morning with his Uncle Wick and spotted this wee piggy. Have no idea what he shot it with but MMMMmmmm!!:drool: Looks tasty!

Sorry bout the size. I have no way of resizing pics anymore.

[kasper]

Pity you don't include anything for Cross bows or long bows.

I own some of them.

--kasper

[Mr Merde]

Pity you don't include anything for Cross bows or long bows.

I own some of them.

--kasper

Ahh a Toxophile.

No problem with that.

Long bows and crossbows the precursor to firearms.

Same sport but an older form of it.

Welcome


Chris

[Wolf]

Ahh a Toxophile.

No problem with that.

Long bows and crossbows the precursor to firearms.

Same sport but an older form of it.

Welcome


Chris
Ol' Ben Franklin is reputed to have suggested that the army should go back to bows and arrows as they were faster and more accurate than muskets and had a longer range than bayonets...

IIRC he was contrasting the ROF of the native's bows with that of the Colonial Army's muskets.

[Indiana_Jones]

Thanks again Chris for letting us have a blast on your land!

-Indy

[Mr Merde]

Thanks again Chris for letting us have a blast on your land!

-Indy

Told you, any time.

Glad you enjoyed the M1 carbine.

Your .303 is a sweet little number.

Chris

[Indiana_Jones]

Told you, any time.

Glad you enjoyed the M1 carbine.

Your .303 is a sweet little number.

Chris

Loved that carbine, don't ever sell it! :wari:

Yea, got quite lucky with the .303, must remember to get a good print of the instructions with me next time.

http://www.rifleman.org.uk/PH_Service_sights.htm

I have the no. 9

Quite a good site really, full of some handy info :niceone:

-Indy

[Mr Merde]

My boy went out hunting early this morning with his Uncle Wick and spotted this wee piggy. Have no idea what he shot it with but MMMMmmmm!!:drool: Looks tasty!

Sorry bout the size. I have no way of resizing pics anymore.

Young lad looks as proud as punch. So he should be.

Young lady looks a little green around the gills.

Looks like some real nice eating there.


Chris

[Mr Merde]

Loved that carbine, don't ever sell it! :wari:

Yea, got quite lucky with the .303, must remember to get a good print of the instructions with me next time.

http://www.rifleman.org.uk/PH_Service_sights.htm

I have the no. 9

Quite a good site really, full of some handy info :niceone:

-Indy

Gotta stake down the back sight a little though. Cant have it shooting loose like it did last night.

Going to strip it down and give it a good oil and clean. Tighten up all the screws. Grease the receiver rails and then play with trying to get accurate.

Too many guns and not enough time.




Still think you need to replace the top wood work. Must be some around that can be adapted to fit.

Chris

[Indiana_Jones]

Still think you need to replace the top wood work. Must be some around that can be adapted to fit.

Chris

If I can't find a whole replacement bit, which might be harder since it's a long tom and not a no. 4 which seems the norm here in NZ, I can always try and get my old man (a carpenter) to make the piece and then attach the brackets to it that hold it onto the barrel (just clips on and off sort of thing)

-Indy

[Mr Merde]

If I can't find a whole replacement bit, which might be harder since it's a long tom and not a no. 4 which seems the norm here in NZ, I can always try and get my old man (a carpenter) to make the piece and then attach the brackets to it that hold it onto the barrel (just clips on and off sort of thing)

-Indy

Yours is a Lee Enfield Mk 1

Check out the photo. Top wood is as it is meant to be.

Made 1899-1902


[URL="http://militaryguns.net.au/content/view/43/48/"[/URL]

[The Pastor]

anyone know where any cheap shotties are for sale? not too worried what type. around the $200-$300

[Monsterbishi]

anyone know where any cheap shotties are for sale? not too worried what type. around the $200-$300

Gun City has their own brand shotties for $350 brand new:

http://www.guncity.co.nz/12ga-gun-city-870-magnum-6-shot-bead-sight-xidp213900.html

Cheap enough to thrash for a season, and just buy another one the next year!

[Mr Merde]

anyone know where any cheap shotties are for sale? not too worried what type. around the $200-$300

Not for sale but if you are looking for something for the Bunny Shoot then I have a Winchester 1200 pump you can borrow. 20" barrel or a 28" your choice.

You can take it for a month to get used to the thing before you go on the shoot.

Check with Man Down Under as to what it is like. He borrowed the same shottie the first time he went down to the bunny shoot. It did alright for him.

Chris

[The Pastor]

cheers chirs, i'll take you up on that offer - if i get to go to the bunny shoot.

[nico]

My boy went out hunting early this morning with his Uncle Wick and spotted this wee piggy. Have no idea what he shot it with but MMMMmmmm!!:drool: Looks tasty!

Sorry bout the size. I have no way of resizing pics anymore.
man after my own heart nice lil eater mabie i should start posting a few boars on here see ya from my home town to nice 1

[Indiana_Jones]

Any good places to buy surplus rifles here in NZ, or failing that, good American websites?

Cheers

-Indy

[Indiana_Jones]

http://www.trademe.co.nz/Sports/Hunting-shooting/Accessories/Other/auction-195189909.htm

Chris had some of these babies the other day, pretty handy in spotting your shots :niceone:

-Indy

[The Pastor]

looks like I have a little pump action, can take the big 3.5's too :D

[Mr Merde]

looks like I have a little pump action, can take the big 3.5's too :D

What make?

Bring it out sometime and we will show you how to use it.

Dont have a clay thrower unfortunately but watch this space.......,



I was informed on Xmas day that I am a founding member of a new shooting club.

Ever since the Ardmore Ranges closed to civilians, we shooters in the southern part of Auckland havent had many places to shoot.

Last March a group of us "Cowboy Action Shooters" decided to get together and start a "Cowboy " club.

I havent heard much since ( they had the wrong mobile number for me).

Things have progressed. We have a property on a 3 year revolving lease (the owner is pro shooting). The powers that be have had a look and deemed it safe and will, subject it to having a few improvements, issue a licence as a pistol range.

We have approached a charitable body and they are willing to entertain the idea of granting us some cash with which to develop this range.

All we need to do now is approach the local council for resourse consent. Not the council I work for but one of the adjacent ones. I'm going to talk to those persons in my council who give resorce consent and se if they have any contacts with this other council. If I've learnt one thing in life its not what you know but whom you know. Contacts are everything.

The range will consist of 4 "bays". Each 20 metres wide by 50 metres deep. Two will be set up for Cowboy Action Shooting and two will be for other disciplines (changable).

We have permission to run clay pigeon shoots on this land also. Unfortunately there are no long range facilities but on a personal note I have 1000 + metres out my back door for that purpose.

We are going to be affiliated to the NZPA but we will have a limited membership. Reason being that we are really pissed off with the political bullshit that always occurs when an organisation gets too large.

The range is going to be open to non members on a "green fee" basis. These "green fees" will assist us in paying for the lease.

As you can tell I am very, very excited with this new development as it has been getting harder and harder to find a reasonably priced club with which to keep up the terms of my B cat licence. I was getting so disheartened that I contemplated surrendering my B cat and selling the handguns.

All changed now.

On another note I am off to Kaikohe on Auckland Anniversary weekend for a CAS competition. With my lack of training I will shoot like shit but what they hell at least I will get to burn powder.


Chris

[Drunken Monkey]

Ol' Ben Franklin is reputed to have suggested that the army should go back to bows and arrows as they were faster and more accurate than muskets and had a longer range than bayonets...

IIRC he was contrasting the ROF of the native's bows with that of the Colonial Army's muskets.

If true, Ben didn't think that one through very well. Or he was just being facetious.

[Wolf]

I was informed on Xmas day that I am a founding member of a new shooting club.
Excellent news, Chris.

[Mr Merde]

If true, Ben didn't think that one through very well. Or he was just being facetious.

Not too sure of that. If you look at the methods that were employed for musketry in the late 18th to the early 19th century you can understand his thinking.

Traditionally an army relied on mass volleys of fire to be effective. Most muilitary muskets were smooth bore, large calibre firearms. I think (from memory) that a trained British soldier could get off about 5-6 shots a min in volley fire. In Agincourt (400 years earlier) the Welsh archers could loose approximately the same number of arows. Just think, 5000 archers firing 6 arrows per min means that in just 1 min there were 30,000 arrows in flight. Multiply that by the 10-15 min that the French knights charge took and now you are talking 300,000-450,000 arrows. A very effective barrage.

Now going back to Ben Franklins idea. Most firearms of the time were made in America but their constituant parts were imported from Europe. So there was a problem with getting the makings for the firearms. America at the time had a large number of gunsmiths but due to cost they imported most of their lockworks and barrels. She didnt have a large arms making industrry till after the War of Independance, when the fledgling government set up such places as the Federal Arms factory at Springfield.

Transportation of arms, powder and shot was a major logistical exercise for any commanding officer of an army of the time. Each soldier would have carried up to 60 shot (bloody heavy if of .50 calibre or larger).

The American army consisted of mostly militia. They armed themselves with whatever they had to hand. Mostly hunting firearms. Teir strenght lay in the tactics of "hit and run". George Washington lost more "traditional " battles than he won. Especially in the early days. If England werent having troubles in India and Europe at the time they would have been able to send over more troops and higher trained troops. This would have caused a reversal in the fortunes of the Continental Army.


So looking at these points old Ben's idea wasnt so bad. Arrows were silent. They could be fashioned from local material. They were not too heavy, an archer could easily have the same range as a musket of the time, in light of the tactics used. The hit and run tactics of the militia would have been just as effective if not more so. No powder smoke with which to identify the direction of fire.

This is only my thoughts on the subject.


Chris

[The Pastor]

hey chirs good luck with your club, if you need any CAD plans drawn up, let me know.

this is my new shottie
http://www.guncity.co.nz/12ga-stoeger-p350-pump-shotgun-22-3.5-black-xidp216566.html

[Mr Merde]

hey chirs good luck with your club, if you need any CAD plans drawn up, let me know.

this is my new shottie
http://www.guncity.co.nz/12ga-stoeger-p350-pump-shotgun-22-3.5-black-xidp216566.html


Looks good. Better bring it out one day.

For bunny shooting I would suggest the use of #4 shot. Ive shot turkeys with #7 and you have to be real close. #4 will give you a bit more distance.

If you pick up some shot and some primers, bring them out to my place and I will teach you how to reload them. I have a 12 gauge press set up in the shed.

Chris

[Wolf]

According to my research, soldiers were drilled to 4 per minute with a musket and they fired at that rate to deliver the most devastating effect - they all fired at the same time to maximise the chances of someone being hit by that volley of shot. Maintaining a uniform rate of fire was of paramount importance in traditional battles.

Some people could load and fire a musket faster than 4 per minute but they did not fire at that rate in traditional battle. Rifles were even slower to load and fire.

A skilled archer has a far higher rate of fire than 4-6 per minute:
http://militaryhistory.about.com/od/smallarms/p/englongbow.htm

For its day the longbow possessed both long range and accuracy, though seldom both at once. Scholars estimate the longbow's range at between 180 to 270 yards. It is unlikely however, that accuracy could be ensured beyond 75-80 yards. At longer ranges, the preferred tactic to unleash volleys of arrows at masses of enemy troops. During the 14th and 15th centuries, English archers were expected to shoot ten "aimed" shots per minute during battle. A skilled archer would be capable of around twenty shots. As the typical archer was provided with 60-72 arrows, this permitted three to six minutes of continuous fire.

Modern Olympic archery events are shot at 70 metres, wherein you are expected to hit a 6.1cm-wide "10-ring" often enough to beat the other competitors - though not at 20 shots a minute.

An arrow is also reusable once extracted from the target - in addition to the advantages of "silence" (compared with a firearm, anyway) and lack of smoke as mentioned by Chris.

[The Pastor]

Looks good. Better bring it out one day.

For bunny shooting I would suggest the use of #4 shot. Ive shot turkeys with #7 and you have to be real close. #4 will give you a bit more distance.

If you pick up some shot and some primers, bring them out to my place and I will teach you how to reload them. I have a 12 gauge press set up in the shed.

Chris
aprantly its pretty shit, thats why i got it free ;)

[Mr Merde]

aprantly its pretty shit, thats why i got it free ;)

Free is good.

How is it "pretty shit"?

Is it broken or does it just handle badly?

There may be things we can do to make it work better if it is handling badly.

Most things that are broken can be fixed.

Cosmetics dont matter that much. I would prefer a good reliable, mechanically sound firearm that shot well to a beautiful piece of artwork that didnt.

Chris

[The Pastor]

well im not sure why he said it was pretty shit, - he didnt say, was hoping to get rid of it.

I think he was refering "pretty shit" as to his other shotguns. time will tell. - I could pop out some eveing this week with the shot and primers - just tell me when it suits.

[Mr Merde]

well im not sure why he said it was pretty shit, - he didnt say, was hoping to get rid of it.

I think he was refering "pretty shit" as to his other shotguns. time will tell. - I could pop out some eveing this week with the shot and primers - just tell me when it suits.

Any time. I get home about 5:30pm most days.

Would take about 10 min to show you how to load shotgun and you could probably load 50-80 rounds an hour after that.

I have some AS30N powder. You may need AS50 if you are using #4 shot.

Primers run areabout $10 per hundred. I have lots of wads and cases so dont worry about getting them. #4 shot or #7 (bird) not sure how much that is but it can be expensive, ring reloder supplies in Onehunga. They sell it.

Chris

[The Pastor]

Any time. I get home about 5:30pm most days.

Would take about 10 min to show you how to load shotgun and you could probably load 50-80 rounds an hour after that.

I have some AS30N powder. You may need AS50 if you are using #4 shot.

Primers run areabout $10 per hundred. I have lots of wads and cases so dont worry about getting them. #4 shot or #7 (bird) not sure how much that is but it can be expensive, ring reloder supplies in Onehunga. They sell it.

Chris
hows thursday about 7pm?

[ManDownUnder]

Looks good. Better bring it out one day.

For bunny shooting I would suggest the use of #4 shot. Ive shot turkeys with #7 and you have to be real close. #4 will give you a bit more distance.

If you pick up some shot and some primers, bring them out to my place and I will teach you how to reload them. I have a 12 gauge press set up in the shed.

Chris

LOL you go chap! 3 or 4 shot is fine on the bunnies (says he having gone through a slab of them last Easter... and a slab the Easter before...). 4 is good and gives a higher shot density for the ones on the run.

#7 is just painful to them - wounding them and aften making them run faster

[Mr Merde]

hows thursday about 7pm?

Suits me fine. See you then. I need to do some casting and such for the CAS competition so this will spur me on.

Chris

[ManDownUnder]

hows thursday about 7pm?

Hey RM, I have 10kgs of 7 shot and rang Reloaders Supplies... they told me number 4 is $110/10kgs.

If tyou wanted to go halves in a 10kg of #4, or buy a whole one then swap 1/2 for #7 shot I'd be interested.

[The Pastor]

hmm, reloading shotties is a bit more expensive than buying new aye.

Sorry chirs wont be reloading them - they work out to be $150+ for a slab. I can buy a slab at $120.

I'll still pop out and show you the freebe i got. Im sure indy will want to go shoot his shoulder destroying monsters.

[Mr Merde]

hmm, reloading shotties is a bit more expensive than buying new aye.

Sorry chirs wont be reloading them - they work out to be $150+ for a slab. I can buy a slab at $120.

I'll still pop out and show you the freebe i got. Im sure indy will want to go shoot his shoulder destroying monsters.


Is that $120 for a slab of #4 shot?

If so let me know where

[The Pastor]

Is that $120 for a slab of #4 shot?

If so let me know where
though a mate but normal retail is like $140 anyway.

[Mr Merde]

though a mate but normal retail is like $140 anyway.

Go for it.

I'd be interested in a slab of #4 loads.

Let me know

[Indiana_Jones]

Im sure indy will want to go shoot his shoulder destroying monsters.

lol, well maybe not this Thursaday, need to save some $$$.

Looking at getting a reloading kit to save some $$$. Just not sure where to start, and where to do it (.....Parents house! :laugh:)

-Indy

[The Pastor]

lol, well maybe not this Thursaday, need to save some $$$.

Looking at getting a reloading kit to save some $$$. Just not sure where to start, and where to do it (.....Parents house! :laugh:)

-Indy
dude you have tons of ammo just sitting there, its not like you give me petrol money either,

[Indiana_Jones]

dude you have tons of ammo just sitting there, its not like you give me petrol money eithe

Not too much .303, well useable .303 lol

Also you go that way, I mearly tag along :baby:

-Indy

[ManDownUnder]

Took the 270WSM out to start the barrel break in process last night... it's a lovely piece of kit!

Tikka T3 Lite Stainless 270 WSM
Weaver 3.5-10 x 50 scope
Hand loads (130gr Hornady SST doing about 3150fps)

*BANG*

I only set one off last night to start getting the feel of the gun, and will start dialling it in on a target tonight. It has THE nicest trigger I've come across.... smooth as silk

So tonight is round 2 (excuse the pun).

...Scoping the rifle in...
...Fire forming my cases...
...Running the barrel in...
...Reloading...
...Having fun...
...Getting ready for some wild venisons...

All in one!

[Mr Merde]

Took the 270WSM out to start the barrel break in process last night... it's a lovely piece of kit!

Tikka T3 Lite Stainless 270 WSM
Weaver 3.5-10 x 50 scope
Hand loads (130gr Hornady SST doing about 3150fps)

*BANG*

I only set one off last night to start getting the feel of the gun, and will start dialling it in on a target tonight. It has THE nicest trigger I've come across.... smooth as silk

So tonight is round 2 (excuse the pun).

...Scoping the rifle in...
...Fire forming my cases...
...Running the barrel in...
...Reloading...
...Having fun...
...Getting ready for some wild venisons...

All in one!

Tell me about your handloads?

What powder?

Weight?

Primer?

Hope you are keeping records of all this data.

I told you that reloading was very addictive did I not.

I have to load 300 .44 mag this weekend coming.

Probably going to load with modern propellant as I have very little of the black stuff left (not enough for 300 rounds).

Where have you found to shoot?

A range near you?

Chris

[ManDownUnder]

Tell me about your handloads?

I bought some Winchester brass online that came with unknown primers in it so I'm using that. Keeping full records of the rest of the recipe but that's at home. And I made them a while back so I don't recall it offhand.

It's a stock starting point for a development load anyway so I'm using that to fireform the cases etc. I will be fine tuning things as I go.

The worst part for me last night was the BS surrounding running a barrel in. Some say (for a stainless barrel)
Shoot and clean (5 times)
Shoot 3 and clean
Shoot 5 and clean

...you're done (all the while watching the copper fouling levels at each cleaning cycle) but the odd one pops up saying DON'T CLEAN IT - just shoot etc. They sound like heritics to me personally but some of the arguments seemed pretty compelling.

Took a shitload of cleaning after that one round though - 20 patches to get it back to a point I was happy with the patch coming out clean. Which reminds me - I must get a proper cleaning guide too...

I popped down to the neighbour's back paddock and shot into a tree off the shoulder at 25m. I was a bit unsteady not knowing how big the thump would be but I'd relate it to the .308 I played with a while back (the goats REALLY don't like that one).

Addictive??? Hell yes! :devil2:

[Mr Merde]

I've been looking lately for something to occpy me in my dotage.

As you all can guess I am slightly interested in firearms.

After rebuilding my RRB the work on the stock has caught my interest.

Found a place in the US that makes stock duplicating carvers. Among other woodworking machines.

Very seriously thinking about importing a couple of these machines and doing some very part time work.

Now my question for you lot of reprebates.

Do you think that there would be a call for someone who could duplicate a stock to say 95 % finished (possibly more if called for)?

I'm not talking massive throughput. Just enough to provide an interest and possibly pay of my initial investment in the machinery.

I have an idea for another type of wood working that may provide a reasonable small income in this country. Flog the stuff on TM etc (not the gunstocks or pistol grips though).

So what do you think. Would you go for a duplicate stock of a much loved firearm? Especially if the cost was not over the top as I have seen in this country.

Chris

[Mr Merde]

No comments so I guess I'm off on a tangent to NZ thinking here.

Oh well.

May just get in the gunstock carver for my own amusement.

The other machine I am very interested in has also piqued the interest of my partner. Good thing.

Set up costs for both machines plus tooling is going to be somewhere in the vicinity of $5000.

I have a spare two car garage with two workshops attached, just going to waste at my place.

[ManDownUnder]

May just get in the gunstock carver for my own amusement.

The other machine I am very interested in has also piqued the interest of my partner. Good thing.

Set up costs for both machines plus tooling is going to be somewhere in the vicinity of $5000.

I have a spare two car garage with two workshops attached, just going to waste at my place.

Didn't see your post but I'd suggest you know the NZ scene better than most of us - and possibly the international one too. Something in your favour is the weak NZ Dollar if anyone from outside the country was interested in your services.

Something against you is obviously the logistics and freight issue... being so far from any other country.

[ManDownUnder]

Tell me about your handloads?

Batch 1, 20 rounds
Primer unknown (came with the brass purchased)
Powder ADI AR2209 57.0gr
Projectile Hornady SSPT 130gr
Case Winchester
COAL 2.785"
Date loaded 2/11/08

[ManDownUnder]

Norinco JW87's. New but with imperfect finish on them. (http://www.trademe.co.nz/Sports/Hunting-shooting/Shotguns/auction-196358172.htm)

Single shot, lead shot only. Be a fun starter gun but might kick a bit if they're too light. I have no idea how these things rate but I saw them on Tardme and though I might raise general awareness. I'm in Auckland and can pick up and hold one for anyone wanting them (payment ahead of time of course...)

It gives me an excuse to saunter around the toy shop :)

[Mr Merde]

Last Monday, Doc dropped off the book he so very kindly offered to loan to me.

"How to build your own Flintlock Rifle or Pistol"

Needless to say I have found it facinating.

Not a lot of actuall reading but just pouring over the drawings is enough for me.

Paul, thanks very much.

Chris

[Wolf]

Last Monday, Doc dropped off the book he so very kindly offered to loan to me.

"How to build your own Flintlock Rifle or Pistol"

Needless to say I have found it facinating.

Not a lot of actuall reading but just pouring over the drawings is enough for me.

Paul, thanks very much.

Chris
Author, publisher and ISBN please, that sounds like something I'd like to own.

[Mr Merde]

Author, publisher and ISBN please, that sounds like something I'd like to own.

"How to build your own flintlock-rifleor pistol"

Jolex Publication

Edited by George lauber.

Will get the ISBN when I get home.

Has abot 20 pages of instructions and then just drawings. Most to scale.

Fascinating.

Goes really well with a video I have on building a Kentucky rifle, and about 5 other videos of this ilk.

[Wolf]

"How to build your own flintlock-rifleor pistol"

Jolex Publication

Edited by George lauber.

Will get the ISBN when I get home.

Has abot 20 pages of instructions and then just drawings. Most to scale.

Fascinating.

Goes really well with a video I have on building a Kentucky rifle, and about 5 other videos of this ilk.
Found it, thanks. A number of copies from various on-line shops

[Mr Merde]

Found it, thanks. A number of copies from various on-line shops

I'll have to figure out a way to get all these videos copied from tape to disc.

They are very instructional and well presented.

You can have a copy when I can do this.

Any one else interested, let me know.

Engraving, gunstock carving, rifle making, powder horn making, etc.

All old style stuff.

Chris

[Wolf]

I'll have to figure out a way to get all these videos copied from tape to disc.
You could probably do it yourself if you had a TV-tuner card for your computer - hook the VHS up to the card's RF-in, play the video while you record to hard disc using the software, then burn the resultant file to disc.

[ManDownUnder]

So my 270 WSM delivers 3200 ft.lbs of energy at the muzzle (for a given projectile at a given speed)

So given that:
1) a foot pound is "One foot-pound force is the amount of energy expended when a force of one pound (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pound-force) acts through a distance of one foot (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foot_(length)) along the direction of the force" (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foot_pounds)

and
2) Every force has an equal and opposite...

Why doesn't the launch of a projectile with 3200 ft lbs of energy simply remove my right arm at the shoulder?

... no - I don't have the answer - this is no trick - it came up here at work and I'm wondering...!

[Mr Merde]

So my 270 WSM delivers 3200 ft.lbs of energy at the muzzle (for a given projectile at a given speed)

So given that:
1) a foot pound is "One foot-pound force is the amount of energy expended when a force of one pound (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pound-force) acts through a distance of one foot (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foot_(length)) along the direction of the force" (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foot_pounds)

and
2) Every force has an equal and opposite...

Why doesn't the launch of a projectile with 3200 ft lbs of energy simply remove my right arm at the shoulder?

... no - I don't have the answer - this is no trick - it came up here at work and I'm wondering...!

Not all of that energy is being directly pushed back into your shoulder. The gasses from the cartridge do not escape in the reverse direction, also if you look at the design of the stock you will see that the shape of such again disperses the energy in a direction other than the reverse of the bullets flight.

There is an outwards expansion in the barrel beit very tiny, and also the barrel does not stay as a straight rod. It actually deforms in a wave pattern of oscilations.

Exterior balistics is a minefield of mathematical calculations.

I have a video at home called "Deadly Weapons"

In it the presenter dons a bullet proof vest and takes a shot from a 7.62 x 51 round from a G3 full in the solar plexus at a distance of 3 fwwt from the muzzle.

A bullet weighing 175 gn at a velocity of 28oofps at a little over a metre.

To add to the scene he is balancing on one foot.

By your logic and according to the movies he should be thown aside by the impact but quite the reverse is true.

He just stands there.

Did you know that an object like a bullet needs to be travelling at a velocity of something like 400fps to penetrate human skin.

Hope this has confused you even more.

Chris

[ManDownUnder]

Hope this has confused you even more.

Chris

Would it be improper to swear at you now - or should i save it for a face to face meeting?

LOL... thanks - I think...

... I need my "WTF" stamp...

[Mr Merde]

Would it be improper to swear at you now - or should i save it for a face to face meeting?

LOL... thanks - I think...

... I need my "WTF" stamp...


I'll take all the abuse you can throw at me, written, oral or in gesture. Here on KB or face to face.


Sure beats "self abuse" does it not.


I sure like to obfuscate the issue

[ManDownUnder]

Sure beats "self abuse" does it not.

Nothing wrong with onanism! Just ask any married man!

[Mr Merde]

Nothing wrong with onanism! Just ask any married man!


Ah the "Art of Onan" didnt Mark Twain write a book on that facinating subject?




For you reading pleasure and to further you education and confusion into the dark art of reloading.

http://http://www.exteriorballistics.com/index.cfm

[Indiana_Jones]

Serious shooters in Penrose has a few M44 Mosin-Nagants in stock at $250 a pop.


<Img src="http://mosinnagant.net/images/m44hardlaminateed.jpg">

They also mentioned they are getting a shipment of 91/30 Nagants which are 'sniper copies' i.e. they have fake side mounts and fake PU scopes, but look the bit, no idea on the price yet though, but would be cheaper then Gun city's $599 for a 91/30 I saw on tardme :laugh:

-Indy

[Indiana_Jones]

http://www.huntersparadiseonline.com/duracoatprojects.htm

this guy just killed two Nagants!

-Indy

[Wolf]

http://www.huntersparadiseonline.com/duracoatprojects.htm

this guy just killed two Nagants!

-Indy
A swift death is too good for that bastard, aim for the kneecaps!

[Drunken Monkey]

Not too sure of that. If you look at the methods that were employed for musketry in the late 18th to the early 19th century you can understand his thinking.
...
So looking at these points old Ben's idea wasnt so bad. Arrows were silent. They could be fashioned from local material. They were not too heavy, an archer could easily have the same range as a musket of the time, in light of the tactics used. The hit and run tactics of the militia would have been just as effective if not more so. No powder smoke with which to identify the direction of fire.

This is only my thoughts on the subject.


Chris

Sorry to backtrack a bit, I forgot I was participating in a discussion for a while...

You forget, the firearm rendered armour useless virtually 'overnight'. Plate and chainmail armour are effective arrow stoppers. They don't stop musket balls.

You can also train effective musketeers faster than effective longbowmen. There's been a couple of good docos on NatGeo and History channel over the break about this subject actually. On further answers of economy, the typical musketeer was significantly cheaper to kit out and maintain (although the comparison may have been against heavy infantry and cav, not longbowmen).

Additionally, troops in times which did feature b&a as commonplace, if nto armoured, would have had shields. Many troop formations (e.g. Testudo) are able to see incoming arrow barrages and hide. You can't see incoming musket balls.

Given some of those points you listed above are perfectly valid in some situations, the reality is if it was a sensible solution, it would have been adopted more readily...

[Mr Merde]

Sorry to backtrack a bit, I forgot I was participating in a discussion for a while...

You forget, the firearm rendered armour useless virtually 'overnight'. Plate and chainmail armour are effective arrow stoppers. They don't stop musket balls.

You can also train effective musketeers faster than effective longbowmen. There's been a couple of good docos on NatGeo and History channel over the break about this subject actually. On further answers of economy, the typical musketeer was significantly cheaper to kit out and maintain (although the comparison may have been against heavy infantry and cav, not longbowmen).

Additionally, troops in times which did feature b&a as commonplace, if nto armoured, would have had shields. Many troop formations (e.g. Testudo) are able to see incoming arrow barrages and hide. You can't see incoming musket balls.

Given some of those points you listed above are perfectly valid in some situations, the reality is if it was a sensible solution, it would have been adopted more readily...

Points taken.

Reading a lot lately about Agincourt.
5500 archers, 12 arrows each a min, battle lasted 30-40 min,
If the archers only were in action with their bows for half that time then the total number of arrows loosed woulf be 660,000

The French Knights and nobility didnt manage to hide or raise sheilds for that number of arrows. Popular history states that 10,000 of them died in the charge.

As to training I agree with you here. Most of those archers trained from boyhood. It was not so long ago that the law that obliged every male in Wales to practise a certain number of hours a week, with the bow, was recinded. About 60 years ago.

There is another weapon that could have been devistating. Air rifles.

During the Napoleonic wars there was an Imperial edict from Napoleon himself that anyone captured with an air rifle was to be immediately executed. They were that feared. Quiet, rifled, accurate and with a possible range of twice that of the typical infantry musket of the time.

Chris

[Wolf]

Quiet, rifled, accurate and with a possible range of twice that of the typical infantry musket of the time.

Chris
Relatively quiet, compared with a powder blast - and no flames or smoke.

I figure they'd've taken a while to pump up a killing pressure so such a weapon is a deliberate-use, specific-target (aka "assassin's") weapon.

[Mr Merde]

Relatively quiet, compared with a powder blast - and no flames or smoke.

I figure they'd've taken a while to pump up a killing pressure so such a weapon is a deliberate-use, specific-target (aka "assassin's") weapon.


Hence the execution order on anyone caught with one

[Drunken Monkey]

Points taken.

Reading a lot lately about Agincourt.
5500 archers, 12 arrows each a min, battle lasted 30-40 min,
If the archers only were in action with their bows for half that time then the total number of arrows loosed woulf be 660,000

The French Knights and nobility didnt manage to hide or raise sheilds for that number of arrows. Popular history states that 10,000 of them died in the charge.



On Battelfield detectives, they indicate it wasn't the charge that they were killed in as such, but the biggest killer was panic trampling + funnel effect. They used some software used to model panic situations in London tube stations. I won't go into it in too much detail, but it was an interesting postulation.

But otherwise my memory RE: Agincourt in general is hazy, so I'll run with your latest. Only one point to ponder though; armoured knights need not raise shields to defend against arrows, supposedly that's what their armour does?

I think airrifles was done in another thread, or was it just earlier in this thread?

[Drunken Monkey]

a-ha! I need not explain, someone has done it for me:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Agincourt#Terrain

[Wolf]

Hence the execution order on anyone caught with one
I know. I added my fourpence for the benefit of those who might not understand why an air rifle was an executable offence while BP firearms were not.

"Wholesale slaughter of troops in battle, good; surgical assassination of key figures, bad"... funny how it's those most likely to qualify as "key figures" who're most prone to thinking that way.

Most soldiers would probably be quite happy if the enemy devoted more effort to sneaking in assassins, to wipe out specific leaders, than to shooting at the aforesaid soldiers.

[Mr Merde]

On Battelfield detectives, they indicate it wasn't the charge that they were killed in as such, but the biggest killer was panic trampling + funnel effect. They used some software used to model panic situations in London tube stations. I won't go into it in too much detail, but it was an interesting postulation.

But otherwise my memory RE: Agincourt in general is hazy, so I'll run with your latest. Only one point to ponder though; armoured knights need not raise shields to defend against arrows, supposedly that's what their armour does?

I think airrifles was done in another thread, or was it just earlier in this thread?

Debates like this are why I like forums. Sensible, articulate and non confrontational.

Good on you mate for making me use my brain

Chris

[Indiana_Jones]

Indy has done it again.....

:devil2:


<img src="http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=115924&stc=1&d=1231907899">

-Indy

[enigma51]

Indy has done it again.....

:devil2:


-Indy

its an air rifle :gob:

[Magua]

It looks a lot better in person, very nice wood on it,

[Wolf]

Indy has done it again.....
Hope you have a sizeable bathtub, dude, trying to sleep in a shower's fucking uncomfortable.



Assuming, of course, she lets you actually sleep in the house.

Still, the weather report looks OK for sleeping under the stars.

[Indiana_Jones]

its an air rifle :gob:

7.62mm X54R pellets!


-Indy

[Indiana_Jones]

For all Nagant fans out there


<img src="http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=115942&stc=1&d=1231921777">

-Indy

[Swoop]

For all Nagant fans out there
I think a browning would be more appropriate...

A browning M-2!

[Indiana_Jones]

Also I would like to say I got the Nagant from Serious shooters in Penrose and they were very helpful and friendly.

Let me pick a Nagant out (they had about 5 in store) alone without someone over my shoulder, helped me get it set up so I could take it on my bike (gave me and old gun bag!) and when I came back 3 hours later after I noticed the cleaning rod was missing, they gave me one off another rifle :2thumbsup

Highly recommended for customer service.

-Indy

[Wolf]

Sleep well, Indy?

Did you get the lawn or the bathtub?

[Indiana_Jones]

I got the bed :bleh:

-Indy

[Wolf]

I got the bed :bleh:

-Indy
So she hasn't seen the new Nagant, yet. :bleh: back at ya!

[Mr Merde]

So she hasn't seen the new Nagant, yet. :bleh: back at ya!

Most of these have worked for me in the past.
-------------------------

"What new Nagant dear?"

"Thats the old one I just restocked it, dont you remember me telling you I was going to do that?"

"Oh you mean the rifle I am storing for (fill in appropriate name)"
--------------------------------------------------------


Still slept on the couch a few times though. Its hard to explain why I suddenly had 13 pistols and 6 rifles.

[Indiana_Jones]

So she hasn't seen the new Nagant, yet. :bleh: back at ya!

She has! :bleh:

Also she knows I might be grabbing another 91/30 soon. Old man is making up a gun cabinet at the moment :banana:


Most of these have worked for me in the past.
-------------------------

"What new Nagant dear?"

"Thats the old one I just restocked it, dont you remember me telling you I was going to do that?"

"Oh you mean the rifle I am storing for (fill in appropriate name)"
--------------------------------------------------------


Still slept on the couch a few times though. Its hard to explain why I suddenly had 13 pistols and 6 rifles.

Writes these down....

By the time I get over 10 Nagants, she won't have a clue lol

-Indy

[Wolf]

Its hard to explain why I suddenly had 13 pistols and 6 rifles.
And a 13-pistols-and-6-rifles-sized hole in the bank account...

[Mr Merde]

And a 13-pistols-and-6-rifles-sized hole in the bank account...

11 years working for Bass Charrington. Every year an issue of staff shares in the company. After 3 years I was able to sell them. So once a year I sold 500UKP worth of shares in Bass and bought a new toy.

The missus never clicked because the dividends from those share was a pittance.

[Indiana_Jones]

Crafty mate, crafty

-Indy

[Mr Merde]

Crafty mate, crafty

-Indy

You have to be or you finish up with a house full of girlie stuff and find that your important equipment, such as reloading presses, has been relegated to a cupboard somewhere under a pile of cushions and linen.

[Indiana_Jones]

Ah Rifles, how I love you

-Indy

[Curious_AJ]

Ah Rifles, how I love you

-Indy

hey you! as for getting a new gun..... fine, but I also expect you to NOT complain that we're not saving enough money after you've bough the gun... as for ALL the guns... from now on you clean them outside ^^ no more shit all over the bed! and floor and couch for the dog to lick up!

lol...

[Wolf]

hey you! as for getting a new gun..... fine, but I also expect you to NOT complain that we're not saving enough money after you've bough the gun... as for ALL the guns... from now on you clean them outside ^^ no more shit all over the bed! and floor and couch for the dog to lick up!

lol...
Lighten up, AJ, every amateur gunsmith knows that the best place to steam dents out of wood and scald the metal for blueing is in the kitchen with ready access to both water and the electric jug.

Besides, the smell of linseed oil gives a certain rustic atmosphere to the room...

[Swoop]

...from now on you clean them outside ^^ no more shit all over the bed! and floor and couch for the dog to lick up.
Oh dear Indy.

"It" has started...
Best get the new safe bolted into the living room as a "discussion piece"!:clap:

[Mr Merde]

hey you! as for getting a new gun..... fine, but I also expect you to NOT complain that we're not saving enough money after you've bough the gun... as for ALL the guns... from now on you clean them outside ^^ no more shit all over the bed! and floor and couch for the dog to lick up!

lol...

Oh dear Indy, your master has spoken.

Head down arse up and take it like you should.


GROVEL

[Mr Merde]

Indy has gone real quiet.

He has been e-mailing me at work quite frequently for the past week.

Suddenly he has gone. No e-mails and no posts.

AJ you havent put the fear of god into him have you.?

[Wolf]

Indy has gone real quiet.

He has been e-mailing me at work quite frequently for the past week.

Suddenly he has gone. No e-mails and no posts.

AJ you havent put the fear of god into him have you.?
The dog kennel does not have a phone line to plug a modem into...

[Indiana_Jones]

Fear not.

I am safe.

Was in a meeting at work.

:)

-Indy

[ManDownUnder]

Fear not.

I am safe.

Was in a meeting at work.

:)

-Indy

She an animal lover man - treat her little furry nicely critter and you'll be sweet

[Indiana_Jones]

She an animal lover man - treat her little furry nicely critter and you'll be sweet

I love our little Charlie!

-Indy

[enigma51]

I love our little Charlie!

-Indy

I dont think thats furry he was talking about :whistle:

[ManDownUnder]

make like a hot dog and insert a stick...

[Indiana_Jones]

I dont think thats furry he was talking about :whistle:

But that's it's name!

-Indy

[Mr Merde]

Indy I have the perfect signature for you

"Memries,
Like the corners of my mind
Misty water-colored memories
Of the way we were...."


Cos thats all you are going to have left once her indoors has read all this

[Indiana_Jones]

Why can't you guys help a nigger? lol

-Indy

[ManDownUnder]

Why can't you guys help a nigger? lol

-Indy

HELL NO!

I have no intention of being shot at as well...

[Curious_AJ]

I love our little Charlie!

-Indy
OUR???? Indy... it's MY dog.. get your own.

Indy I have the perfect signature for you

"Memries,
Like the corners of my mind
Misty water-colored memories
Of the way we were...."


Cos thats all you are going to have left once her indoors has read all this
haha... damned right!


HELL NO!

I have no intention of being shot at as well...

good answer...

now where's a gun.....

[Wolf]

now where's a gun.....
Indy didn't show you where he keeps 'em?

Top marks, that man.

[Mr Merde]

Indy didn't show you where he keeps 'em?

Top marks, that man.

I'm guessing that Indy did show her where he kept them but now they are sequestered in an entirely differentr location.

One where the sun doesnt shine.

[ManDownUnder]

I'm guessing that Indy did show her where he kept them but now they are sequestered in an entirely differentr location.

One where the sun doesnt shine.

A change of handle may be in order for Indy then - perhaps along the lines of Merde Jr?

[Mr Merde]

I have a Bonehill Hammer shotgun that is as tight as a drum.

It did have a problem with a loose fit of the barrels to the receiver but I fixed that.

Now the only thing that I need to fix is the top rib.

Its broken just ahead of the chambers and rattles about.

I have tried to set it with plastic metal cement etc but it doesnt want to stay joined.

Can anyone suggest a method of fixing this rib.

I'm hoping to use this shotgun in competition Aniversay weekend.

I'm guessing that soldering would be the best answer but I dont have a soldering iron, solder or enough expeience to do the job.

[Indiana_Jones]

Should get the cosmoline off my M44 sometime, no rush though, will give me something to do next month.

-Indy

[Indiana_Jones]

http://www.trademe.co.nz/Sports/Hunting-shooting/Rifles/auction-198160994.htm

This guy has a $1 reserve for a 1902 Long Tom in pretty much original condition.

Also has other $1 auctions, saw a 7mm 1900 Mauser

-Indy

[Wolf]

Had a great time out at Chateau Merde (aka The Onewhero Gun Club) yesterday. Took my young cub, the .22 and a couple of shotties out.

Had a great time and learned heaps of tips 'n' tricks.

Chris checked out my old hammer action shottie, gave it a serious going-over with Ballistol and pronounced it "safe to fire" (and definitely "black powder only") then kindly supplied a couple of black powder shells to put through it.

My oldest cub (aged 6) got to fire a shot with the Mossberg 12ga and definitely enjoyed that.

Caught up with Harry and learned heaps about muzzle loaders.

All in all, a damned good day.

Cheers once again for the hospitality, Chris.

Hope your wife's foot is getting better.

[ManDownUnder]

I'm guessing that soldering would be the best answer but I dont have a soldering iron, solder or enough expeience to do the job.

I expect soldering would be the way to go... but you'll need to heat both the barrel and the top rib till they are hot enough to melt the solder so it bonds with both (it's not actually "metal glue" as many think - it needs to form a bond with the base metal to form a strong joint).

You'd need a gas torch or similar - a soldering iron won't have enough output to heat the metals being soldered... but I'd be worried about it tempering and softening the barrel (obviously a bad thing) or burning the carbon out of it if you're not careful.

I know the theory - been so long I wouldn't do a good job though.

[The Pastor]

ok boys, i have a contact for $120 slabs(250 rounds) of number 4 shottie ammo.

If we can order 20 slabs of it, we might be able to get it cheaper. (mate buys it currently at $120/box for 20 slabs - with an extra 20 slabs we might be able to get it for $100 a box)

if you're keen let me know - if you can find cheaper ammo also let me know ;)

[Indiana_Jones]

Once again reloaders are no joy to me.

At least they had the bloody gun in this time, but when I asked to choose one (they have 50) the guy goes "oh I can only get 2 more, no more then"

But at least there was a nice 1939 one, crown looked nice etc, so I grabbed it.

Had a 1933 hex receiver, but the barrel was pretty worn out.

ahwell. Still got one :D

EDIT: No 1938, it's 1939

-Indy

[Mr Merde]

Once again reloaders are no joy to me.

At least they had the bloody gun in this time, but when I asked to choose one (they have 50) the guy goes "oh I can only get 2 more, no more then"

But at least there was a nice 1938 one, crown looked nice etc, so I grabbed it.

Had a 1933 hex receiver, but the barrel was pretty worn out.

ahwell. Still got one :D

-Indy

Have you won the lotto then?

Thats your 3rd new old rifle in as many months.

AJ please note I am thoroughly disapproving



Good on you INDY

Chris

[Indiana_Jones]

Have you won the lotto then?

Thats your 3rd new old rifle in as many months.

AJ please note I am thoroughly disapproving



Good on you INDY

Chris

But my last for a wee while.

Just wanted to round off my Mosin's

-Indy

[ManDownUnder]

ok boys, i have a contact for $120 slabs(250 rounds) of number 4 shottie ammo.

Sounds good - what is it? (make? lead? 36g?)

[ManDownUnder]

As you do - you buy a bag of projectiles reloading one's own ammo... and you reach for the books to get the Cartridge Overall Length (COL or COAL depending on who you talk to...)

... and it's not in the book... so - no probs says I, I email Mr Remington.
"I have a packet of 270 cal 130gr core-lokt psp projectiles (22744XC) but can't find reloading information confirming the Cartridge Overall Length (COAL). Any help appreciated"

The response...
"Unfortunately we don't publish data for the loading of the projectiles we release. Load data for a comparable bullet will suffice when looking for a COAL to work with however."

So... did I miss something here or do I just have a reasonable guess at it, ignoring all the advice I've read thus far about bullet seating depth being very important... ???... where's my "WTF" stamp???

[Indiana_Jones]

Well Chris wil be able to answer,

but in theory (well what I can guess), bullet depth into the case will no little/no difference, as long as the grain etc is loaded right etc?

I'm sure I will be corrected

-Indy

[Indiana_Jones]

There we go :D

Next I will have to find a Tula made one and a hex receiver oh and an M38

-Indy

[The Pastor]

Sounds good - what is it? (make? lead? 36g?)
falcon sp high power 36 gram lead shot

[AD345]

I don't know much about firearms

I'm not wild about them anyway

But...


THIS is cool.

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[sAsLEX]

No comments so I guess I'm off on a tangent to NZ thinking here.



Try http://www.fishnhunt.co.nz/forum/YaBB.cgi for some more gun talk!


Ahh ten pages of reading on this thread after a short holiday to the SI, lots of racing seen but no rifle taken regrettably.

Flights are booked for two weeks of roar hunting in early April though!

Must get the .308 properly dialled in before then........ or maybe the Winchester....



THIS is cool.



R+.

[pritch]

"I have a packet of 270 cal 130gr core-lokt psp projectiles (22744XC) but can't find reloading information confirming the Cartridge Overall Length (COAL). Any help appreciated"


Guess that's what you get for buying brand X components... :whistle:

Hornady manual gives 3.275" for their 130 gr spire point
Sierra quote 3.300" for their 130gr Spitzer boat tail.

Those are fairly close, the Lyman manual quotes what appears a hollow point so the measurement is shorter @ 3.210"

Seating depth away from those figures will affect pressure.

You really need to work out the correct seating depth for your own rifle. The powder loads need to be adjusted accordingly.

[The Pastor]

here is my new old side by side, anyone know anything about it? I payed $200 for it, (also $200 for the stoger p350 pump above it) off TM but owner didnt know much about it.

[Mr Merde]

As you do - you buy a bag of projectiles reloading one's own ammo... and you reach for the books to get the Cartridge Overall Length (COL or COAL depending on who you talk to...)

... and it's not in the book... so - no probs says I, I email Mr Remington.
"I have a packet of 270 cal 130gr core-lokt psp projectiles (22744XC) but can't find reloading information confirming the Cartridge Overall Length (COAL). Any help appreciated"

The response...
"Unfortunately we don't publish data for the loading of the projectiles we release. Load data for a comparable bullet will suffice when looking for a COAL to work with however."

So... did I miss something here or do I just have a reasonable guess at it, ignoring all the advice I've read thus far about bullet seating depth being very important... ???... where's my "WTF" stamp???

Overall length is an important factor in reloading but is not that hard to work out.

What is really important is headspace.

How I have always found out the OAL for all the wildcat cartridges and most of my common calibres is the following;

Resize a case
Dont prime it and dont put powder in the case.

Run you bullet seating die out so that it is just seating the bullet in the case with only just enough tension in the neck to hole the bullet firm

Seat a bullet in the case. It should be way over sized now.

Take that "dummy" round and chamber it. (gently)

This will make the bullet catch on the rifling and push back into the case.

This will give you a bore riding length.

I then set my die to seat at this length plus an wxtra 1-2 mm,

Upon firing the bullet will have this little jump to the rifling.

Your OAL should be for this bullet, set.

Chris

[pritch]

I then set my die to seat at this length plus an wxtra 1-2 mm,
Upon firing the bullet will have this little jump to the rifling.
Chris

That's the only bit I would wish to ummm discuss?

I wouldn't have been game enough to type that anyway. I thought about it, but had decided that I don't trust my tryping (two fingers, search and destroy) sufficiently to give loading instructions to someone I don't know.

A compromise might be to photocopy the relevant pages. Really though, anyone contemplating reloading should have at least one reputable manual.
Then again I can't convince my clubmates of that so why should I try here?

Tight groups :apint:

[Mr Merde]

That's the only bit I would wish to ummm discuss?

I wouldn't have been game enough to type that anyway. I thought about it, but had decided that I don't trust my tryping (two fingers, search and destroy) sufficiently to give loading instructions to someone I don't know.

A compromise might be to photocopy the relevant pages. Really though, anyone contemplating reloading should have at least one reputable manual.
Then again I can't convince my clubmates of that so why should I try here?

Tight groups :apint:

Hardest part for me is trying to explain something I have done as a matter of course for years.

Trying very hard to get it correct. Walking through the steps in my mind as I was typing, hernce the disjointedness of piece.

I did back it up with a PM to the relative person asking him to contact me directly if he was the least bit unsure of any step.

Yes I agree with having a good reloading book. I have about 20 of the things and still I buy more. I also subscribe to about 6 magazines (NZ and US). You can newver have too much information.

Chris

[Wolf]

Hardest part for me is trying to explain something I have done as a matter of course for years.

Trying very hard to get it correct. Walking through the steps in my mind as I was typing, hernce the disjointedness of piece.

I did back it up with a PM to the relative person asking him to contact me directly if he was the least bit unsure of any step.

Yes I agree with having a good reloading book. I have about 20 of the things and still I buy more. I also subscribe to about 6 magazines (NZ and US). You can newver have too much information.

Chris
Well, it made sense to me and what I know of reloading could be written on a postage stamp.

If I get it aright, it boils down to "let the weapon's chamber size determine how far down the projectile needs to be seated then push it down one or two mm more to allow a margin of error."

It seemed perfectly logical to me.

[Mr Merde]

Well, it made sense to me and what I know of reloading could be written on a postage stamp.

If I get it aright, it boils down to "let the weapon's chamber size determine how far down the projectile needs to be seated then push it down one or two mm more to allow a margin of error."

It seemed perfectly logical to me.

Thats about the gist of it but there are other considerations.

Some barrels handle seating differently.

I know in LRBP some shooters seat the bullet to the rifling whilst others have found that that small leade is better.

Playing with bullet seating is getting into the more advanced reloading skills. You should be very carefull and keep records.

Basic reloading is quite a simple skill to aquire but un fortunatewly it is a very addictive skill and I have found myself wanting more and more from it.

last night I put together 150 12 gauge shotgun shells.

I then proceeded to cast 200 .44 mag 205 gn bullets from a mixture od lead and tin 20:1. lubed them last night and tonight I will be loading them ready to fire this weekend.

[ManDownUnder]

That's the only bit I would wish to ummm discuss?

I wouldn't have been game enough to type that anyway. I thought about it, but had decided that I don't trust my tryping (two fingers, search and destroy) sufficiently to give loading instructions to someone I don't know.



I get the feeling I need to say up front - I'm new to reloading - and I know it. I'm also a safety chicken so am erring on the side of caution, checking and double checking everything. I also happen to be loving it!

For the sake of completing the conversation (occurring in public anyway)... I have the Hornady manual and am reading tons on reloading, starting with a small charge (per the reloading manual), 130gr Hornady SST bullets, Winchester brass, and am currently dialling in the 270 WSM on a totally consistent standard load.

The only variables from round to round are the imperfect chambering of the brass (which are being fire formed as I work my way through the first batch of 20), and the primers that came pre-installed into the brass when I bought it off Trademe.

As a fitter... I have the gear to measure the brass etc... even bought me a 2-3" micrometer for that very reason (nice to buy toys huh?) and I'm working at getting familiar with the rifle, scope setup, fire forming the brass and will work towards developing loads for the beastie. To that end I bought the Remington projectiles off Trademe fully expecting to simply find the COAL data, load up 10 or so of those at low power, development loads, and see how they go... working my way up through both the COAL in 5 thou increments as one book suggested, and THEN adjusting the powder to best suit that COAL. (commentary on that approach is VERY welcome)

It should be noted I have load data for 130gr projectiles from the Hornady manual, and keeping an eye on the various high pressure indicators... which I expect to be well short of - and thus far I see no problems.

My problem came after I bought the Remington projectiles - I couldn't find 270 WSM COAL data... anywhere... and have to admit I expected to just find it. I know that I don't know enough to work it out for myself (well - I didn't till a couple of kind PMs came through - cheers guys) but I'm still reluctant to just do that myself due to potential overpressure situations.

Chris - I'll probably hit you up for some one on one tuition at some point re this.

At the mo - I've shot 5 rounds through the thing - shoot and CLEAN LIKE HELL. Fouling has noticeably reduced so now I'm onto the 3 round cycle which I will probably repeat, then the 5 round one and the barrel will be broken in, and reasonably zeroed for 200m (I say reasonably because I'm new to reloading so I don't expect the rounds to be wonderfully consistent, and I only have a 100m range to shoot and am estimating projectile speed - and therefore have to rely on a guesstimate on how high they should be flying at 100m

Hope that clarifies a few things? Pritch, Mr Merde - cheers guys - I appreciate your caution on this and your PMs. I'm in the same boat re safety and am painfully aware of me doing this in isolation at the mo.

I made an initial batch of 20 rounds (recipe per a previous post of mine), and when I'm through those I'll be seeking some personal advice re COAL for the Remington projectiles, and general wisdom on load development. Ultimately I want loads that can reliably drop goats and deer. Learning reloading along the way is just a bonus! Any pointers and all cautions appreciated.

[ManDownUnder]

Only have an air pistol, Wouldn't mind owning a few ww2 era rifles. :)

-Indy

Just found this. AJ - can't say you weren't warned...

[Swoop]

The discussion on the "gap between projectile and lands" will occupy a group of shooters for ohhhhhh an evening (perhaps longer!).

Also beware of the under-loaded case. Too little powder is also "a bad thing".

[Wolf]

The discussion on the "gap between projectile and lands" will occupy a group of shooters for ohhhhhh an evening (perhaps longer!).

Also beware of the under-loaded case. Too little powder is also "a bad thing".
Especially if immediately followed by "any powder at all".

[Mr Merde]

The discussion on the "gap between projectile and lands" will occupy a group of shooters for ohhhhhh an evening (perhaps longer!).

Also beware of the under-loaded case. Too little powder is also "a bad thing".
Seen revolvers with the topstrap blown away caused by firing rounds with too little powder in the case.

Acts like a small handheld bomb in this case